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View Full Version : Georgia factory worker fired for refusing to wear 666



mrveggieman
11-18-2011, 05:06 PM
http://www.myfoxatlanta.com/dpp/news/local_news/Lawsuit%3A-Ga.-Man-Fired-for-Refusing-to-Wear-%27666%27-20111118-ap-sd

theonedru
11-18-2011, 06:49 PM
Since numbers have no beginning nor ending they are but concepts and as such just empty soulless creatures relating to nothing.

duwal
11-18-2011, 07:35 PM
"Hyatt says in the lawsuit that he's a devout Christian. He says that wearing the number would be to accept the mark of the beast and to be condemned to hell."

noooo, wearing the numbered uniform means you are accepting a paycheck

duane1969
11-18-2011, 07:42 PM
Seems like a reasonable concern to me. If an Islamic person refused to wear a pig sticker or if a Hindu person refused to wear a sticker of a cheeseburger they wouldn't be fired. Why should the Christian be expected to ignore his religious beliefs?

DunkingDurant35
11-18-2011, 08:16 PM
In the Bible, Solomon got 666 talents of gold in revenue one year, too, and he didn't freak out about it, so methinks this fellow is reading a bit too much into things.

ensbergcollector
11-18-2011, 10:27 PM
In the Bible, Solomon got 666 talents of gold in revenue one year, too, and he didn't freak out about it, so methinks this fellow is reading a bit too much into things.

doesn't really apply since solomon was hundreds if not thousands of years before revelation was written.

INTIMADATOR2007
11-18-2011, 11:19 PM
Seems like a reasonable concern to me. If an Islamic person refused to wear a pig sticker or if a Hindu person refused to wear a sticker of a cheeseburger they wouldn't be fired. Why should the Christian be expected to ignore his religious beliefs?
They would probably file a lawsuit and Congress would immediatly pass a law banning any such practice .But let a christian stand for his religion and its an outrage .

DunkingDurant35
11-19-2011, 12:07 PM
doesn't really apply since solomon was hundreds if not thousands of years before revelation was written.

Yes it does, because it shows how the number is only important when it pertains to latter day buying and selling, and specifically as it is taken on the right hand or forehead as a symbol. This situation does not fit - we are talking about a sticker here that was celebrating the number of days without a factory incident.

ensbergcollector
11-19-2011, 12:23 PM
Yes it does, because it shows how the number is only important when it pertains to latter day buying and selling, and specifically as it is taken on the right hand or forehead as a symbol. This situation does not fit - we are talking about a sticker here that was celebrating the number of days without a factory incident.

king david committed adultery and murder, should be we ok with that too? There was no issue with the number in solomon's time but there is now. you can't compare the two. just because something was ok 3 thousand years ago has no bearing on if it is ok now. and there is a big difference in "The weight of the gold that Solomon received yearly was 666 talents" and 666 being the number of the beast.
the man didn't say "i won't work if my check is $666.00" he said he wouldn't wear a badge that said 666 on it

DunkingDurant35
11-19-2011, 12:36 PM
king david committed adultery and murder, should be we ok with that too? There was no issue with the number in solomon's time but there is now. you can't compare the two. just because something was ok 3 thousand years ago has no bearing on if it is ok now. and there is a big difference in "The weight of the gold that Solomon received yearly was 666 talents" and 666 being the number of the beast.
the man didn't say "i won't work if my check is $666.00" he said he wouldn't wear a badge that said 666 on it

I wish more Christians knew that the verses in Revelation about 666 pertain ONLY to taking that number in the right hand or forehead as a means of buying and selling in the latter days. Wearing it as a sticker to proclaim the number of accident-free days your employer has had, or encountering it in any other fashion, isn't going to doom anyone to hell, and there is nothing in the Bible that even remotely suggests such. Revelation 13:16-18 couldn't be more specific. Read them.

ensbergcollector
11-19-2011, 12:44 PM
I wish more Christians knew that the verses in Revelation about 666 pertain ONLY to taking that number in the right hand or forehead as a means of buying and selling in the latter days. Wearing it as a sticker to proclaim the number of accident-free days your employer has had, or encountering it in any other fashion, isn't going to doom anyone to hell, and there is nothing in the Bible that even remotely suggests such. Revelation 13:16-18 couldn't be more specific. Read them.

i have read them and i know what they mean. you and I agree with what it means. i never said i agreed with the man that wearing the badge would doom him to hell. i merely said that solomon collecting 666 pieces of gold has nothing to do with this. Is the man taking it way too far, of course. should he have been allowed to work one day without the badge given his concerns, of course. would a person from any other religion be fired if they didn't want to wear a badge that offended them for 1 day, of course not.

