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mrveggieman
03-22-2012, 04:59 PM
My main man Afrank45 bought up a good point that we should not take the death or the maiming of innocent children to make politicial arguments for one side or another. So I'm going to start a race relations thread. Feel free to ask any questions or make comments but please be respectful. Thanks.

lloydr04
03-22-2012, 05:02 PM
http://www.fairfaxunderground.com/forum/file.php?40,file=33115,filename=Popcorn.gif

Wickabee
03-22-2012, 05:04 PM
I'll start off with a question, instead of looking for a GIF:
If racism is wrong (which I think we all agree it is) why is it okay for non-whites to be publicly racist against white people?

In other words why, do we vilify someone like Michael Richards (and rightfully so) for his racist remarks but a black comedian can say as many asinine, racist remarks and be a hero?

Also, am I racist for asking these questions? (keeping in mind I'm not saying white people should be allowed to make racist comment, but that others should not be allowed to make such comments...publicly of course)

mrveggieman
03-22-2012, 05:11 PM
I'll start off with a question, instead of looking for a GIF:
If racism is wrong (which I think we all agree it is) why is it okay for non-whites to be publicly racist against white people?

In other words why, do we vilify someone like Michael Richards (and rightfully so) for his racist remarks but a black comedian can say as many asinine, racist remarks and be a hero?

Also, am I racist for asking these questions? (keeping in mind I'm not saying white people should be allowed to make racist comment, but that others should not be allowed to make such comments...publicly of course)


I'm glad that you bought that question up. If you want my opinion I'm going to blame white people. The reason why is that if white people started boycotting black commedians, musicians, etc who said racist things against them they would stop because as we all know at the end of the day the color that eveyone loves is green. However there is a percentage of white people who are entertained by stuff like that just like there is a percentage of black people who have no problem hearing other black people calling each other a word that I am not going to repeat on here. Again not saying that it is right it is what it is.

Wickabee
03-22-2012, 05:21 PM
My point is basically "what's sauce for the goose". I'll admit I find many of those black comedians hilarious and, quite frankly, I find that those comedians actually take some of the power out of those words.

What bothers me is if I want to be proud of my heritage I have to qualify it by naming a country. I have to say, "I'm proud to be of German and Scottish descent". If I say, "I'm proud to be white," that's a racist remark.
But a black man doesn't have to qualify his statement. He can say, "I'm proud to be black," which really he should be. We should all be proud of what we are, but we can't.
It really feels like I'm supposed to be proud to be German and Scottish but ashamed that I'm white. I don't think that's right and I don't think it's equality.

mrveggieman
03-22-2012, 05:25 PM
My point is basically "what's sauce for the goose". I'll admit I find many of those black comedians hilarious and, quite frankly, I find that those comedians actually take some of the power out of those words.

What bothers me is if I want to be proud of my heritage I have to qualify it by naming a country. I have to say, "I'm proud to be of German and Scottish descent". If I say, "I'm proud to be white," that's a racist remark.
But a black man doesn't have to qualify his statement. He can say, "I'm proud to be black," which really he should be. We should all be proud of what we are, but we can't.
It really feels like I'm supposed to be proud to be German and Scottish but ashamed that I'm white. I don't think that's right and I don't think it's equality.


To be perfectly honest the average black person does not know their heritage. It's not our fault. Our slave masters had no desire to teach it to us. However most white people know that they are german, irish, italian, etc. So to say that we are proud to be black is the pretty much the only thing that we can say.

shrewsbury
03-22-2012, 05:30 PM
If you want my opinion I'm going to blame white people. The reason why is that if white people started boycotting black commedians, musicians, etc who said racist things against them they would stop because as we all know at the end of the day the color that eveyone loves is green.

so we start with a racist comment on a race relation thread?

so people like sean combs, oprah, russel simmons, jay-z and plenty, plenty others, are not about the money? so they must allow the racism of the blacks against whites so they can keep making money? right? it's all about the benjamins

if equality is you call me names so i will call you them back, then it is an equality i can live without.

the strange thing is in my circle of friends, which include blacks, puertoricans, lesbians, jews, whites, and asians, we have no issue getting along.

but these must all be uncle tom sell outs or i must be one

race relations start at home and in your personal life, not controlling what others do, and if everyone did this, there would be no more racial issues to deal with, it's always the individual, not the race, religion, economic status, or lineage, it's the friggin person that racist or not.

the "whites", got to love it

marekschwarz33
03-22-2012, 05:33 PM
I would prefer to view people as individuals rather than as groups divided by race (or anything else). Just my opinion...

