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pwaldo
04-25-2012, 10:44 PM
http://news.yahoo.com/egypts-most-popular-comedian-adel-imam-guilty-insulting-152733011--abc-news-topstories.html


The verdict of a popular Egyptian comedian convicted of offending Islam has been upheld by a Cairo court, raising fears among Egyptian liberals and secularists about the Islamic tide rising since the downfall of former President Hosni Mubarak last year

Imam, one of the Arab world's most famous actors, was first convicted in February of "contempt of religion" - illegal under Egypt's penal code - and appealed. The case was brought against him by an ultra-conservative Islamist lawyer named Asran Mansour for three films Imam made in the early- to mid-1990s. The titles are "The Terrorist," "Morgan Ahmed Morgan" and "Terrorism and Kebab."

Imam, 71, played a fundamentalist terrorist in the first and a corrupt businessman in the third. Mansour accused Imam of blasphemous mocking of Muslim symbols like beards and the jilbab, a loose-fitting robe worn by some Muslims.

The sentence was three months in jail and 1000 Egyptian pounds, around $170. Imam's lawyers have said they will appeal the verdict that was "given on the wrong legal basis."

"My client's films were certified, not censored, by surveillance authorities before their release to the public," lawyer Sawat Hussein told Reuters today.

Condemnations poured in from Egypt's art world and beyond. The Egyptian Creativity Front said the ruling would limit the freedom of expression and lead to restriction on art. Author of "The Yacoubian Building" Alaa al-Aswany said on Twitter that he disagrees with Imam politically but the ruling sends Egypt "back to the darkness of the Middle Ages."

In January, Islamists won about three quarters of the seats in parliament and several Islamist candidates are frontrunners in next month's presidential election.

The conviction of an Arab icon with a career spanning half a century has liberals shuddering.

"[Imam's case] will make any writer, director or actor think before considering the role of a Muslim figure," Egyptian entertainment reporter Tarek el-Shinnawi told Al Ahram newspaper.

duane1969
04-25-2012, 11:37 PM
He should be happy with the 90 days of jail and small fine seeing as most people in the Middle East who insult Islam are rewarded with a bullet to the back of the head.

ensbergcollector
04-25-2012, 11:47 PM
yeah, and people say things here in america are just as bad for people who oppose christianity! smh

habsheaven
04-26-2012, 08:52 AM
yeah, and people say things here in america are just as bad for people who oppose christianity! smh

Things would be just as bad if you didn't have a separation of Church and State.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 08:59 AM
I think it is wrong for the sentence this guy got. If he indeed did something that offended God/Allah etc that that's is God's place to judge not man's. I'm sure glad things are not like that in america. Oh wait a minute yes they are.

angel0430
04-26-2012, 09:38 AM
I think it is wrong for the sentence this guy got. If he indeed did something that offended God/Allah etc that that's is God's place to judge not man's. I'm sure glad things are not like that in america. Oh wait a minute yes they are.

You also need to realize that he was born in a place where they have this rules, called laws, that you need to follow. They have to abide by their rules regardless of what we think. We have the luxury of freedom of expression, they don't.

duane1969
04-26-2012, 09:42 AM
You also need to realize that he was born in a place where they have this rules, called laws, that you need to follow. They have to abide by their rules regardless of what we think. We have the luxury of freedom of expression, they don't.

It is AMAZING the number of people who have no concept of this.

angel0430
04-26-2012, 09:54 AM
It is AMAZING the number of people who have no concept of this.

I know right....

Star_Cards
04-26-2012, 09:58 AM
yeah, and people say things here in america are just as bad for people who oppose christianity! smh

who says that?


as for the story, it make me love the fact that we have the types of freedoms that keep that sort of thing from happening here.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 10:04 AM
You also need to realize that he was born in a place where they have this rules, called laws, that you need to follow. They have to abide by their rules regardless of what we think. We have the luxury of freedom of expression, they don't.


Let a big name person (I don't know a politician mabey) come out and say he/she is muslim or wants to convert to islam and see how quickly his/her career goes down the toilet. Freedom of expresion in america, what a joke.

Star_Cards
04-26-2012, 10:06 AM
I think it is wrong for the sentence this guy got. If he indeed did something that offended God/Allah etc that that's is God's place to judge not man's. I'm sure glad things are not like that in america. Oh wait a minute yes they are.

there are people who judge, on all sides of religion and nonreligion, but there probably aren't many examples of a person being jailed like this because he offended a religion. People, religious or not, say offensive things about other religions or people without religion all the time and they rarely have legal action taken against them and are punished.

