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View Full Version : The broke United States has sent Egypt $60 million so far this year



pwaldo
10-07-2011, 08:57 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/u-paid-price-egypt-030400193.html


The United States has provided $60 million for democratic transition in Egypt since Mubarak’s fall from power in February. Some of that money goes toward technical election training like platform writing, election law, and other programs aimed at building a democratic civil society.

coltsnbolts
10-07-2011, 09:13 PM
They do these things quite often, especially if it is a poorer region of the world. The U.S. has given billions of dollars to African nations for economic development without any results to show for.

habsheaven
10-07-2011, 09:46 PM
You have to be careful how you judge assistance like this. Although positive results may not be all that visable, the current situation in these countries would probably be much worse without the aid. Much like opponents of the stimulus bill claiming it hasn't got the desired results, it unquestionably would be a lot worse if there was no stimulus at all.

andrewhoya
10-08-2011, 07:29 AM
So.... Does this really mean that China and other countries gave Egypt 60 million?...

AUTaxMan
10-08-2011, 10:00 AM
I think it's called paying tribute.

duane1969
10-09-2011, 01:09 PM
Considering the state of our economy, our unemplyment rate, immigration issues, homeless issues, drug problems, our military involved in multiple conflicts, government in disarray and on the verge of bankruptcy...shouldn't somebody be sending us aid??...

Rybowski
10-09-2011, 08:35 PM
$60 million, that is just pocket change right, haha!

theonedru
10-09-2011, 10:24 PM
The government prob wastes and or squanders more than that in a day.

Hilfiger1975
10-09-2011, 10:27 PM
America has been doing this for years! We have homeless in America and how the economy and unemployment is and we constantly send money to other countries yearly...America the beautiful...

andrewhoya
10-09-2011, 10:58 PM
America has been doing this for years! We have homeless in America and how the economy and unemployment is and we constantly send money to other countries yearly...America the beautiful...

Our homeless rates are nothing compared to other countries......

Hilfiger1975
10-09-2011, 11:00 PM
Our homeless rates are nothing compared to other countries......
Take care of your own citizens before you worry about another countries citizens...MAYBE we wouldn't have homeless period, if we actually spent 60 million to help our own homeless, you think? But how would that be in America's best interest, huh? But i'm sure other countries donate to America on a daily basis...:winking0071:

andrewhoya
10-09-2011, 11:01 PM
Take care of your own citizens before you worry about another countries citizens...but i'm sure other countries donate to America on a daily basis...:winking0071:

Imagine a world where everyone did stuff for their own good and did not help anyone else.

Hilfiger1975
10-09-2011, 11:04 PM
Imagine a world where everyone did stuff for their own good and did not help anyone else.
Be sure to remember that when the holidays come and there is homeless on the streets of America and you get your presents from mommy and daddy for the holidays...:winking0071:

andrewhoya
10-09-2011, 11:05 PM
Be sure to remember that when the holidays come and there is homeless on the streets of America and you get your presents from mommy and daddy for the holidays...:winking0071:

Which are gift cards that are donated to shelters in the DC area..........

Hilfiger1975
10-09-2011, 11:06 PM
Which are gift cards that are donated to shelters in the DC area..........
I believe you, honestly i do...:thumb:

indyreds
10-10-2011, 01:03 AM
Another Democratic country in that region helps us in many ways. Building allies and helping foster democracy is done better with a financial little aid than with bodies and bullets.

theonedru
10-10-2011, 01:07 AM
Another Democratic country in that region helps us in many ways. Building allies and helping foster democracy is done better with a financial little aid than with bodies and bullets.

Look around, democracy doesn't work, if it did we would not be on the brink of economic collapse

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 01:28 AM
Look around, democracy doesn't work, if it did we would not be on the brink of economic collapse

We are not a democracy.

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 01:29 AM
Another Democratic country in that region helps us in many ways. Building allies and helping foster democracy is done better with a financial little aid than with bodies and bullets.

They will not be a democracy. They will be run by the Muslim Brotherhood.

theonedru
10-10-2011, 01:34 AM
They will not be a democracy. They will be run by the Muslim Brotherhood.

Thats nothing more than speculative fear mongering, leave that for the government and give us a more palpable argument.

