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View Full Version : Gas prices grow more under Obama than Carter



mikesilvia
04-11-2012, 08:05 AM
http://www.usnews.com/news/blogs/washington-whispers/2012/04/09/gas-prices-grow-more-under-obama-than-carter

Let me guess, into Obama's 4th year it's still Bush's fault?

duane1969
04-11-2012, 08:24 AM
That article is 2 days old so the 103.79% is low. Gas when Obama took office was $1.79 per gallon. The current national average is $3.91. That is rise of 118.4%.

shrewsbury
04-11-2012, 08:39 AM
and nobody says he is in with the oil industry, but that is all you heard when bush was in office.

in fact they now say the president cannot effect the price of gas

pghin08
04-11-2012, 08:46 AM
and nobody says he is in with the oil industry, but that is all you heard when bush was in office.

in fact they now say the president cannot effect the price of gas

This has basically been true since the dawn of the automobile.

shrewsbury
04-11-2012, 08:59 AM
i know, but that's all you heard when bush was in office

pghin08
04-11-2012, 09:04 AM
i know, but that's all you heard when bush was in office

Those people were idiots who were just looking to blame Bush for every single thing that they deemed wrong in the world. For some people, if you dislike the person in office, you then blame them for everything and give them credit for nothing. I always laughed at the people who said Bush was responsible for higher gas prices, just like I laugh at the ones who say Obama is.

mikesilvia
04-11-2012, 09:17 AM
The President CAN effect gas prices, but he is consistently up against:

1. Three Billion Chinese and Indians adding tons of drivers to the roads each year by producing $3k cars. If they add 10% of their population as new drivers, that 300 million new drivers or roughly the population of the entire U.S.

2. People in the U.S. continue to drive big, gas guzzlers and fuel efficient cars are not wanted. I saw a report today that only 1/3 of hybrid drivers purchase another hyrid. Only about 3% of sales are hybrids. It's our culture!

3. Speculators! Gas prices are only going up because of futures contracts. We had a HOT winter so there is plenty of supply. We need to regulate speculation.

4. Weak dollar. When a government continues to print and borrow money and get off the gold standard, oil exporters will raise prices to make up for the weak dollar. We can't print or borrow our way out of this, but Obama continues to do it.

A U.S. President can effect gas prices in the short-term by starting new initiatives like 1) releasing some of the national fuel reserves and 2) expanding drilling off shore and in Alaska, and other untapped areas. It's tougher in the long-term because a follow on President can reverse polices.

Obama does NOT want cheap gas. He wants high prices because he believes Americans need to go to alternative fuel sources. He invested BIG time into failed green companies. He was hoping that with high gas prices and big government investments in alternative fuels, he would get Americans off of oil. But instead we have high gas prices and failed companies. It really is President Carter all over again.

Star_Cards
04-11-2012, 09:21 AM
Those people were idiots who were just looking to blame Bush for every single thing that they deemed wrong in the world. For some people, if you dislike the person in office, you then blame them for everything and give them credit for nothing. I always laughed at the people who said Bush was responsible for higher gas prices, just like I laugh at the ones who say Obama is.

^ I agree.

pghin08
04-11-2012, 09:23 AM
The President CAN effect gas prices, but he is consistently up against:

1. Three Billion Chinese and Indians adding tons of drivers to the roads each year by producing $3k cars. If they add 10% of their population as new drivers, that 300 million new drivers or roughly the population of the entire U.S.

2. People in the U.S. continue to drive big, gas guzzlers and fuel efficient cars are not wanted. I saw a report today that only 1/3 of hybrid drivers purchase another hyrid. Only about 3% of sales are hybrids. It's our culture!

3. Speculators! Gas prices are only going up because of futures contracts. We had a HOT winter so there is plenty of supply. We need to regulate speculation.

4. Weak dollar. When a government continues to print and borrow money and get off the gold standard, oil exporters will raise prices to make up for the weak dollar. We can't print or borrow our way out of this, but Obama continues to do it.

A U.S. President can effect gas prices in the short-term by starting new initiatives like 1) releasing some of the national fuel reserves and 2) expanding drilling off shore and in Alaska, and other untapped areas. It's tougher in the long-term because a follow on President can reverse polices.