Wickabee
03-22-2012, 05:33 PM
To be perfectly honest the average black person does not know their heritage. It's not our fault. Our slave masters had no desire to teach it to us. However most white people know that they are german, irish, italian, etc. So to say that we are proud to be black is the pretty much the only thing that we can say.
Oh, I understand that for certain. I just don't understand why the fact I know I'm German and Scottish while you have no idea whether you're Kenyan or Nigerian means it's wrong for me to be proud I'm white/European. Personally, I don't care what colour I am. I am proud of where I came from and where I came from makes me white, so maybe I am proud to be white. I'm just not allowed to say that to anyone.

Maybe it's because I'm a Canadian. We have VERY different race relation issues and histories in our two countries. I only get to see American racism, but the effects are felt here in Canada in the form of ideas like "only white people can be racist" and other myths.

Wickabee
03-22-2012, 05:35 PM
so we start with a racist comment on a race relation thread?

so people like sean combs, oprah, russel simmons, jay-z and plenty, plenty others, are not about the money? so they must allow the racism of the blacks against whites so they can keep making money? right? it's all about the benjamins

if equality is you call me names so i will call you them back, then it is an equality i can live without.

the strange thing is in my circle of friends, which include blacks, puertoricans, lesbians, jews, whites, and asians, we have no issue getting along.

but these must all be uncle tom sell outs or i must be one

race relations start at home and in your personal life, not controlling what others do, and if everyone did this, there would be no more racial issues to deal with, it's always the individual, not the race, religion, economic status, or lineage, it's the friggin person that racist or not.

the "whites", got to love it
I agree for the most part, but I think you're losing the ultimate point over the words "blame the whites".

I knew what he was getting at, and no it wasn't racist.

shrewsbury
03-22-2012, 05:36 PM
the average black person does not know their heritage. It's not our fault. Our slave masters had no desire to teach it to us

first off YOU NEVER HAD A SLAVE MASTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

second most blacks do not come from slavery, and thirdly, most slaves were sold to whites by the black themselves

and why you are at it, why don't you google oberlin ohio and oberlin college.

the first black college grad? guess what, oberlin college and when you ask, how about 1863!!!!!!!!!!!!

first black college president? oberlin college

biggest celebration of the year? juneteenth, which is the celebration of the end of slavery

look at the oberlin/wellington rescue

our schools or more racially intergrated than most innercity schools.

so don't blame all the whites, it is wrong

BGT Masters
03-22-2012, 05:39 PM
To be perfectly honest the average black person does not know their heritage. It's not our fault. Our slave masters had no desire to teach it to us. However most white people know that they are german, irish, italian, etc. So to say that we are proud to be black is the pretty much the only thing that we can say.

I never say I am proud to be Irish or Croatian, I'm proud to be what I am an American. It is nice to know a few generations ago some of my family came from over seas, but to me all that matters is where I was born and where I call home. Which is the United States of America, be proud of that. On my mother's side I can't trade any farther back than her. Thats it and it doesn't bother me at all.

Regardless of when you got here or how you got here, there are plenty of people that would trade places with you who don't enjoy what we have. Me personally find the people who cry about racism the most are generally (not always) the most racist people. Its just strange to me if I were to say I'm proud to be white just because I'm white. Be proud because you're a good person, a hard worker, a good parent, not just because of the color of your skin.

shrewsbury
03-22-2012, 05:43 PM
Regardless of when you got here or how you got here, there are plenty of people that would trade places with you who don't enjoy what we have. Me personally find the people who cry about racism the most are generally (not always) the most racist people. Its just strange to me if I were to say I'm proud to be white just because I'm white. Be proud because you're a good person, a hard worker, a good parent, not just because of the color of your skin.

great post!