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 01:36 AM
Thats nothing more than speculative fear mongering, leave that for the government and give us a more palpable argument.

They had to postpone the elections in Egypt because the Muslim Brotherhood was projected to end up the controlling party. That is not fear mongering. It is fact.

Theodor Madison
10-10-2011, 02:01 AM
The US is always trying to buy friendship. We should know better, no matter what we do, we will not make friends with money.

Hilfiger1975
10-10-2011, 02:39 AM
the us is always trying to buy friendship. We should know better, no matter what we do, we will not make friends with money.
+1

duane1969
10-10-2011, 09:47 AM
Imagine a world where everyone did stuff for their own good and did not help anyone else.

I get your point but I get his too and support his moreso.

Why send hundreds of millions to foreign countries full of people who either hate us or don't trust us when we have veterans and senior citizens living on the streets of every major city in America? It is not selfish to take care of our own people before we take care of others.

Would you allow your family or friends to go hungry while you fed total strangers? Of course not.

Hilfiger1975
10-10-2011, 09:49 AM
I get your point but I get his too and support his moreso.

Why send hundreds of millions to foreign countries full of people who either hate us or don't trust us when we have veterans and senior citizens living on the streets of every major city in America? It is not selfish to take care of our own people before we take care of others.

Would you allow your family or friends to go hungry while you fed total strangers? Of course not.
Thank you...

duane1969
10-10-2011, 09:54 AM
Look around, democracy doesn't work, if it did we would not be on the brink of economic collapse


We are not a democracy.

As AUTaxMan said, we are not a democracy. If we were a true democracy then the people would vote on things like raising the government spending limit, health care reform, tax increases, etc. As it is now, the people have no voice in our government.

IMO we are more of a police state than anything.

andrewhoya
10-10-2011, 11:17 AM
I get your point but I get his too and support his moreso.

Why send hundreds of millions to foreign countries full of people who either hate us or don't trust us when we have veterans and senior citizens living on the streets of every major city in America? It is not selfish to take care of our own people before we take care of others.

Would you allow your family or friends to go hungry while you fed total strangers? Of course not.

Those homeless in America have it much better than those in Egypt and other countries. How about we focus o improving both?

Hilfiger1975
10-10-2011, 11:23 AM
Those homeless in America have it much better than those in Egypt and other countries. How about we focus o improving both?
Great opinion! Since we are ranking homeless and all, shouldn't Africa get 60 million dollars before Egypt?

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 12:02 PM
As AUTaxMan said, we are not a democracy. If we were a true democracy then the people would vote on things like raising the government spending limit, health care reform, tax increases, etc. As it is now, the people have no voice in our government.

IMO we are more of a police state than anything.

True democracies do not work, because once the people figure out that they can vote to line their own pockets with the government coffers, all bets are off. We are a representative republic, and the system has proven to work as long as we aren't spending more money than we are bringing in. The problem is that entitlements, largely put in place by big government politicians and labor unions, have this country in the red. the people do have a voice in government. I feel that my representatives are in line with my interests and vote accordingly.

andrewhoya
10-10-2011, 12:16 PM
Great opinion! Since we are ranking homeless and all, shouldn't Africa get 60 million dollars before Egypt?

1. Not an opinion
2. Egypt is in Africa.... So I'm not sure what that last part means.

pghin08
10-10-2011, 12:51 PM
True democracies do not work, because once the people figure out that they can vote to line their own pockets with the government coffers, all bets are off. We are a representative republic, and the system has proven to work as long as we aren't spending more money than we are bringing in. The problem is that entitlements, largely put in place by big government politicians and labor unions, have this country in the red. the people do have a voice in government. I feel that my representatives are in line with my interests and vote accordingly.

I pretty much agree with this. Though I would add defense spending as part of what has put us in the red to this point.

duane1969
10-10-2011, 01:01 PM
Those homeless in America have it much better than those in Egypt and other countries. How about we focus o improving both?

The problem is the money being sent to Egypt is not for humanitarian aide. It is being used to prop up a government. The people are most likely seeing little to none of the $60 million.


Some of that money goes toward technical election training like platform writing, election law, and other programs aimed at building a democratic civil society.

Even more concerning is this. Apparently some of the funding that we are sending is being used to teach the Muslim Brotherhood how to get elected.