Obama does NOT want cheap gas. He wants high prices because he believes Americans need to go to alternative fuel sources. He invested BIG time into failed green companies. He was hoping that with high gas prices and big government investments in alternative fuels, he would get Americans off of oil. But instead we have high gas prices and failed companies. It really is President Carter all over again.

I disagree with the bolded part in a big way. Were Obama able to control gas prices, this is when he'd want them the cheapest- going into his re-election. Higher gas prices means more strife, more strife usually means bad things for incumbents.

Also, don't forget what is probably the main reason for the increase: the increasing tensions between Iran and Israel. Speculators have priced in the possibility of war between the two (according to a commodity fund manager that I talked to at work last week, they're placing a 25% chance of war between Iran and Israel).

You're totally right about the Indian and Chinese demand for gas.

roaddogg02316
04-11-2012, 09:25 AM
It's a real shame how it is. There really is no reason for the prices to be like this. It is all speculation. They don't just buy the oil. They wait to see what it will be in the future or something. I'm no expert.
I also hear there is more surplus of oil now than there was years ago when gas was at a very low price.

mikesilvia
04-11-2012, 09:32 AM
I disagree with the bolded part in a big way. Were Obama able to control gas prices, this is when he'd want them the cheapest- going into his re-election. Higher gas prices means more strife, more strife usually means bad things for incumbents.

There is plenty of truth to this, but he made a bad judgement call when it comes to his energy policy. Do you remember the energy secretary's comments in front of the Senate? The long-term Obama energy policy doesn't make sense for his short-term re-election policy. I have a feeling he will do a LOT of things leading up to the elections. A President CAN control short-term policy, but Republicans will likely try to block him leading up to the election. In that way BOTH are putting party before nation.


Also, don't forget what is probably the main reason for the increase: the increasing tensions between Iran and Israel. Speculators have priced in the possibility of war between the two (according to a commodity fund manager that I talked to at work last week, they're placing a 25% chance of war between Iran and Israel).

This does not explain for the more than doubling of gas prices under Obama. It accounts for some (maybe 10-20%), but not the bulk.


You're totally right about the Indian and Chinese demand for gas.

It's amazing to me that people don't understand this. If you look at who is buying up all the available drilling land and signing HUGE deals, it's the Chinese and Indians. I feel this account for the bulk of price increases and NO president can stop this.

Another thing Obama could do is to STOP allowing U.S companies to export oil, or at least add a significant tariff. It baffles me that we have DOUBLE the gas prices but we allow U.S. companies to export oil. We import millions of barrels. Why in the world do we export???? That alone is a WASTE of energy and money! This falls on Congress as much as Obama.

T-206
04-11-2012, 09:32 AM
Wait untill a republican gets back into the office. It will be all the Presidents fault again.

I work in the oil field myself for the past 16 years. and No I dont like the high prices My guys work over 100 hrs a week becuase when we try to hire people they have a criminal record wich wont allow them near explosives wich we have in our camp, they cant pass the pepe test, or after talking to them they decide it not the kind of work they want to do. If gas stays around 2.50-3.00 they average 70-90 hrs a week a little more managable for their personal lives. You can do a research when a Demorat is in office the gas is most of the time higher than a republican.

Here is a little known fact. The gas station which sells the gas makes about .03 cents per galloon. The manufacturer makes about .25 cents a galloon, and the government makes the most profit. Reason The government makes a profit on the chemicals to stabilize the gas into the state where you can purchase it. Government make money on shipping it to the gas station, Government makes the taxes on the gas when you buy it, and alot of hidden taxes I dont know.

duane1969
04-11-2012, 09:32 AM
While I don't believe that the president can wave a magic wand and make gas prices decline, I do believe that the president has the power to influence prices to some degree.
*He can certainly release reserves to drive the price down, something that Bush did (twice I think).
*He can negotiate for better trade deals that results in a lower crude cost to our refineries and require gasoline companies to pass that price reduction along to consumers as part of the deal.
*He could lift some of the restrictions on off-shore deep-water drilling.
*He could place export restrictions on U.S. oil drilling companies that would make it more feasible for them to keep our oil here rather than export it to other countries.