Star_Cards
04-26-2012, 10:14 AM
Let a big name person (I don't know a politician mabey) come out and say he/she is muslim or wants to convert to islam and see how quickly his/her career goes down the toilet. Freedom of expresion in america, what a joke.

you may be right that some people would boycott if a top movie star converted to islam, but if you think that conversion or if a celebrity offended any religion here and either of those would bring legal action and prison time you'd have to be joking.

I get your point that a lot of citizens don't respect and fear the muslim faith unjustly when it comes to muslims in America, but public opinion and actual legal action and prison time are two greatly different things.

shrewsbury
04-26-2012, 10:17 AM
mrveg that would be freedom of religion not expression.

also, i would hope, that if someone was changing/gaining religion, they would have their priorities in place and losing a job means little compared to finding your god. but i do agree their career would be heading towards its end quicker than usual, which is not right.

i am surprised there are so many muslims who follow these rules, i have no problem saying some of these "laws" are just flat out wrong. if god wanted something changed, he would change it and i find it hard to believe us humans can offend god, he is god and a little above all that.

islam would have no issue in taking over the world, killing all that don't agree, killing all that don't "fit in" and oppressing every woman and child on the planet.

i know it is not all muslims, but it seems it is many of them.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 10:21 AM
you may be right that some people would boycott if a top movie star converted to islam, but if you think that conversion or if a celebrity offended any religion here and either of those would bring legal action and prison time you'd have to be joking.

I get your point that a lot of citizens don't respect and fear the muslim faith unjustly when it comes to muslims in America, but public opinion and actual legal action and prison time are two greatly different things.


You are right that according to our laws here in america one cannot have actions taken against them for the peaceful practice of their chosen religion. However it's sad that one cannot openly practice and embrace their faith (or lack of one) for fear of retaliation or insults by others.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 10:24 AM
mrveg that would be freedom of religion not expression.

also, i would hope, that if someone was changing/gaining religion, they would have their priorities in place and losing a job means little compared to finding your god. but i do agree their career would be heading towards its end quicker than usual, which is not right.

i am surprised there are so many muslims who follow these rules, i have no problem saying some of these "laws" are just flat out wrong. if god wanted something changed, he would change it and i find it hard to believe us humans can offend god, he is god and a little above all that.

islam would have no issue in taking over the world, killing all that don't agree, killing all that don't "fit in" and oppressing every woman and child on the planet.

i know it is not all muslims, but it seems it is many of them.

You make a couple of good points but keep in mind their are religious nuts in all religions from islam to christanity to santanism or anything else. If we stand by and do nothing when someone's right to freedom of religion is oppressed don't expect anyone to stand by when your right to freedom of religion is oppressed.

Star_Cards
04-26-2012, 10:41 AM
You are right that according to our laws here in america one cannot have actions taken against them for the peaceful practice of their chosen religion. However it's sad that one cannot openly practice and embrace their faith (or lack of one) for fear of retaliation or insults by others.


I agree it is disappointing that some people make it hard on muslims in america, but even knowing of those instances it's still not the majority. It's very ironic when those people happen to be the same people who are crying about them being limited in how they practice their religious preferences, when in fact they aren't.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 10:49 AM
I agree it is disappointing that some people make it hard on muslims in america, but even knowing of those instances it's still not the majority. It's very ironic when those people happen to be the same people who are crying about them being limited in how they practice their religious preferences, when in fact they aren't.


CHURCH!! :love0030::love0030::love0030:

duane1969
04-26-2012, 10:50 AM
Let a big name person (I don't know a politician mabey) come out and say he/she is muslim or wants to convert to islam and see how quickly his/her career goes down the toilet. Freedom of expresion in america, what a joke.

I find your perspective interesting. No one famous has recently converted and had their career hurt by their conversion, yet you make an assumption about what would happen if someone did and criticize America for lack of freedom of expression based entirely on your baseless assumption.

For point of reference, Micheal Jackson converted in 2003, less than 2 years after 9/11 when anti-Muslim sentiment was at it's height, and not only did it not hurt his career, his estate is still making millions after his death.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 10:59 AM
I find your perspective interesting. No one famous has recently converted and had their career hurt by their conversion, yet you make an assumption about what would happen if someone did and criticize America for lack of freedom of expression based entirely on your baseless assumption.