DunkingDurant35
11-19-2011, 12:46 PM
You said, "There was no issue with the number in solomon's time but there is now." The only issue with this number is when it is taken in the right hand or forehead as a means of buying and selling. I used the Solomon example as to just why this number isn't cause for concern when it's used in any other form. The Bible couldn't be more plain about when this number is important and when it isn't.

ensbergcollector
11-19-2011, 01:09 PM
You said, "There was no issue with the number in solomon's time but there is now." The only issue with this number is when it is taken in the right hand or forehead as a means of buying and selling. I used the Solomon example as to just why this number isn't cause for concern when it's used in any other form. The Bible couldn't be more plain about when this number is important and when it isn't.

ok, i feel like we are debating semantics but, in solomon's time there was zero issue with the number. Now, there is some issue, regardless of how small. If someone said it is wrong to wear a certain image on your left arm, i think it is safe to say most wouldn't wear it at all. again, is the guy taking the verse too far, absolutely. However, while the verses speak only of buying and selling and only of the mark being on head or hand, it also says that the number of the beast is 666. It is not a far stretch to understand why a person wouldn't want to wear it at all.

duane1969
11-19-2011, 01:11 PM
I wish more Christians knew that the verses in Revelation about 666 pertain ONLY to taking that number in the right hand or forehead as a means of buying and selling in the latter days. Wearing it as a sticker to proclaim the number of accident-free days your employer has had, or encountering it in any other fashion, isn't going to doom anyone to hell, and there is nothing in the Bible that even remotely suggests such. Revelation 13:16-18 couldn't be more specific. Read them.

By pure definition, an Islamic person who dies in the presence of a pig is doomed. Therefore they should have no issue with wearing stickers of pigs or t-shirts with pigs on them. Tell a devout Islamic person that they have to wear a pig sticker or t-shirt and let me know what the response is.

It doesn't matter how the "666" is applied, it is a natural phobia of Christians and those raised in a Christian home. I was raised in a Christian home but have not attended church in years. I would be very uncomfortable with wearing a sticker with 666 on it. Like most Christians, from childhood I was taught that the number 666 is evil. What we learn as children shapes our entire thinking for the rest of our lives. Expecting a Christian to ignore that childhood education and lifelong belief so that they can wear some insignificant sticker is illogical.

One question I would like the answer to is why the 666th day was so significant to the employer. Did they wear 665 stickers? 664 stickers? 663 stickers? And why fire someone for not wearing a sticker? Is the sticker relevant to them doing their jobs? I am sorry but this whole thing reeks of an employer who thought it would be funny to make the "religious nut" wear a 666 sticker.

Just a few days ago a thread was posted about an Islamic man being offended because someone drew the WTC on his burger box and wrote "Happy Septermber" on it. Everyone was appalled at how horrible it was to disrespect him because of his religious beliefs. Where are those people now? Why is it OK to persecute a Christian but unacceptable to do the same to a Muslim?

DunkingDurant35
11-19-2011, 01:20 PM
We shouldn't take the Bible beyond what it says. There is only one instance where this number is ever a cause for concern, and we've covered that. If I encounter it as a sticker, if I encounter it in my trading card collection, if I encounter it as page 666 in a large print Bible, or if I encounter it in any other way outside of the Bible says, I am not going to be concerned.

I believe we should always strive for sound theology. Some issues are more complex than others, I can grant that, but the 666 issue is actually one of the most clear cut, specific examples there is, and one that people erroneously take outside of its context the most often. To finalize: there is no issue with this number except when it is taken in the right hand or forehead as a means of buying and selling. Only then is it the mark of the beast.