I don't think that Obama wants higher gasoline prices, but I do think that he wants to push his party's agenda of green energy and I think that they have put the cart before the horse and are trying to force a green energy shift to occur before the technology exist for it to happen.

pghin08
04-11-2012, 09:41 AM
There is plenty of truth to this, but he made a bad judgement call when it comes to his energy policy. Do you remember the energy secretary's comments in front of the Senate? The long-term Obama energy policy doesn't make sense for his short-term re-election policy. I have a feeling he will do a LOT of things leading up to the elections. A President CAN control short-term policy, but Republicans will likely try to block him leading up to the election. In that way BOTH are putting party before nation.



This does not explain for the more than doubling of gas prices under Obama. It accounts for some (maybe 10-20%), but not the bulk.



It's amazing to me that people don't understand this. If you look at who is buying up all the available drilling land and signing HUGE deals, it's the Chinese and Indians. I feel this account for the bulk of price increases and NO president can stop this.

Another thing Obama could do is to STOP allowing U.S companies to export oil, or at least add a significant tariff. It baffles me that we have DOUBLE the gas prices but we allow U.S. companies to export oil. We import millions of barrels. Why in the world do we export???? That alone is a WASTE of energy and money! This falls on Congress as much as Obama.


But think about it, when Obama took office, in the teeth of the recession, crude oil prices had plummeted to less than $40 a barrel. Now it's back up over $100. Just gauging by that (which is not entirely correct, since the price of gas doesn't always PERFECTLY mirror the price of oil), a doubling sounds about right.

I also agree that both parties put their agenda before the people, and that way of action extends far beyond oil prices.

mikesilvia
04-11-2012, 09:58 AM
I honestly don't think Obama is worried about the price of gas and his re-election. He will have nearly $1 billion dollars and a media in his pocket. He will continue to EFFECTIVELY claim that Republicans hate 1) minorities 2) poor people 3) old people and 4) women.

He will have advantages that most incumbents do NOT have. Gas prices will NOT matter. He will have such deep pockets, a media cheer leading him, and Americans wanting FREE everything, that there is LITTLE chance he loses re-election regardless of the economy or gas prices.

pghin08
04-11-2012, 10:23 AM
I honestly don't think Obama is worried about the price of gas and his re-election. He will have nearly $1 billion dollars and a media in his pocket. He will continue to EFFECTIVELY claim that Republicans hate 1) minorities 2) poor people 3) old people and 4) women.

He will have advantages that most incumbents do NOT have. Gas prices will NOT matter. He will have such deep pockets, a media cheer leading him, and Americans wanting FREE everything, that there is LITTLE chance he loses re-election regardless of the economy or gas prices.

Where's the media support for Obama? Most things I watch or read are extremely critical, unlike 2008.

duane1969
04-11-2012, 11:06 AM
Where's the media support for Obama? Most things I watch or read are extremely critical, unlike 2008.

I haven't seen much that is critical of Obama. I see a lot of apologist stuff, a lot of making excuses and passing the buck, but I can't say that I have seen mainstream media criticizing him.

Look at the massive amount of criticism of Bush when gas prices were hovering around $3.00 a gallon in 2006 and 2007 and look at the trickle of criticism of Obama now with gas prices at $4.00 a gallon. The media bias is blatant. In 2006 and 2007 gas prices were the central focus of all news agencies, now gas prices are only occasionally mentioned.

Is the media outright supporting Obama? Maybe not. Is the media supporting Obama by avoiding the major criticism and expose' pieces that point the finger at Obama like they did with Bush? Yes.

shrewsbury
04-11-2012, 11:17 AM
our local paper, which is certainly not conservative, has started a lot of anti obama articles, interesting

AUTaxMan
04-11-2012, 12:07 PM
I disagree with the bolded part in a big way. Were Obama able to control gas prices, this is when he'd want them the cheapest- going into his re-election. Higher gas prices means more strife, more strife usually means bad things for incumbents.