Wickabee
03-22-2012, 05:58 PM
I never say I am proud to be Irish or Croatian, I'm proud to be what I am an American. It is nice to know a few generations ago some of my family came from over seas, but to me all that matters is where I was born and where I call home. Which is the United States of America, be proud of that. On my mother's side I can't trade any farther back than her. Thats it and it doesn't bother me at all.

I do agree with this, except that I am proud of my heritage beyond Canada. I'm proud of what my forefathers have done, because I'm proud of who I am and wouldn't be the same me if not for them (if that makes sense). I would say you should be as proud to be Irish and Croatian as you are to be American, of which you should be as proud as I am to be Canadian, and I'm very proud to be Canadian. As proud as I am to be German and Scottish.


first off YOU NEVER HAD A SLAVE MASTER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

First off, I get what veggie was saying and I'm pretty sure that wasn't what he meant.
You raise a good point though. One part of my family lost a lot of land because of WWII. I don't consider it "my" land that was taken away because it wasn't. I don't think I should get anything in return for that land because, well, that's kind of how things happen sometimes. I choose not to identify with it at all, but rather the struggle my family went through during WWII. I don't focus on what was lost, I focus on what was accomplished. I have to admit that, from where I stand, African-Americans tend to focus on what was lost, not what has been accomplished. Correct me if I'm wrong on that.

BGT Masters
03-22-2012, 06:46 PM
My being American trumps all else. I've never been to Ireland or Croatia, probably never will. No one still alive in my family has been there. Though again its nice to know my heritage it doesn't hold me back or make me feel like I am missing something in my life. I have Irish and Croatian bloodlines to me that doesn't make me Irish or Croatian anymore than it makes someone who has had a family member who played in the NFL a pro football player. I guess I just look at it differently.

Wickabee
03-22-2012, 06:58 PM
My being American trumps all else. I've never been to Ireland or Croatia, probably never will. No one still alive in my family has been there. Though again its nice to know my heritage it doesn't hold me back or make me feel like I am missing something in my life. I have Irish and Croatian bloodlines to me that doesn't make me Irish or Croatian anymore than it makes someone who has had a family member who played in the NFL a pro football player. I guess I just look at it differently.
That's totally fair and I'm not by any means saying you're "wrong" but I do think you should be proud of that past, at least to a degree.
The way I see it, I'm proud to be a Canadian, first and foremost. On 1 side of my family I'm third generation Canadian and for a few generations before that they were American and before that Scottish. On the other side, though, I'm first generation, as my mother was born in Germany. Maybe it's because I'm a little closer to that heritage than you maybe are, but I'm proud of both sides, for, if not for them being who they were I wouldn't be who I am and I am more proud just to be me than any nationality or race. I just keep sight of the fact that my nationality and race (among other things) is part of who I am.

Would I say It's "better" to be German than any other nationality? No...well, maybe the Dutch (j/k). But am I proud of my heritage? Absolutely because it goes a long way to making me who I am today.

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 09:16 AM
Well as for me first and foremost I am proud to be a child of God. Secondly I would identify with being black because I could pack up and leave the united states today or tommorrow but that wont change the fact that I'm black. Also some of you have bought up some good points. One of you suggested that blacks complain about what they had taken away from them instead of what they have. I tend to agree with you to a lesser degree. Yes we don't have it as good as others so that is why we must continue to struggle of our forefathers. Otherwise all the freedom fighters who died before me will have died in vain. Also @Shewrsbury you are correct I never had a slave master myself but I was referring to my forefathers who did if that is ok with you.

shrewsbury
03-23-2012, 10:01 AM
[QUOTE]Also @Shewrsbury you are correct I never had a slave master myself but I was referring to my forefathers who did if that is ok with you.[QUOTE]

considering you complain when someone says the republicans did stuff for you that was 50 years ago and don't count, how does something that happened 150 years ago count?

the fact that my forefathers died to free the slaves and my president was murdered for doing so doesn't seem to count.
the fact that my grandparents and parents marched with and stood by, was persecuted for and made an outcast in their own communities to support civil rights, doesn't seem to count.

my people paid the price for slavery and didn't have anything to do with it, we have died, been jailed, outcasted, had our homes burnt died, and were labeled with negative conotations and we have never asked anything in return.

you think that if someone is white they were involved with enslaving the blacks, and if someone is black their forefathers were enslaved, and you are wrong on both counts.