For point of reference, Micheal Jackson converted in 2003, less than 2 years after 9/11 when anti-Muslim sentiment was at it's height, and not only did it not hurt his career, his estate is still making millions after his death.


What about all of these obama being a muslim rumors? They are saying that him allegedly being a muslim is a bad thing, making him less of an american and unqualified to be POTUS. Or what about the senator, I forget his full name but I know his name first name is Keith who converted to Islam and your boy sean hannity told him on fox news to prove to him that he is not a terrorist. Seriously. It is ok to blatenly disrespect an elected official? Oh I forgot it is fox news and the elected official is Black and a Muslim two classes of people not highly looked upon by most conservatives.

ensbergcollector
04-26-2012, 11:07 AM
people on here make ridiculous comparisons. and they make them all based on speculation. you can't compare some celebrity possibly losing money to people being imprisoned for saying something bad or for being another religion.

any time things come up that happen in muslim countries, multiple people on here wash it away by saying "things here would be just as bad if christians had their way" or "there are extremists in every religion"

first of all, you can't compare facts with speculation. second of all, at what point do we stop trying to say there is no difference in christian fanatics in this country and the leadership and governing bodies of dozens of countries?

you cannot say america is just as bad because we don't have gay marriage or because you think someone might respond negatively to someone proclaiming they were muslim. you cannot compare that with people who are imprisoned for saying something bad about islam or people being imprisoned for years because they are a christian.

Star_Cards
04-26-2012, 11:12 AM
I agree. there's is validity in comparisons like that and speculating isn't a bad thing, but I tire of all of the posts using speculation as fact to prove points. At the very least one should at least word the speculation as such and not as fact... as they many times are. Even if one believes the speculation would happen, there's no way one could be 100% sure.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 11:14 AM
people on here make ridiculous comparisons. and they make them all based on speculation. you can't compare some celebrity possibly losing money to people being imprisoned for saying something bad or for being another religion.

any time things come up that happen in muslim countries, multiple people on here wash it away by saying "things here would be just as bad if christians had their way" or "there are extremists in every religion"

first of all, you can't compare facts with speculation. second of all, at what point do we stop trying to say there is no difference in christian fanatics in this country and the leadership and governing bodies of dozens of countries?

you cannot say america is just as bad because we don't have gay marriage or because you think someone might respond negatively to someone proclaiming they were muslim. you cannot compare that with people who are imprisoned for saying something bad about islam or people being imprisoned for years because they are a christian.


Being able to legally marry another consenting adult that agrees to marry you regardless of race, religion, gender, political preference is a basic human right. America is a land of hyprocricy for saying that one country is wrong for imprisoning someone for religious expression but then turns around and denies someone the right to marry whomever they please.

ensbergcollector
04-26-2012, 11:16 AM
Being able to legally marry another consenting adult that agrees to marry you regardless of race, religion, gender, political preference is a basic human right. America is a land of hyprocricy for saying that one country is wrong for imprisoning someone for religious expression but then turns around and denies someone the right to marry whomever they please.

i think anyone who has been in prison would beg to differ that the two are the same.

duane1969
04-26-2012, 11:20 AM
I agree. there's is validity in comparisons like that and speculating isn't a bad thing, but I tire of all of the posts using speculation as fact to prove points. At the very least one should at least word the speculation as such and not as fact... as they many times are. Even if one believes the speculation would happen, there's no way one could be 100% sure.

+1

That was my entire point.

duane1969
04-26-2012, 11:33 AM
What about all of these obama being a muslim rumors? They are saying that him allegedly being a muslim is a bad thing, making him less of an american and unqualified to be POTUS. Or what about the senator, I forget his full name but I know his name first name is Keith who converted to Islam and your boy sean hannity told him on fox news to prove to him that he is not a terrorist. Seriously. It is ok to blatenly disrespect an elected official? Oh I forgot it is fox news and the elected official is Black and a Muslim two classes of people not highly looked upon by most conservatives.

The questions about Obama being Muslim were relevant to his name which closely resembles the name of a popular terrorist. If a white Republican guy ran for president with the name Charles Mansion you can bet your bottom dollar that liberals would be calling him Charles Manson and comparing him to a crazed murderer.

And yes, it is OK to blatantly disrepect an elected offical. You and every other liberal I have ever known jumps at the chance to bash and sling insults about GWB. Liberals are not special. They do not get respect just because they have a superiority complex. You don't give it, don't expect to get it.