Also, don't forget what is probably the main reason for the increase: the increasing tensions between Iran and Israel. Speculators have priced in the possibility of war between the two (according to a commodity fund manager that I talked to at work last week, they're placing a 25% chance of war between Iran and Israel).

You're totally right about the Indian and Chinese demand for gas.

Actually, you're wrong about this. His energy secretary stated when he came into power than one of his goals was to increase gas prices (or something along those lines). He has recently recanted that statement, but it is true. It's the only way green energy can be economically competitive.

AUTaxMan
04-11-2012, 12:09 PM
Where's the media support for Obama? Most things I watch or read are extremely critical, unlike 2008.

Not sure if serious. You're smarter than that. The mainstream media practically never criticizes Obama. And did you see the head of the AP fawning over him last week?

pghin08
04-11-2012, 12:12 PM
Actually, you're wrong about this. His energy secretary stated when he came into power than one of his goals was to increase gas prices (or something along those lines). He has recently recanted that statement, but it is true. It's the only way green energy can be economically competitive.

Chu didn't say that. He said he wanted a to raise the tax on gasoline, which to this point, the administration hasn't done.

duane1969
04-11-2012, 12:16 PM
Actually, you're wrong about this. His energy secretary stated when he came into power than one of his goals was to increase gas prices (or something along those lines). He has recently recanted that statement, but it is true. It's the only way green energy can be economically competitive.

You want to enjoy a real laugh? Read what Secretary Energy Steven Chu said about himself and gas prices...

http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/20/chu-i-give-myself-another-a-on-gas-prices/

BGT Masters
04-11-2012, 01:17 PM
Te chart said gas prices were under $2 in 2009. Are they sure I can't remember gas being less than $2 in recent memory at all. I do enjoy his grading. I wish I could have graded myself in school. I would have been the valedictorian tied with everyone else that could grade themselves. ;) At least he showed restraint only giving himself an A minus.

pspstatus
04-11-2012, 04:56 PM
Let's be honest. Gas hit 4$ for me when Bush was president. Now it's happening again with Obama. The only way we can say it's their fault is if we blame them for letting the greed of oil companies go unchecked and allowing speculators to have such a heavy influence on the market. And what's worse is that a lot of that market influence is actually purposeful manipulation to put even more money into the pockets of the greedy.

duwal
04-11-2012, 05:14 PM
people seem to find anything to complain about. Really?? $4 a gallon? Big deal

BGT Masters
04-11-2012, 05:17 PM
If its really more than doubled in 3 years that is a really big deal. If the cost of gas goes up so does pretty much everything else.

AUTaxMan
04-11-2012, 05:25 PM
Let's be honest. Gas hit 4$ for me when Bush was president. Now it's happening again with Obama. The only way we can say it's their fault is if we blame them for letting the greed of oil companies go unchecked and allowing speculators to have such a heavy influence on the market. And what's worse is that a lot of that market influence is actually purposeful manipulation to put even more money into the pockets of the greedy.

Does profit = greed?

MadMan1978
04-11-2012, 07:42 PM
this is NOT the presidents fault

Learn how to read the market guys...this last huge boost was speculation...

Even your news sourced said that the price has been greatly effected by this...

MadMan1978
04-11-2012, 07:43 PM
Does profit = greed?
with the profits the Oil Companies are posting now?

YES!

Gas and oil are 2 products that should have price controls.
They greatly effect the prices of all other products.

MadMan1978
04-11-2012, 07:46 PM
The President CAN effect gas prices, but he is consistently up against:

1. Three Billion Chinese and Indians adding tons of drivers to the roads each year by producing $3k cars. If they add 10% of their population as new drivers, that 300 million new drivers or roughly the population of the entire U.S.

2. People in the U.S. continue to drive big, gas guzzlers and fuel efficient cars are not wanted. I saw a report today that only 1/3 of hybrid drivers purchase another hyrid. Only about 3% of sales are hybrids. It's our culture!

3. Speculators! Gas prices are only going up because of futures contracts. We had a HOT winter so there is plenty of supply. We need to regulate speculation.

4. Weak dollar. When a government continues to print and borrow money and get off the gold standard, oil exporters will raise prices to make up for the weak dollar. We can't print or borrow our way out of this, but Obama continues to do it.