1of23
11-19-2011, 01:22 PM
"Hyatt says in the lawsuit that he's a devout Christian. He says that wearing the number would be to accept the mark of the beast and to be condemned to hell."

noooo, wearing the numbered uniform means you are accepting a paycheck


:sign0020: I agree

DunkingDurant35
11-19-2011, 01:25 PM
It doesn't matter how the "666" is applied, it is a natural phobia of Christians and those raised in a Christian home.

It is only a phobia of Christians who haven't read their Bibles carefully.


Expecting a Christian to ignore that childhood education and lifelong belief so that they can wear some insignificant sticker is illogical.

As a Christian, I can ignore it just fine because the sticker is not a mark I am taking in my right hand or my forehead to buy or sell. I am the one being logical here, and so are many other Christians who don't have an illogical fear of this number outside of Biblical contexts.


One question I would like the answer to is why the 666th day was so significant to the employer. Did they wear 665 stickers? 664 stickers? 663 stickers? And why fire someone for not wearing a sticker? Is the sticker relevant to them doing their jobs? I am sorry but this whole thing reeks of an employer who thought it would be funny to make the "religious nut" wear a 666 sticker.

Now this is a legit argument. It seems the employer thought it would be funny. It isn't - it's just stupid. And I can't imagine why anyone would be fired over such a thing.

But my main point in responding to the side point of this is for people to get their theology correct and not let illogical fears that are not founded Biblically to run their lives.

duane1969
11-19-2011, 02:20 PM
Now this is a legit argument. It seems the employer thought it would be funny. It isn't - it's just stupid. And I can't imagine why anyone would be fired over such a thing.

But my main point in responding to the side point of this is for people to get their theology correct and not let illogical fears that are not founded Biblically to run their lives.

I understand your point and don't disagree at all with it in principle.

The problem is that all religions do not interpret their religious text in the same manner. Christianity has everything from Baptists to Pentecostals not to mention sub-categories such as Southern Baptists, Independent Baptists, etc. The same exists in Islam with Sunni and Shia.

A general theological perspecive can not be applied across the entire scope of a religion. I was taught that 666, regardless of location, is the number of the beast. Even if it is on a poster, t-shirt or just written on the wall it still represents the same thing. Others may have been taught the hand/forehead aspect. Still others may have been taught that it is only relevant if on the forehead (based on Rev. 14:1 which states that the 144,000 who stood with Jesus had "his Father's name" on their foreheads).

Interpretation of the exact meaning is open to debate. The idea that 666 is offensive/troubling to Christians is not. I doubt that any devout, practicing Christian would be comfortable wearing 666 anywhere on their body regardless of exact quotation in the Bible.

DunkingDurant35
11-19-2011, 02:27 PM
There are some interpretations of other Biblical topics that I can see being reasonably open to debate, but this isn't one of them. Here are the verses I talked about, along with a few others just prior to it, to show fuller context:

Revelation 13:11-18

"Then I saw a second beast, coming out of the earth. It had two horns like a lamb, but it spoke like a dragon. It exercised all the authority of the first beast on its behalf, and made the earth and its inhabitants worship the first beast, whose fatal wound had been healed. ***And it performed great signs, even causing fire to come down from heaven to the earth in full view of the people.*** (exegetical note: have we seen this yet? no) Because of the signs it was given power to perform on behalf of the first beast, it deceived the inhabitants of the earth. ***It ordered them to set up an image in honor of the beast who was wounded by the sword and yet lived.*** (exegetical note: have we seen this yet? no) The second beast was given power to give breath to the image of the first beast, so that the image could speak and cause all who refused to worship the image to be killed. It also forced all people, great and small, rich and poor, free and slave, to receive a mark on their ***right hands or on their foreheads***, so that they could ***not buy or sell*** unless they had the mark, which is the name of the beast or the number of its name. This calls for wisdom. Let the person who has insight calculate the number of the beast, for it is the number of a man. That number is 666."

