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View Full Version : Vote to make condoms available to students in MA



mrveggieman
03-20-2012, 09:05 AM
Your thoughts:

http://www.abc2news.com/dpp/news/national/vote-could-hand-down-free-condoms-to-students

shrewsbury
03-20-2012, 10:58 AM
a student would be able to walk into the nurse's office and request a free condom, but at the same time, they would be educated about abstinence, how to use a condom, as well as the consequences of having sex.

Read more: http://www.abc2news.com/dpp/news/national/vote-could-hand-down-free-condoms-to-students#ixzz1pfJUvkED

never will work, what kids wants to deal with all that?

mrveggieman
03-20-2012, 11:36 AM
never will work, what kids wants to deal with all that?


It's a start. Better than blind ignorance. When it comes to sex ignorance is not bliss.

theonedru
03-20-2012, 02:21 PM
There is no such thing as free condoms, the $ has to come from somewhere to cover the cost of them. If they want protection they can pay for it themselves.

mrveggieman
03-20-2012, 02:34 PM
I can afford to buy condoms with money that comes from my (or my wife's) paycheck but I would much rather get the condoms from the county health office that are already paid for out of my income taxes.

boba
03-20-2012, 02:41 PM
I can afford to buy condoms with money that comes from my (or my wife's) paycheck but I would much rather get the condoms from the county health office that are already paid for out of my income taxes.

Thats a nice thought, but garbage like this will make everybody pay more income taxes.

mrveggieman
03-20-2012, 02:47 PM
Thats a nice thought, but garbage like this will make everybody pay more income taxes.


Or how about paying more income taxes for AIDS treatment or for walfare children. :rolleyes:

boba
03-20-2012, 02:56 PM
Or how about paying more income taxes for AIDS treatment or for walfare children. :rolleyes:


Or how about the government stop holding a gun to our faces and force us to pay for any government program?

mrveggieman
03-20-2012, 03:07 PM
Or how about the government stop holding a gun to our faces and force us to pay for any government program?

Does that also include military spending?

boba
03-20-2012, 03:12 PM
Does that also include military spending?

In a perfect world yes.

Star_Cards
03-20-2012, 05:53 PM
I'm on the fence about a school handing out condoms. However, if it helps kids get educated on their use and become comfortable with them and buying them, that alone would raise awareness. Awareness is a big part of preventing STDs and pregnancy. I agree that abstaining should also be taught, but it's just not realistic for a lot of kids.

I remember being very nervous and scared when buying condoms when I was young. I think that feeling probably keeps a lot of kids from buying them especially since it's easy to decide not to use them in the heat of the moment... no matter how much education you have on the subject.

I feel that a lot of the issue is with parenting but the fact that sex seems so taboo doesn't help either. I think the more comfortable people of all ages are with talking about sex the better it is for educating the youth. I get the argument about tax money and such as well. I'm not sure about that one either, but would rank condoms as a lesser costing item than what some schools use money for. Besides they may even find some companies that are willing to donate or sell them cheaply. Who really knows what the added cost would be in a school year.

MadMan1978
03-27-2012, 07:11 PM
Guys I am NOT opposed to this at all!
Live in a City like Worcester or Fall River, Teens are having babies at a alarming rate. I live in this state and call me Liberal if you want, i dont care, this has been coming for a long time. In fact I thought this had already started.


Springfield has the fourth highest teen birth rate and second highest sexually-transmitted infection rate in the state, and it's happening to students who aren't even teens yet.


Edit: Before you comment in bad light...I have a daughter who is 16 and lives in Springfield, MA, where this program will be put in place. I full back the program. Too many times you drive in the City you will see children pushing their child...

theonedru
03-27-2012, 11:16 PM
Its not my problem as such my $ can go elsewhere to helping real issues. They wanna have sex they can pay all the costs and consequences involved. It may seem harsh but life is hard and people need to learn the reality of their actions.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 01:14 AM
In a perfect world yes.
But in this world you want social programs cut and the military to stay?
I'm mumbling something about having your cake and eating it too.

boba
03-28-2012, 01:40 AM
But in this world you want social programs cut and the military to stay?
I'm mumbling something about having your cake and eating it too.

I think you possibly misinterpreted what I meant by that.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 01:51 AM
Well, you're angry about social programs and suggest that the government should stop making you pay for them.

Fair enough.

Then when asked if that includes the military, you qualify it with "in a perfect world".