A U.S. President can effect gas prices in the short-term by starting new initiatives like 1) releasing some of the national fuel reserves and 2) expanding drilling off shore and in Alaska, and other untapped areas. It's tougher in the long-term because a follow on President can reverse polices.

Obama does NOT want cheap gas. He wants high prices because he believes Americans need to go to alternative fuel sources. He invested BIG time into failed green companies. He was hoping that with high gas prices and big government investments in alternative fuels, he would get Americans off of oil. But instead we have high gas prices and failed companies. It really is President Carter all over again.


Are you for real?

I mean I know you hate Obama but really do you believe that?

mikesilvia
04-11-2012, 08:20 PM
Are you for real?

I mean I know you hate O

I do NOT hate Obama. I like him as a person VERY much and would take a bullet for the man WITHOUT hesitation. You shouldn't take disagreement for hate. People HATED Bush, I do not HATE anyone. I do hate cancer, genocides and evils of the world, but there is no person that I hate.

AUTaxMan
04-11-2012, 08:26 PM
with the profits the Oil Companies are posting now?

YES!

Gas and oil are 2 products that should have price controls.
They greatly effect the prices of all other products.

Do American oil companies control gas prices? How much profit do they make per gallon of gasoline?

Do American oil companies control oil prices?

MadMan1978
04-11-2012, 09:12 PM
Do American oil companies control gas prices? How much profit do they make per gallon of gasoline?

Do American oil companies control oil prices?


do we controls the prices? We meaning people...


Once again you clearly dont understand the impact of gas on the already fragile economy...

pghin08
04-11-2012, 09:19 PM
Do American oil companies control gas prices? How much profit do they make per gallon of gasoline?

Do American oil companies control oil prices?

No.

AUTaxMan
04-11-2012, 10:35 PM
do we controls the prices? We meaning people...


Once again you clearly dont understand the impact of gas on the already fragile economy...

No, you have clearly demonstrated that you know nothing about what dictates the prices of oil and gasoline and the oil industry in general. I work in this industry every day, and I'll be happy to explain how gas and oil prices work if you're truly interested.

BGT Masters
04-11-2012, 10:42 PM
No, you have clearly demonstrated that you know nothing about what dictates the prices of oil and gasoline and the oil industry in general. I work in this industry every day, and I'll be happy to explain how gas and oil prices work if you're truly interested.

I'm not trying to be smart or anything but I honestly wouldn't mind hearing it when you have the time.

pspstatus
04-11-2012, 11:56 PM
Does profit = greed?

Not necessarily. The problem is that no matter how much money they make it's never enough.

More, more, more= Greed.

AUTaxMan
04-12-2012, 12:05 AM
Not necessarily. The problem is that no matter how much money they make it's never enough.

More, more, more= Greed.

At what point are they supposed to stop making money?

mrveggieman
04-12-2012, 08:33 AM
I'm not trying to be smart or anything but I honestly wouldn't mind hearing it when you have the time.


Yeah I am curious to hear what he has to say as well. We are all ears mrtaxman.

tsjct
04-12-2012, 08:57 AM
How about this. REMOVE the 48.1 cents per gallon in taxes we pay at the pump???? But then that would cut into Obama's spending, bailouts, Green energy loans, etc.

duane1969
04-12-2012, 08:59 AM
Do American oil companies control gas prices?

Well, Exxon Mobile produces 3.9 million barrels of oil per day. Then, as the largest refiner in the world, they refine it into several products including gasoline and sell it. So yes, I would say that at least one American oil company has a direct impact on prices at the pump.


At what point are they supposed to stop making money?

I don't think that anyone wants them to stop making money. I just think that people are tired of paying more and more of their small incomes for gasoline only to keep hearing how companies like Exxon Mobile are posting record profits every time you turn around.

What other company in the world can boast yearly profits of nearly $500 billion a year?

pghin08
04-12-2012, 09:12 AM
Well, Exxon Mobile produces 3.9 million barrels of oil per day. Then, as the largest refiner in the world, they refine it into several products including gasoline and sell it. So yes, I would say that at least one American oil company has a direct impact on prices at the pump.