AND

how do you not have it as good as i do?

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 10:10 AM
[quote]Also @Shewrsbury you are correct I never had a slave master myself but I was referring to my forefathers who did if that is ok with you.[quote]

considering you complain when someone says the republicans did stuff for you that was 50 years ago and don't count, how does something that happened 150 years ago count?

the fact that my forefathers died to free the slaves and my president was murdered for doing so doesn't seem to count.
the fact that my grandparents and parents marched with and stood by, was persecuted for and made an outcast in their own communities to support civil rights, doesn't seem to count.

my people paid the price for slavery and didn't have anything to do with it, we have died, been jailed, outcasted, had our homes burnt died, and were labeled with negative conotations and we have never asked anything in return.

you think that if someone is white they were involved with enslaving the blacks, and if someone is black their forefathers were enslaved, and you are wrong on both counts.

AND

how do you not have it as good as i do?

Again I was just referring to my history. I was not using it as a crutch or anything like that. When someone throws up what a republican did 50+ years ago as proof that they still care for black people I can only SMH. And yes I am aware that there were and still are a lot of white people that assisted us in the struggle. Hell there some white people that I would trust with my life and on the same token there are some blacks that I wouldn't trust to take out my trash. Shocker isn't it.

Also don't be naive about how things are. Yes I have a decent job, a roof over my head, been to college, have food to eat and a loving family but lets not be stupid and believe that in america in 2012 there are not certian neighboorhoods that if you and I both walked down the street about which one of us the police will stop, question and detain. Yes we as a society have came a long way but we have an even longer way to go.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 10:48 AM
I'll start off with a question, instead of looking for a GIF:
If racism is wrong (which I think we all agree it is) why is it okay for non-whites to be publicly racist against white people?

In other words why, do we vilify someone like Michael Richards (and rightfully so) for his racist remarks but a black comedian can say as many asinine, racist remarks and be a hero?

Also, am I racist for asking these questions? (keeping in mind I'm not saying white people should be allowed to make racist comment, but that others should not be allowed to make such comments...publicly of course)

For me what michael richards did was directed at a person in the audience if I remember correctly. When most black comic make jokes about whites (ie. dave schapelle or chris rock) it's not directed at one person and it's typically not done so out of hatred. Personally I love jokes like that and there's not much funnier seeing schapelle dressed up like a white guy or just doing his white guy voice. For me I think it has to do with the fact that whites, as a whole group, are not being repressed or have not been repressed by these racial terms so there's a difference in people's reactions to it. I won't disagree that there is a double standard. There is. It's just a fact that certain groups can get away with things comedically that others can't and it doesn't only exist within racial boundaries. However, I'd caution anyone comparing stand up comedy to more serious topics. The tone and environment is different. I've seen white comic do "black" jokes that are funny and don't come off in an offensive tone. What michael richards did, standing on the stage and yelling the N word over and over wasn't comedy or anything close to it. Bottom line, for me, it's all about tone. Also some racial jokes make fun of the stereotype.

I will also say that there are black comics that get negative press for jokes. It's not typically for jokes against whites but tracy morgan was just in the news in the last few years for making insensitive jokes.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 11:05 AM
Yes we don't have it as good as others so that is why we must continue to struggle of our forefathers.

I don't think this quote really is true. True, there are blacks that have things worse than whites when it comes to education or finances and things of that sort, but there are a lot of whites that also don't have it as good as a lot of whites, blacks, or any other race.

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 11:08 AM
I don't think this quote really is true. True, there are blacks that have things worse than whites when it comes to education or finances and things of that sort, but there are a lot of whites that also don't have it as good as a lot of whites, blacks, or any other race.


You are right there are underprivilged people of all races and backrounds. My only point is that minorities have greater instatnces of being disadvantaged.

ensbergcollector
03-23-2012, 11:11 AM
as long as there are double standards there will be racism. as long as there are justifications and excuses for one race where none exist for another, there will be racism.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 11:14 AM
Also don't be naive about how things are. Yes I have a decent job, a roof over my head, been to college, have food to eat and a loving family but lets not be stupid and believe that in america in 2012 there are not certian neighboorhoods that if you and I both walked down the street about which one of us the police will stop, question and detain. Yes we as a society have came a long way but we have an even longer way to go.