In a perfect world, we wouldn't have to pay for social programs because they would be completely unnecessary, but it's not a perfect world.
In a perfect world, we wouldn't need a military as it would also be unnecessary, but it's not a perfect world.
Quite frankly, in a perfect world, government altogether would be completely unnecessary.

So are you mad about spending on social programs or that we don't live in a perfect world? Because you're absolutely right that in a perfect world we wouldn't need any of it. It's just that we don't live in a perfect world and we never will.

(I'm not trying to start anything, I'm genuinely trying to understand your motivation)

dmj19842002
03-28-2012, 01:54 AM
these are children you have to start educating these kids because with birth rates and STD rates on the rise something needs done but i also feel that the parents should be involved someway



Its not my problem as such my $ can go elsewhere to helping real issues. They wanna have sex they can pay all the costs and consequences involved. It may seem harsh but life is hard and people need to learn the reality of their actions.

boba
03-28-2012, 01:57 AM
Well, you're angry about social programs and suggest that the government should stop making you pay for them.

Fair enough.

Then when asked if that includes the military, you qualify it with "in a perfect world".

In a perfect world, we wouldn't have to pay for social programs because they would be completely unnecessary, but it's not a perfect world.
In a perfect world, we wouldn't need a military as it would also be unnecessary, but it's not a perfect world.
Quite frankly, in a perfect world, government altogether would be completely unnecessary.

So are you mad about spending on social programs or that we don't live in a perfect world? Because you're absolutely right that in a perfect world we wouldn't need any of it. It's just that we don't live in a perfect world and we never will.

(I'm not trying to start anything, I'm genuinely trying to understand your motivation)

Paying for a student to have free sex is a little different then paying for our military to protect us.

Am I wrong?

boba
03-28-2012, 02:08 AM
these are children you have to start educating these kids because with birth rates and STD rates on the rise something needs done but i also feel that the parents should be involved someway

:rolleyes:

You think it's ironic that STD rates are on the rise with the rise of sex ed? Because I do.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 02:13 AM
Paying for a student to have free sex is a little different then paying for our military to protect us.

Am I wrong?
Well in one case you're helping prevent someone from possibly dying...

boba
03-28-2012, 02:14 AM
Well in one case you're helping prevent someone from possibly dying...

? Not following you here.

Are you saying it prevents STDs, or it prevents pregnancies which prevents that person who would be born from dying?

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 02:18 AM
Um, ok.

When you spend money on condoms for kids, you're helping prevent the spread of diseases and death among those kids.

When you spend money on a military, it can only end with someone dying.

I understand you're saying the military is more necessary and you're probably right. But with condoms you're not paying so kids can have sex. They're going to anyway, condom or not. You're paying to lessen disease, death and dumpster-babies.

boba
03-28-2012, 02:25 AM
Um, ok.

#1 When you spend money on condoms for kids, you're helping prevent the spread of diseases and death among those kids.

#2 When you spend money on a military, it can only end with someone dying.

#3 I understand you're saying the military is more necessary and you're probably right. But with condoms you're not paying so kids can have sex. They're going to anyway, condom or not. You're paying to lessen disease, death and dumpster-babies.

1. Actually, your encouraging them to have sex before they are mature enough to deal with the consequences.

2. If you have no military it can only end with many people dying.


3. It sounds good but it's just not true, the more condoms we make available and the more sex ed classes we offer the worse STDs and teen pregnancies have gotten.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 02:32 AM
1. Actually, your encouraging them to have sex before they are mature enough to deal with the consequences.
I'm gonna stop you right there. I don't believe that for a second. If kids are going to have sex, they're going to have sex. There isn't a teenager alive who's saying "Damn I want to have sex. If only I could get free condoms from the school nurse!"
That's just stupid. I'm sorry, but it really, really is.


2. If you have no military it can only end with many people dying.
Same goes for having a military. What's your point?



3. It sounds good but it's just not true, the more condoms we make available and the more sex ed classes we offer the worse STDs and teen pregnancies have gotten.
Really? Tell that to Africa. They get ZERO sex education. I guess they have no problems with STDs?

boba
03-28-2012, 02:40 AM
#1. I'm gonna stop you right there. I don't believe that for a second. If kids are going to have sex, they're going to have sex. There isn't a teenager alive who's saying "Damn I want to have sex. If only I could get free condoms from the school nurse!"
That's just stupid. I'm sorry, but it really, really is.


#2 Same goes for having a military. What's your point?



#3 Really? Tell that to Africa. They get ZERO sex education. I guess they have no problems with STDs?