I don't think that anyone wants them to stop making money. I just think that people are tired of paying more and more of their small incomes for gasoline only to keep hearing how companies like Exxon Mobile are posting record profits every time you turn around.

What other company in the world can boast yearly profits of nearly $500 billion a year?


Dude, Duane are you okay? I think your computer was hacked by a liberal.

Theodor Madison
04-12-2012, 09:14 AM
I believe, He tends to annex the oil companies on be half of the poor people. Or use the fact that the oil belongs to the people, a ploy to get reelected. As far as the media, hollywood, and minorities tend to lean to Obama.

duane1969
04-12-2012, 09:18 AM
Dude, Duane are you okay? I think your computer was hacked by a liberal.

Nah, I just had a Starbucks coffee and a scone for breakfast... :smokin:

pghin08
04-12-2012, 09:19 AM
Nah, I just had a Starbucks coffee and a scone for breakfast... :smokin:

While reading the Huffington Post and wearing pretentiously thick black-rimmed glasses?

duane1969
04-12-2012, 09:23 AM
While reading the Huffington Post and wearing pretentiously thick black-rimmed glasses?

I actually did do some reading on HuffPost yesterday evening...OMG! I am being indoctrinated!!!

Quick! Somebody bring me an expensive, illegal Cuban cigar and turn on FoxNews!!

:pound: :pound: :pound:

pspstatus
04-12-2012, 04:28 PM
At what point are they supposed to stop making money?


I'm not saying they should stop making money. I'm just asking when is it ever going to be enough. It's like Duane said in a post these gas companies are making record profits year after year while it gets harder and harder for us to pay for said gas. I know gas companies aren't the only ones who have an imapct on gas prices but I can't believe they have no impact.

AUTaxMan
04-12-2012, 05:45 PM
I'm not saying they should stop making money. I'm just asking when is it ever going to be enough. It's like Duane said in a post these gas companies are making record profits year after year while it gets harder and harder for us to pay for said gas. I know gas companies aren't the only ones who have an imapct on gas prices but I can't believe they have no impact.

They don't have no impact, but (a) they have virtually no influence over the price of crude (although they profit from producing it), and (b) they make basically nothing on the sale of refined gasoline. The only real place they can influence the price of gasoline is by taking a voluntary hit on net refining profits, which is probably about 18-22% of the cost of a gallon of gasoline, but even that is market driven.

At that point, if they take a cut, they are cutting into their bottom line, which I assume their shareholders wouldn't be too keen on. The next question to ask is who are their shareholders. Anyone with a retirement account can find one by looking in the mirror.

Easiest way to lower gasoline prices is to (a) lower excise taxes - immediate relief, (b) have a domestic drilling policy - (i) speculators don't have to worry as much about supply squeezes due to middle east turmoil, (ii) increased supply, (c) return to pre-Obama EPA emissions regs - increases production costs which are passed along to the consumer, (d) strengthen the dollar, upon which crude prices are based.

pspstatus
04-12-2012, 06:49 PM
They don't have no impact, but (a) they have virtually no influence over the price of crude (although they profit from producing it), and (b) they make basically nothing on the sale of refined gasoline. The only real place they can influence the price of gasoline is by taking a voluntary hit on net refining profits, which is probably about 18-22% of the cost of a gallon of gasoline, but even that is market driven.

At that point, if they take a cut, they are cutting into their bottom line, which I assume their shareholders wouldn't be too keen on. The next question to ask is who are their shareholders. Anyone with a retirement account can find one by looking in the mirror.

Easiest way to lower gasoline prices is to (a) lower excise taxes - immediate relief, (b) have a domestic drilling policy - (i) speculators don't have to worry as much about supply squeezes due to middle east turmoil, (ii) increased supply, (c) return to pre-Obama EPA emissions regs - increases production costs which are passed along to the consumer, (d) strengthen the dollar, upon which crude prices are based.

Then how is it that these companies still make record profits. Where does all that money come from?

AUTaxMan
04-12-2012, 07:30 PM
Then how is it that these companies still make record profits. Where does all that money come from?

Refining and production.