I agree that we still have ways to go, but at the same time if you look at how things were just 40 years ago I think we, as a country, have grown a lot in tolerance of a lot of things, including race, sexual orientation, religion, and so on. We definitely need to keep progressing, but to think about our views from just two generations ago we are growing.

I believe that most of the bigotry is learned from parents and relatives within in one's family. I think as time progresses and we become more aware of people's differences time will help to weed out the bigotry. Most bigotry exists because of ignorance and lack of exposure. Most people that you see who don't like gays or a person of a certain race just haven't been exposed to them. Usually once they are they can see that they are just like them. There's no personal connection. My point is, people just have more personal connection with different races more and more and time progresses and that's a great thing.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 11:16 AM
You are right there are underprivilged people of all races and backrounds. My only point is that minorities have greater instatnces of being disadvantaged.

I would tend to agree with that. I'm just saying there are lots of white's that also struggle.

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 11:16 AM
as long as there are double standards there will be racism. as long as there are justifications and excuses for one race where none exist for another, there will be racism.


Or how about as long as one race continue to pay people of another race to insult their race such a behavior will continue.

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 11:16 AM
I would tend to agree with that. I'm just saying there are lots of white's that also struggle.


Agree wholeheartedly!!

ensbergcollector
03-23-2012, 11:23 AM
Or how about as long as one race continue to pay people of another race to insult their race such a behavior will continue.

if that makes you feel better. though i highly doubt white people paying to see chris rock is the cause of racism in our country. I think I will stick with my statement

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 11:31 AM
if that makes you feel better. though i highly doubt white people paying to see chris rock is the cause of racism in our country. I think I will stick with my statement


Im not suggesting that is the only cause or even a major cause. However whites cannot cry about why is it ok for black comedians to continue to insulti them if they are the main ones supporting them. That would be akin to complaining about poor service at a restaurant but continuing to eat there every day.

ensbergcollector
03-23-2012, 11:37 AM
Im not suggesting that is the only cause or even a major cause. However whites cannot cry about why is it ok for black comedians to continue to insulti them if they are the main ones supporting them. That would be akin to complaining about poor service at a restaurant but continuing to eat there every day.

so wait, because some white people support chris rock, i'm not allowed to complain about him? Since some black people listen to rush, are no black people allowed to complain about rush?

no, that would be akin to me complaining about a restaurant and then some people I don't know and have never met eating there.

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 11:44 AM
so wait, because some white people support chris rock, i'm not allowed to complain about him? Since some black people listen to rush, are no black people allowed to complain about rush?

no, that would be akin to me complaining about a restaurant and then some people I don't know and have never met eating there.


So take a wild guess at how many black fans rush has compared to how many white fans chris rock has? You are really starting to go off the deep end my good friend.

ensbergcollector
03-23-2012, 11:50 AM
So take a wild guess at how many black fans rush has compared to how many white fans chris rock has? You are really starting to go off the deep end my good friend.

your inability to address anything someone says amazes me. Please answer my question. So, according to you, because some white people like chris rock, no white people are allowed to have an issue with what he says?

And I'm sorry, how do you know how many black people listen to rush?

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 11:51 AM
so wait, because some white people support chris rock, i'm not allowed to complain about him? Since some black people listen to rush, are no black people allowed to complain about rush?

no, that would be akin to me complaining about a restaurant and then some people I don't know and have never met eating there.

You can complain about chris rock if you please. Not to speak for Veg, but in my opinion if you find him saying cracker or schappelle dressing up in white face offensive you have the right to complain and I don't see that as you being racist.

You guys do know that the most news organizations pretty much sheep, right? They want ratings and sensational stories and, big surprise, racial stories do that. They know they are polarizing and get people to watch for info and read their websites for info. They don't care a lot about reporting on stories that won't fill hours of TV time. They have 24 hours to fill and this type of story is proven to fill time and get audiences. I don't really read too much into what gets covered by the typical national media. They just copy each other for the most part.

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 11:56 AM
your inability to address anything someone says amazes me. Please answer my question. So, according to you, because some white people like chris rock, no white people are allowed to have an issue with what he says?

And I'm sorry, how do you know how many black people listen to rush?