A U.S. official told The Daily Beast on Tuesday that a “handful” of members of the Muslim Brotherhood have “availed themselves of programs” funded by the United States for election training.

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 01:01 PM
I pretty much agree with this. Though I would add defense spending as part of what has put us in the red to this point.

Defense spending is a drop in the bucket, although there is significant waste there.

pghin08
10-10-2011, 01:13 PM
Defense spending is a drop in the bucket, although there is significant waste there.

No it isn't. Defense spending accounts for about 20% of our yearly budget, which is right around the same as Medicare/Medicaid and Social Security. Now, I'll grant you, it's plainly apparent that in the coming years and decades, Medicare/Medicaid and SS will grow to be larger than the defense budget by a more significant margin, but it isn't right now.

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 01:14 PM
No it isn't. Defense spending accounts for about 20% of our yearly budget, which is right around the same as Medicare/Medicaid and Social Security. Now, I'll grant you, it's plainly apparent that in the coming years and decades, Medicare/Medicaid and SS will grow to be larger than the defense budget by a more significant margin, but it isn't right now.

That's what I was referring to. Cuts to defense spending aren't going to make a dent in the budget. The problem prospectively is the entitlements.

andrewhoya
10-10-2011, 01:18 PM
The problem is the money being sent to Egypt is not for humanitarian aide. It is being used to prop up a government. The people are most likely seeing little to none of the $60 million.



Even more concerning is this. Apparently some of the funding that we are sending is being used to teach the Muslim Brotherhood how to get elected.

My fault. Hopefully the government gets turned around and begins to rise again.

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 01:23 PM
My fault. Hopefully the government gets turned around and begins to rise again.

Recent Egypt happenings:

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/11/world/middleeast/coptics-criticize-egypt-government-over-killings.html

And Egypt's future:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/daniel-wagner/libyas-coming-islamist-go_b_1002570.html

pghin08
10-10-2011, 01:25 PM
That's what I was referring to. Cuts to defense spending aren't going to make a dent in the budget. The problem prospectively is the entitlements.

It'll make a difference, but I agree, it's not the biggest problem.

duane1969
10-10-2011, 01:26 PM
No it isn't. Defense spending accounts for about 20% of our yearly budget, which is right around the same as Medicare/Medicaid and Social Security. Now, I'll grant you, it's plainly apparent that in the coming years and decades, Medicare/Medicaid and SS will grow to be larger than the defense budget by a more significant margin, but it isn't right now.

Not arguing you are wrong, just curious where you got these numbers? I ask because I read an article about 2 months ago that said that around .75 cents of every dollar taken in by the Fed is spent on Medicaid/Medicare/SS/Welfare.

duane1969
10-10-2011, 01:31 PM
Nevermind, I see where the variation comes from.

The US spends about $1.5 trillion a year on welfare/SS/Medicaid/Medicare/etc. The US takes in about $2 trillion in tax dollars. So 75% of what is taken in is spent on those programs.

However....

The US spends about $4 trillion a year making the exspense of those programs (welfare and defense) around 20-25% of what is spent per year per program.

It is just how you look at the numbers...

pghin08
10-10-2011, 01:36 PM
Nevermind, I see where the variation comes from.

The US spends about $1.5 trillion a year on welfare/SS/Medicaid/Medicare/etc. The US takes in about $2 trillion in tax dollars. So 75% of what is taken in is spent on those programs.

However....

The US spends about $4 trillion a year making the exspense of those programs (welfare and defense) around 20-25% of what is spent per year per program.

It is just how you look at the numbers...


Agreed. No matter how you cut it though, defense is a significant expenditure. However, and this is where the SCF conservatives and I will always agree, if we're going to really cut at the teeth of our debt problem, we have to have entitlement cuts. Government needs to say, "Hey, we're sorry, we made you promises but we won't be able to keep them all. We're in this boat together, and we've got to make things better for the generations behind us".

Fat chance that ever happens, but I can dream :pray:

andrewhoya
10-10-2011, 01:41 PM
And Egypt's future:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/daniel-wagner/libyas-coming-islamist-go_b_1002570.html

In regards to this article, you can't consider this Egypt's future until it actually happens.

duane1969
10-10-2011, 01:54 PM
Agreed. No matter how you cut it though, defense is a significant expenditure. However, and this is where the SCF conservatives and I will always agree, if we're going to really cut at the teeth of our debt problem, we have to have entitlement cuts. Government needs to say, "Hey, we're sorry, we made you promises but we won't be able to keep them all. We're in this boat together, and we've got to make things better for the generations behind us".