I seriously should not need to comment on this further. Anyone with any reason can see we have not lived through such occurrences yet, and that there is nothing here to indicate that Christians should fear this number in and of itself right now in multiple innocuous situations, like stickers. This isn't some vague, broad "issue" that can be interpreted multiple ways - it's a highly specific one that has _no_ Biblical basis for the type of fear-mongering that often surrounds it.

duane1969
11-19-2011, 06:29 PM
Ultimately I take issue with it because there is a double-standard (not with you, just society in general).

A Muslim is offended because he gets his burger box with a drawing of the Twin Towers and "Happy September" written on it and everybody has a fit. The person who did the drawing is fired and the other employees are given sensitivity training after the business manager meets with the Muslim man and apologizes.

A Christian gets offended because he is forced to wear a 666 sticker and he gets fired.

The same people who ride in on their white horses to condemn mistreatment of a Muslim turn a blind eye to mistreatment of a Christian...and have the nerve to criticize others if they are not as "open-minded" as they are.

theonedru
11-19-2011, 11:37 PM
666 is often said to not even be the proper sequence of original numbers.

mrveggieman
11-20-2011, 02:27 PM
Ultimately I take issue with it because there is a double-standard (not with you, just society in general).

A Muslim is offended because he gets his burger box with a drawing of the Twin Towers and "Happy September" written on it and everybody has a fit. The person who did the drawing is fired and the other employees are given sensitivity training after the business manager meets with the Muslim man and apologizes.

A Christian gets offended because he is forced to wear a 666 sticker and he gets fired.

The same people who ride in on their white horses to condemn mistreatment of a Muslim turn a blind eye to mistreatment of a Christian...and have the nerve to criticize others if they are not as "open-minded" as they are.

I usually don't come on P&R much during the weekends but since I saw another topic that I wanted to start a thread on not to mention that I was the one who started this thread it would only be right for me to add my two cents. First of all comparing the muslim who got the hateful message on his hamburger to the guy getting fired for refusing to do as he was told at his job is a huge stretch. The muslim guy went into a resturant to buy some food to eat at home while looking at football. The idiot who drew the 9/11 message went out of his way to show how much of a hateful bigot he is and to try to insult one of his customers. The worker who was fired for wearing 666 was being insuborant and in violation of company policy. Is it posible that his bosses were trying to stick it to him by making him wear 666? Yes it could have been but the burden of proof would have been on him not the employer. The muslim guy has all the proof on the hamburger box of what they were trying to do to him.

sublime420
11-20-2011, 05:53 PM
This is exactly why religion corrupts people...

ensbergcollector
11-20-2011, 08:53 PM
This is exactly why religion corrupts people...

wow, really? so a guy doesn't want to wear a 666 sticker and that is what is wrong with religion?

Star_Cards
11-20-2011, 11:59 PM
I find the guy a bit absurd for causing such scene in refusing to wear a number. I also find it just as absurd that a company would force people to wear stickers for the amount of days they have gone without an accident. Really? Do they give out stickers every single day for them to wear so they know the days of not having an accident? sounds wasteful to me.

If the guy was a good worker, I find it odd that the company would fire a valuable worker. I also find it odd that someone would give up a job as well.

mrveggieman
11-21-2011, 09:36 AM
I find the guy a bit absurd for causing such scene in refusing to wear a number. I also find it just as absurd that a company would force people to wear stickers for the amount of days they have gone without an accident. Really? Do they give out stickers every single day for them to wear so they know the days of not having an accident? sounds wasteful to me.

If the guy was a good worker, I find it odd that the company would fire a valuable worker. I also find it odd that someone would give up a job as well.


I also find religious extremism and fanatism odd but hey some people get off on that kind of stuff.....

duane1969
11-21-2011, 10:07 AM
I also find religious extremism and fanatism odd but hey some people get off on that kind of stuff.....

So why do you keep posting threads that are "supportive" of anti-Islam issues but point out flaws of Christian issues?

Your double-standard has severaly limited your credibility. You find it appaling that a Muslim got an unfriendly drawing on his burger box but it is OK for an employer to force a Christian to wear 666 and fire him if he refuses? Seriously?