Again I never said that. I just don't see any large groups of white people protesting what chris rock does and he continues to sign multi million dollar movie and endorsement deals. He would not get those deals with the support of white and to a lesser extent black and other people.

I don't know for a fact how many black people listen to rush but I would bet every card that I own it is only a small percentage of black people. Pretty much the herman cain and allan west type of people if you know what I mean. :winking0071:

Rockman
03-23-2012, 12:03 PM
With stuff like this context means a whole lot more than content, and I feel like that is getting lost in this discussion.

ensbergcollector
03-23-2012, 12:07 PM
Again I never said that. I just don't see any large groups of white people protesting what chris rock does and he continues to sign multi million dollar movie and endorsement deals. He would not get those deals with the support of white and to a lesser extent black and other people.

I don't know for a fact how many black people listen to rush but I would bet every card that I own it is only a small percentage of black people. Pretty much the herman cain and allan west type of people if you know what I mean. :winking0071:

don't worry, we all know what you mean. smh

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 01:36 PM
Im not suggesting that is the only cause or even a major cause. However whites cannot cry about why is it ok for black comedians to continue to insulti them if they are the main ones supporting them. That would be akin to complaining about poor service at a restaurant but continuing to eat there every day.
Woah, woah, woah.

I find Chris Rock funny, hilarious, in fact, and when he does use derogatory terms like 'honkey' and 'cracker' he does use it in a way that's funny and kind of makes you think.

I don't know why he's allowed to use those words though. Seems to me what's sauce for the goose...

Monsterx
03-23-2012, 01:41 PM
Woah, woah, woah.

I find Chris Rock funny, hilarious, in fact, and when he does use derogatory terms like 'honkey' and 'cracker' he does use it in a way that's funny and kind of makes you think.

I don't know why he's allowed to use those words though. Seems to me what's sauce for the goose...

Of course he or anyone is allowed to use those words. It's not illegal to be racist or voice your opinion on the subject.

BGT Masters
03-23-2012, 01:42 PM
Well as for me first and foremost I am proud to be a child of God. Secondly I would identify with being black because I could pack up and leave the united states today or tommorrow but that wont change the fact that I'm black. Also some of you have bought up some good points. One of you suggested that blacks complain about what they had taken away from them instead of what they have. I tend to agree with you to a lesser degree. Yes we don't have it as good as others so that is why we must continue to struggle of our forefathers. Otherwise all the freedom fighters who died before me will have died in vain. Also @Shewrsbury you are correct I never had a slave master myself but I was referring to my forefathers who did if that is ok with you.

And if I leave the United States I'll still be white so what? I never got the whole (fill in skin color) pride thing or whatever. I guess if thats all I had to be proud of was my skin color I'd complain about everything all the time as well. If you can;t look past your own skin color, how on earth do you expect anyone else to? If something doesn't go your way and you automatically see it as because you're (fill in skin color) then you're holding yourself back.

Again its in my life experience the loudest people crying wolf because of skin color are normally the biggest racists. Of course what I said in my previous paragraph can be applied to anything in life, race, religion, sex, weight, anything really. And it bugs me that some people seem to think "their people" were the only ones in history to be persecuted and treated like dirt. Through time pretty much everyone has been crapped on a time or two.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 01:48 PM
Of course he or anyone is allowed to use those words. It's not illegal to be racist or voice your opinion on the subject.
By "allowed" I mean "publicly without retribution on a societal level" not "legal"

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 01:53 PM
Woah, woah, woah.

I don't know why he's allowed to use those words though. Seems to me what's sauce for the goose...


Quite simply because he is paid very well to use those words.

txtaz1102
03-23-2012, 02:11 PM
the idea of racism is to deep rooted to go anywhere. as long as you have as many people as we do in this, or any country, for that matter you will get people that dont like others for silly reasons. in high school i was on the basketball team, only white player, and one of our district games was against a town that was all white. driving through town to get to the gym on the bus we passed busses of elementary kids flipping us the bird.

you can argue til your blue in the face that it is media, celebrities, "role models" or others that help further the idea of hate, but in reality it is like the kids on those busses. it starts in the home from parents, grandparents and such. being in the south it is even more prevalent. but it works both ways. i have seen signs on the "welcome to such and such town" saying "derogitory word, dont let the sun set on you here", just like ive seen white people beat for walking through a black neighborhood.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 02:29 PM
Quite simply because he is paid very well to use those words.
So It's perfectly alright for me to be publicly racist as long as someone is paying me well enough?