Fat chance that ever happens, but I can dream :pray:

Personally, I support a 25% cut across the boards for everything but education and infrastructure.

I support a 100% cut of all foreign aid until our own economic woes are dealt with.

Hilfiger1975
10-10-2011, 01:58 PM
personally, i support a 25% cut across the boards for everything but education and infrastructure.

i support a 100% cut of all foreign aid until our own economic woes are dealt with.
+1

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 02:02 PM
In regards to this article, you can't consider this Egypt's future until it actually happens.

How is Egypt any different?

pghin08
10-10-2011, 02:04 PM
Personally, I support a 25% cut across the boards for everything but education and infrastructure.

I support a 100% cut of all foreign aid until our own economic woes are dealt with.

Interwebz hugz :hug:


Edit: Even Israel? How would that go over?

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 02:12 PM
Personally, I support a 25% cut across the boards for everything but education and infrastructure.

I support a 100% cut of all foreign aid until our own economic woes are dealt with.

Yes, because clearly we are doing a bang-up job with our education spending.

Hilfiger1975
10-10-2011, 02:14 PM
Yes, because clearly we are doing a bang-up job with our education spending.
:):

sanfran22
10-10-2011, 02:19 PM
I'd cut the whole education dept, but that's a different subject. I wouldn't cut too much from defense. Just tighten it up. Foreign aid needs to stop and be re-evaluated on a case by case basis.......

AUTaxMan
10-10-2011, 02:21 PM
I'd cut the whole education dept, but that's a different subject. I wouldn't cut too much from defense. Just tighten it up. Foreign aid needs to stop and be re-evaluated on a case by case basis.......

We need to disband both the department of education and the department of energy. Both were introduced by Jimmy Carter, and neither have accomplished anything of note in 30 years, other than to hemorrhage money.

duane1969
10-10-2011, 08:57 PM
Interwebz hugz :hug:


Edit: Even Israel? How would that go over?

Israel too. Everybody comes off of the teat cold turkey. Israel will be fine. We just need to hand them the keys to the nukes we have stashed over there and not be too secretive about the fact that they have them.


Yes, because clearly we are doing a bang-up job with our education spending.

Well perhaps better directed funding would help? Teacher salaries are a big issue IMO. It is hard to convince a fresh college graduate to turn down a job as a WalMart managment trainee making $50k a year to be a teacher for $32k a year. There was a time, not too long ago, that being a teacher was the most prestigious and one of the highest paid positions in this country. Now people become teachers because they can't get a job in the field that their degree is in.

Also teacher ages are an issue. Just in my area about 70% of the current teachers are at or beyond retirement age. Expecting someone who got their college degree 20 years before the invention of the digital calculator to be a successful teacher using modern technology and 21st century learning techniques is a pipe dream.

pghin08
10-10-2011, 10:59 PM
Israel too. Everybody comes off of the teat cold turkey. Israel will be fine. We just need to hand them the keys to the nukes we have stashed over there and not be too secretive about the fact that they have them.



Well perhaps better directed funding would help? Teacher salaries are a big issue IMO. It is hard to convince a fresh college graduate to turn down a job as a WalMart managment trainee making $50k a year to be a teacher for $32k a year. There was a time, not too long ago, that being a teacher was the most prestigious and one of the highest paid positions in this country. Now people become teachers because they can't get a job in the field that their degree is in.

Also teacher ages are an issue. Just in my area about 70% of the current teachers are at or beyond retirement age. Expecting someone who got their college degree 20 years before the invention of the digital calculator to be a successful teacher using modern technology and 21st century learning techniques is a pipe dream.

Oh I think Israel would be just fine. But the fact is, if we stop our aid to Israel (which is the biggest recipient of US aid, I think. I may be making that up), we alienate our Jewish population and basically hand a win over to the Palestinians. The fact is that we've aligned ourselves way too close w/ Israel, and I don't think cutting off aid is realistic right now.