Even if the guy was in violation of company policy, how do you justify firing a guy for not wearing a sticker? What a joke.

I asked this and EVERYONE, including you, avoided it. I ask it again. Would you be OK with a Muslim being fired for refusing to wear a pig sticker?

mrveggieman
11-21-2011, 10:37 AM
So why do you keep posting threads that are "supportive" of anti-Islam issues but point out flaws of Christian issues?

Your double-standard has severaly limited your credibility. You find it appaling that a Muslim got an unfriendly drawing on his burger box but it is OK for an employer to force a Christian to wear 666 and fire him if he refuses? Seriously?

Even if the guy was in violation of company policy, how do you justify firing a guy for not wearing a sticker? What a joke.

I asked this and EVERYONE, including you, avoided it. I ask it again. Would you be OK with a Muslim being fired for refusing to wear a pig sticker?


There is not a one size fits all answer to your question. If a muslim guy worked at a bbq place and part of his uni required him to wear a t-shirt with a pig on it and he refused he needs to be fired because the picture of the pig is a part of his work uni and and was not designed to offend anyone (except for vegatarians mabey but that's another topic). If a muslim is that offended by a picture of a pig on their work uni or a christian is that offended by having to wear a sign that says 666 days w/o an accident even though none of those were designed in regards to anyone's religion they need to find another place to work. However if someone regardless of their religion goes to a restaurant to buy something to eat and the server draws a racially or religiously insensitive picture on their container the customer has every right to complain and take their complaint to the highest level possible and the person who made the drawing needs to be fired immediately and have their unemployment denied.

duane1969
11-21-2011, 10:47 AM
There is not a one size fits all answer to your question. If a muslim guy worked at a bbq place and part of his uni required him to wear a t-shirt with a pig on it and he refused he needs to be fired because the picture of the pig is a part of his work uni and and was not designed to offend anyone (except for vegatarians mabey but that's another topic). If a muslim is that offended by a picture of a pig on their work uni or a christian is that offended by having to wear a sign that says 666 days w/o an accident even though none of those were designed in regards to anyone's religion they need to find another place to work. However if someone regardless of their religion goes to a restaurant to buy something to eat and the server draws a racially or religiously insensitive picture on their container the customer has every right to complain and take their complaint to the highest level possible and the person who made the drawing needs to be fired immediately and have their unemployment denied.

I may be off here but it seems that your position is that the Christian "asked for it" by working there and the Muslim was an innocent victim by eating at the restuarant.

Just like we have a right to eat somewhere without dealing with religious insensitivity, we also have a right to go to work without dealing with religious insensitivity.

And comparing a Muslim wearing a pig t-shirt as part of his uniform and a sticker are way off. The sticker was not part of his uniform like the t-shirt in your example would be. If the guy worked for "666 Inc." then it would be a part of the uniform.

mrveggieman
11-21-2011, 10:55 AM
I may be off here but it seems that your position is that the Christian "asked for it" by working there and the Muslim was an innocent victim by eating at the restuarant.

Just like we have a right to eat somewhere without dealing with religious insensitivity, we also have a right to go to work without dealing with religious insensitivity.

And comparing a Muslim wearing a pig t-shirt as part of his uniform and a sticker are way off. The sticker was not part of his uniform like the t-shirt in your example would be. If the guy worked for "666 Inc." then it would be a part of the uniform.

No you are reading too much into it. The muslim guy from what the article said was completely innocent. All he wanted to do was grab a burger. Now as I have admitted earlier there could have possibly been some religious bias on management's behalf but the employee has failed to prove it. If everyone was made to wear the sticker saying 666 days w/o an accident and if the worker was that bothered by it he should find another line of work because an employer has to make reasonable accodomations and what they asked him to do was in no way unreasonable.

Star_Cards
11-21-2011, 11:00 AM
So why do you keep posting threads that are "supportive" of anti-Islam issues but point out flaws of Christian issues?

Your double-standard has severaly limited your credibility. You find it appaling that a Muslim got an unfriendly drawing on his burger box but it is OK for an employer to force a Christian to wear 666 and fire him if he refuses? Seriously?