#1 I rest my case haha.
#2 Without a military, everyone in the country dies or is enslaved by another country who does have a military.
#3 I'm not saying condom, or many other birth controls for that matter, are bad. Africa doesn't have these things like we do. This is not the point, we are talking about me paying for kids to get free condoms. If they are mature enough to have sex, they can pay for it or deal with the consequences.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 02:45 AM
#3 I'm not saying condom, or many other birth controls for that matter, are bad. Africa doesn't have these things like we do. This is not the point, we are talking about me paying for kids to get free condoms. If they are mature enough to have sex, they can pay for it or deal with the consequences.
That's just it, though. They're not going to pay for it and we all deal with the consequences.

boba
03-28-2012, 02:56 AM
That's just it, though. They're not going to pay for it and we all deal with the consequences.


I think we are going in circles now because I don't think they will be any more eager to get it for free. I think either way we will have to deal with the consequences.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 03:00 AM
You're probably right there, but does that mean it's wrong to try? Your money can (and does) go to much, much worse things than condoms for teens.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 10:25 AM
Its not my problem as such my $ can go elsewhere to helping real issues. They wanna have sex they can pay all the costs and consequences involved. It may seem harsh but life is hard and people need to learn the reality of their actions.

although, couldn't you say that spending money on programs such as this would save tax payer money because it would more than likely prevent teenage pregnancy to a degree and in turn keep those teens from potentially living off of the welfare system. Teens that don't have children have a much better chance at getting a better education and being able to provide for themselves than teens that do have children.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 10:29 AM
Paying for a student to have free sex is a little different then paying for our military to protect us.

Am I wrong?

I find it ridiculous that you are saying that a program that hands out condoms is somehow paying kids for sex. It's pretty off base to say that.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 10:31 AM
:rolleyes:

You think it's ironic that STD rates are on the rise with the rise of sex ed? Because I do.

Do you think that teaching sex ed clues kids in that having sex is an option? A persons body does that. Kids are going to want to have sex and have sex wether or not there are sex ed classes. Sex ed classes don't cause kids to have sex. I say give kids proper knowledge about sex to better prepare them for the consequences should they take part.

mrveggieman
03-28-2012, 10:41 AM
do you think that teaching sex ed clues kids in that having sex is an option? A persons body does that. Kids are going to want to have sex and have sex wether or not there are sex ed classes. Sex ed classes don't cause kids to have sex. I say give kids proper knowledge about sex to better prepare them for the consequences should they take part.


+1,000,000

boba
03-28-2012, 12:18 PM
Do you think that teaching sex ed clues kids in that having sex is an option? A persons body does that. Kids are going to want to have sex and have sex wether or not there are sex ed classes. Sex ed classes don't cause kids to have sex. I say give kids proper knowledge about sex to better prepare them for the consequences should they take part.


Like I said earlier, it's nice and all that you can say that, but the proof is in the numbers.

boba
03-28-2012, 12:24 PM
I find it ridiculous that you are saying that a program that hands out condoms is somehow paying kids for sex. It's pretty off base to say that.

But it is.
I see your point that it is paying to reduce STDs. But why is it my responsibility to prevent STDs from irresponsible teens? Using that logic you could say I need to pay for any injury-illness that anyone receives while doing something irresponsible.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 12:41 PM
Like I said earlier, it's nice and all that you can say that, but the proof is in the numbers.

the numbers may be going up but that doesn't mean that they are going up because there is sex ed. there are many other factors. sex is natural and pretty much any animal is going to have a desire to have sex once it hits puberty. having sex ed classes isn't going to trigger that. Hormones in the body do. Sex is instinctual. I say give kids the proper knowledge about it. If you shelter them from it they will lack the knowledge to make informed decisions once they start to become interested in sex.

boba
03-28-2012, 12:46 PM
the numbers may be going up but that doesn't mean that they are going up because there is sex ed. there are many other factors. sex is natural and pretty much any animal is going to have a desire to have sex once it hits puberty. having sex ed classes isn't going to trigger that. Hormones in the body do. Sex is instinctual. I say give kids the proper knowledge about it. If you shelter them from it they will lack the knowledge to make informed decisions once they start to become interested in sex.

My point isn't necessarily that sex ed is causing kids to have sex, but more that it isn't helping prevent STDs, as seen in the numbers.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 12:54 PM
But it is.
I see your point that it is paying to reduce STDs. But why is it my responsibility to prevent STDs from irresponsible teens? Using that logic you could say I need to pay for any injury-illness that anyone receives while doing something irresponsible.

yes, it is. giving a condom to a person for free is not anything close to paying for them to have sex. It's completely different. I get the debate of should my tax dollars go towards this sort of program. If you have an issue I say state the issue. Stop trying to compare it to prostitution to handing out condoms. It just hurts your argument to compare the two. There are way more valid arguments that could be stated to discuss why you'd be against a program like this.