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 02:47 PM
So It's perfectly alright for me to be publicly racist as long as someone is paying me well enough?


Try it and see how far your career goes. :winking0071:

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 02:56 PM
Try it and see how far your career goes. :winking0071:
Since I'm white, probably not very far

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 03:05 PM
Since I'm white, probably not very far


BINGO!! :winking0071:

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 03:12 PM
Also take the wnba for example. From some of the women that I talked to who like sports the will not watch the wnba they will only watch the nba. Not that basketball is offensive or is degrading anyone but it is another example of a demographic (females) not wanting to watch their own kind entertain them in a certian way. I know it is kind of far fetched but some white people may be ok with hearing black people use racists terms but do not want to hear their own kind use racists terms. Again not saying that it is right but that is my spin on it.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 03:17 PM
BINGO!! :winking0071:
Ahh, but if I was black?

mrveggieman
03-23-2012, 03:26 PM
Ahh, but if I was black?


And white people were willing to pay you to insult them you are getting over like a fat cat.

Look at it this way. There are more white people who like chris rock than black people who like rush or glen beck.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 03:27 PM
With stuff like this context means a whole lot more than content, and I feel like that is getting lost in this discussion.

great point. context is a huge deal.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 03:29 PM
Woah, woah, woah.

I find Chris Rock funny, hilarious, in fact, and when he does use derogatory terms like 'honkey' and 'cracker' he does use it in a way that's funny and kind of makes you think.

I don't know why he's allowed to use those words though. Seems to me what's sauce for the goose...

it's because of the guy he is. He's not know to be racists and he's not malicious in his delivery. Also, he knows that white racial terms just don't have the meaning that they do for other races.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 03:34 PM
And white people were willing to pay you to insult them you are getting over like a fat cat.
You're assuming Rock's fan base is all or even mostly white, I would venture to guess that it's actually closer to 50/50 than anything. Which would mean that millions of black people are paying millions of dollars to go watch him make racist comments.


Look at it this way. There are more white people who like chris rock than black people who like rush or glen beck.
Well, yeah, but that's like saying there's more black people who like Eminem than Hendrix or Kravitz.

Star_Cards
03-23-2012, 03:43 PM
You're assuming Rock's fan base is all or even mostly white, I would venture to guess that it's actually closer to 50/50 than anything. Which would mean that millions of black people are paying millions of dollars to go watch him make racist comments.


Well, yeah, but that's like saying there's more black people who like Eminem than Hendrix or Kravitz.

no way his fan base it 50/50. I did a quick search and saw a post claiming that America is about 80% white and about 12% black. Even if that was way off and 60% or 70% of americans are whites there are going to be way more white fans of any big ticket comedian. If the 80% and 12% numbers are close it would only take about an 1/8 of America's white population to equal the numbers if america's entire black population were fans of chris rock. Let's face it. He's funny but there's no way all or even close to all of america's blacks like chris rock... and yes I know there are lots of other countries that would have fans of chris rock. I'll still say the majority of his fan are white.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 05:08 PM
no way his fan base it 50/50. I did a quick search and saw a post claiming that America is about 80% white and about 12% black. Even if that was way off and 60% or 70% of americans are whites there are going to be way more white fans of any big ticket comedian. If the 80% and 12% numbers are close it would only take about an 1/8 of America's white population to equal the numbers if america's entire black population were fans of chris rock. Let's face it. He's funny but there's no way all or even close to all of america's blacks like chris rock... and yes I know there are lots of other countries that would have fans of chris rock. I'll still say the majority of his fan are white.

By that logic, more white people are fans of Al Sharpton, Malcolm X and Dr. King than black people are because there's more white people...