Even if the guy was in violation of company policy, how do you justify firing a guy for not wearing a sticker? What a joke.

I asked this and EVERYONE, including you, avoided it. I ask it again. Would you be OK with a Muslim being fired for refusing to wear a pig sticker?

Regardless of the religion I think it's rather ridiculous on both sides. It's not like the employee was refusing to do something that important. It's also not like the company was asking him to denounce his religion. Overall it seems rather extreme for a company to fire someone over one issue. I could see a write up or something like that is he's in good standing at his job. People do way more hurtful things at work and don't get anything done to them. I'm not sure why the employer felt he should be terminated.

mrveggieman
11-21-2011, 11:04 AM
Regardless of the religion I think it's rather ridiculous on both sides. It's not like the employee was refusing to do something that important. It's also not like the company was asking him to denounce his religion. Overall it seems rather extreme for a company to fire someone over one issue. I could see a write up or something like that is he's in good standing at his job. People do way more hurtful things at work and don't get anything done to them. I'm not sure why the employer felt he should be terminated.


+1

There had to be something else going on at his job that wasn't mentioned in the article.

Star_Cards
11-21-2011, 11:17 AM
I'll also add we don't know this employees work history nor do we know how he refused to wear the sticker. It could be that this worker had many previous write up or caused a major scene in refusing to wear the sticker. That said it's also just as plausible that the worker had no past issues and did not cause a scene or do anything inappropriate in his refusal. I guess without knowing those details it's hard to know who had the more extreme reaction.

duane1969
11-21-2011, 12:03 PM
No you are reading too much into it. The muslim guy from what the article said was completely innocent. All he wanted to do was grab a burger. Now as I have admitted earlier there could have possibly been some religious bias on management's behalf but the employee has failed to prove it. If everyone was made to wear the sticker saying 666 days w/o an accident and if the worker was that bothered by it he should find another line of work because an employer has to make reasonable accodomations and what they asked him to do was in no way unreasonable.

My honest opinion is the guy should have put the sticker on upside-down so that it said 999. If the employer made an issue about that then he could just look down and say "It looks like 666 to me".

As Star Cards said, there is too much ambiguity to the story. The guy could be a trouble maker that they wanted rid of. He could just as easily be openly Christian and they were targeting him because of it.

The same can be said for the Muslim burger guy. We only got one side of the story. For all we know he was being a moron yelling "Praise to Allah!" everytime someone scored and when asked to tone it down he made an arse of himself and threatened to blow up the bar.

I would seriously like to know if they wore 665 stickers the day before or 667 stickers the next day. If not then I would argue that they were looking to give him a hard time. If they did then he clearly knew the day before that day 666 was coming up and he should have taken a personal or sick day.

mrveggieman
11-21-2011, 12:13 PM
My honest opinion is the guy should have put the sticker on upside-down so that it said 999. If the employer made an issue about that then he could just look down and say "It looks like 666 to me".

As Star Cards said, there is too much ambiguity to the story. The guy could be a trouble maker that they wanted rid of. He could just as easily be openly Christian and they were targeting him because of it.

The same can be said for the Muslim burger guy. We only got one side of the story. For all we know he was being a moron yelling "Praise to Allah!" everytime someone scored and when asked to tone it down he made an arse of himself and threatened to blow up the bar.

I would seriously like to know if they wore 665 stickers the day before or 667 stickers the next day. If not then I would argue that they were looking to give him a hard time. If they did then he clearly knew the day before that day 666 was coming up and he should have taken a personal or sick day.


Great points. Also like you said on a previous thread I really doubt that Allah/Jesus/Jehovah/etc with all that he has to deal with in the world would take the time out of his busy schedule to worry about what is going on in a football game.

habsheaven
11-21-2011, 01:40 PM
I'm not sure how thier numbering system works (I am just used to seeing it on the signage near the gate to most industrial complexes) but I don't think people should downplay the significance of "being part of the team" when it comes to workplace safety. Perhaps his refusal to wear it said more about his lack of commitment to the company mantra and it only compounded other issues between the employee and employer.