I'm actually on the fence about a school handing out condoms. I don't necessarily think it is up to them to do so, but I do think that it's an avenue that could get to the masses of kids that need information about safe sex. I actually think that a condom program would come along with education that would be good for teens. It would open the dialog about sex which is very beneficial. We like to think sex is a taboo subject and that hurts teens when it comes to discussing it with parents or adults.

I get the tax payer money issue 100%. I hate that our money is wasted on so many fluff programs and such, but there are programs that I don't mind paying for when done right. I think this could be one. I'd rather spend the money up front on prevention than later on teens that end up on welfare

mrveggieman
03-28-2012, 01:44 PM
But it is.
I see your point that it is paying to reduce STDs. But why is it my responsibility to prevent STDs from irresponsible teens? Using that logic you could say I need to pay for any injury-illness that anyone receives while doing something irresponsible.


So what would you rather your tax dollars go to? Condoms or welfare payments or even AIDS treatments.

Wickabee
03-28-2012, 02:00 PM
Boba, no offense, but I really think you're short sighted and narrow minded on this issue.

mrveggieman
03-28-2012, 02:26 PM
Boba, no offense, but I really think you're short sighted and narrow minded on this issue.


Understatement of the year.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 03:09 PM
My point isn't necessarily that sex ed is causing kids to have sex, but more that it isn't helping prevent STDs, as seen in the numbers.

then I'd think that having condoms available free might help.

theonedru
03-28-2012, 03:12 PM
then I'd think that having condoms available free might help.

I'm thinking let them learn from their mistakes and live with the consequences of their poor decisions.

steelers#1fan
03-28-2012, 03:22 PM
I'm all for the condoms. Kids should know what happens when you have unprotected sex, ie: unwanted pregnancy, STD'S. I would rather pay for the condoms than pay for another unwed mother on welfare. Just my 2 cents.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 03:26 PM
I'm thinking let them learn from their mistakes and live with the consequences of their poor decisions.

so then there's no real need to offer young people any sort of knowledge. they can just learn by their mistakes.

theonedru
03-28-2012, 03:27 PM
I'm all for the condoms. Kids should know what happens when you have unprotected sex, ie: unwanted pregnancy, STD'S. I would rather pay for the condoms than pay for another unwed mother on welfare. Just my 2 cents.

How about making the parents step up like they should be to properly inform their kids on life, then if the parents choose they can provide them for their kids.

theonedru
03-28-2012, 03:29 PM
so then there's no real need to offer young people any sort of knowledge. they can just learn by their mistakes.

Its called parenting

mrveggieman
03-28-2012, 03:36 PM
i'm all for the condoms. Kids should know what happens when you have unprotected sex, ie: Unwanted pregnancy, std's. I would rather pay for the condoms than pay for another unwed mother on welfare. Just my 2 cents.


+1,000,000.

Star_Cards
03-28-2012, 03:37 PM
Its called parenting

I agree. I'm in no way saying that parenting isn't a major problem with teen pregnancy, but I just don't think the kids that have crappy or absent parents should just be left to learn from their mistakes.

steelers#1fan
03-28-2012, 03:37 PM
That would work as well, but, there are alot of parents that won't step up.


How about making the parents step up like they should be to properly inform their kids on life, then if the parents choose they can provide them for their kids.

theonedru
03-28-2012, 03:46 PM
That would work as well, but, there are alot of parents that won't step up.

I agree and it shows how sad and pathetic, even uncaring alot of parents are, but still its their responsibility not mine, if their kid messes up gets pregnant, impregnates someone or? then they can cough up the $ to support their poor parenting.

boba
03-28-2012, 04:06 PM
Boba, no offense, but I really think you're short sighted and narrow minded on this issue.


Understatement of the year.


I'm a high school senior, after school 4 days a week I work for a carpenter. I pay taxes just like the rest of you. Is it wrong for me not to think I should have to pay for my friends and schoolmates to have free condoms? I, just like you, can form my own opinions. I would ask you respect my opinion as I respect yours.

Also, in my school district we have sex ed classes from the 6th grade up. Let me tell you, it just isn't effective. All it is is a subject for jokes. We have free condoms available, but let me tell you it hasn't helped with teen pregnancies or STDs at my school. Maybe my school district is the minority, but I doubt it.