AUTaxMan
03-23-2012, 05:19 PM
That's totally fair and I'm not by any means saying you're "wrong" but I do think you should be proud of that past, at least to a degree.
The way I see it, I'm proud to be a Canadian, first and foremost. On 1 side of my family I'm third generation Canadian and for a few generations before that they were American and before that Scottish. On the other side, though, I'm first generation, as my mother was born in Germany. Maybe it's because I'm a little closer to that heritage than you maybe are, but I'm proud of both sides, for, if not for them being who they were I wouldn't be who I am and I am more proud just to be me than any nationality or race. I just keep sight of the fact that my nationality and race (among other things) is part of who I am.

Would I say It's "better" to be German than any other nationality? No...well, maybe the Dutch (j/k). But am I proud of my heritage? Absolutely because it goes a long way to making me who I am today.

In Canada, do blacks refer to themselves as African-Canadians?

AUTaxMan
03-23-2012, 05:22 PM
By that logic, more white people are fans of Al Sharpton, Malcolm X and Dr. King than black people are because there's more white people...

For the record, I am a huge Al Sharpton fan.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 05:29 PM
In Canada, do blacks refer to themselves as African-Canadians?
Not that I am aware of. Every black person I've known has referred to themselves as "black".The history of black people in Canada is a LOT different from that of the US since slavery was never an issue up here. Also, I've met more black people who were of Caribbean (Jamaica, Haiti, etc) descent than African.

Canada was to busy using Chinese workers to build the railway and throwing First-Nations people in Residential schools to worry about blacks.*


* - I never said racism was never an issue in Canada, just very, very different.

ETA - I wasn't saying there are no white Sharpton fans. I'm just wondering if that logic makes any sense because that logic would lead to those leaders of the black community having WAY more white fans than black.

AUTaxMan
03-23-2012, 05:33 PM
ETA - I wasn't saying there are no white Sharpton fans. I'm just wondering if that logic makes any sense because that logic would lead to those leaders of the black community having WAY more white fans than black.

I was being facetious, and no, that logic made no sense.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 05:37 PM
I actually like Sharpton. I'm not convinced he wants real equality, but no one can rhyme like that man.

AUTaxMan
03-23-2012, 06:03 PM
I actually like Sharpton. I'm not convinced he wants real equality, but no one can rhyme like that man.

I find him truly disgusting. He will flat out lie about things to promote his race-hustling agenda.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 06:09 PM
I find him truly disgusting. He will flat out lie about things to promote his race-hustling agenda.
Maybe I just don't pay enough attention

theonedru
03-23-2012, 06:19 PM
Oh, I understand that for certain. I just don't understand why the fact I know I'm German and Scottish while you have no idea whether you're Kenyan or Nigerian means it's wrong for me to be proud I'm white/European. Personally, I don't care what colour I am. I am proud of where I came from and where I came from makes me white, so maybe I am proud to be white. I'm just not allowed to say that to anyone.

Maybe it's because I'm a Canadian. We have VERY different race relation issues and histories in our two countries. I only get to see American racism, but the effects are felt here in Canada in the form of ideas like "only white people can be racist" and other myths.

You make for a good point, having lived long periods of time in both Canada and the USA I find that here in the USA its the African/Asian/Latino/whatever American where in Canada its more I am a Canadian of whatever decent. It's line Canadians are more proud of the Fact they are Canadian then their heritage and Amricans are more focused on their heritage then the fact they are Americans.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 06:46 PM
You make for a good point, having lived long periods of time in both Canada and the USA I find that here in the USA its the African/Asian/Latino/whatever American where in Canada its more I am a Canadian of whatever decent. It's line Canadians are more proud of the Fact they are Canadian then their heritage and Amricans are more focused on their heritage then the fact they are Americans.
It's interesting to hear someone else say that. It's a thought I've had for a long time watching the US, but not having lived there, I wouldn't really know.

I'm wondering if maybe it's because America is the "great melting pot" so people feel more need to hold onto their heritage in such ways, whereas Canada is more the "great mosaic" and holding onto your heritage is actually a major part of Canadian culture.

BGT Masters
03-23-2012, 07:03 PM
I live here and thats how I feel as well. People old their heritage higher than the fact they are Americans. Not exactly sure, maybe its to stand out more. Many people here seem to have a look at me type quality about them or a desperate need to feel unique. And for the record I don't care for Sharpton, Limbaugh, Beck or Jesse Jackson.

Wickabee
03-23-2012, 07:09 PM
Beck used to be funny. Now he's just sad.