And I am tired of your blanket statement that conservatives are racist and anti-Muslim. I take personal offense at it. I am a conservative as are most of my family and not one of us is racist or anti-Muslim. Considering you hold the record for the highest number of racist comments on this board you are the last person that should be pointing the finger at other people and calling them racist. Remove the beam from your own eye before you try to remove the sawdust from someone else's.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 11:39 AM
The questions about Obama being Muslim were relevant to his name which closely resembles the name of a popular terrorist. If a white Republican guy ran for president with the name Charles Mansion you can bet your bottom dollar that liberals would be calling him Charles Manson and comparing him to a crazed murderer.

And yes, it is OK to blatantly disrepect an elected offical. You and every other liberal I have ever known jumps at the chance to bash and sling insults about GWB. Liberals are not special. They do not get respect just because they have a superiority complex. You don't give it, don't expect to get it.

And I am tired of your blanket statement that conservatives are racist and anti-Muslim. I take personal offense at it. I am a conservative as are most of my family and not one of us is racist or anti-Muslim. Considering you hold the record for the highest number of racist comments on this board you are the last person that should be pointing the finger at other people and calling them racist. Remove the beam from your own eye before you try to remove the sawdust from someone else's.


Ya'll trip me out when I when I ya'll call me racist. Point out 1 comment where I said anything derrogatory about white people or any other race as a whole. I will be listening to the crickets until then. Yes I have called out blacks where were sellouts but how is that racist? So I am not allowed to call out my own people for doing a disservice to our community?

duane1969
04-26-2012, 11:45 AM
Ya'll trip me out when I when I ya'll call me racist. Point out 1 comment where I said anything derrogatory about white people or any other race as a whole. I will be listening to the crickets until then. Yes I have called out blacks where were sellouts but how is that racist? So I am not allowed to call out my own people for doing a disservice to our community?

No. Racist statements are racist statements, period. If a white politician was trying to help the black community and I called him a traitor to his race, would that be a racist statement or would you be OK with it?

Whats more, the idea that a black man should be working for the betterment of blacks and if he isn't then he is "doing a disservice to the community" is a racist ideal by itself. 60-70 years ago if a white man did something that benefitted blacks he was criticized and called an "n-word-lover" for not doing what was best for his own race. It was racist then, it is racist now.

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 12:01 PM
No. Racist statements are racist statements, period. If a white politician was trying to help the black community and I called him a traitor to his race, would that be a racist statement or would you be OK with it?

Whats more, the idea that a black man should be working for the betterment of blacks and if he isn't then he is "doing a disservice to the community" is a racist ideal by itself. 60-70 years ago if a white man did something that benefitted blacks he was criticized and called an "n-word-lover" for not doing what was best for his own race. It was racist then, it is racist now.

Politicians regardless of race must work for all people in their elected area regardless of their race, religion, gender, sexual preference, political views etc. So naturally a black politician would have to work for blacks, whites etc, just like a white politican would have to work for blacks, whites, etc. However as I have said on numerous occasions if a black goes with an organization who clearly do not have the best intrests of black people at heart then he is a sellout. Allan West, Herman Cain, Micheal Steel, and others like them might as well work for the KKK. I would still feel the same way about them.

ensbergcollector
04-26-2012, 12:03 PM
Politicians regardless of race must work for all people in their elected area regardless of their race, religion, gender, sexual preference, political views etc. So naturally a black politician would have to work for blacks, whites etc, just like a white politican would have to work for blacks, whites, etc. However as I have said on numerous occasions if a black goes with an organization who clearly do not have the best intrests of black people at heart then he is a sellout. Allan West, Herman Cain, Micheal Steel, and others like them might as well work for the KKK. I would still feel the same way about them.

so let me get this straight just so it is on the record. If someone is not specifically looking out for the black community, they might as well be in the KKK?

pghin08
04-26-2012, 12:07 PM
The questions about Obama being Muslim were relevant to his name which closely resembles the name of a popular terrorist. If a white Republican guy ran for president with the name Charles Mansion you can bet your bottom dollar that liberals would be calling him Charles Manson and comparing him to a crazed murderer.

And yes, it is OK to blatantly disrepect an elected offical. You and every other liberal I have ever known jumps at the chance to bash and sling insults about GWB. Liberals are not special. They do not get respect just because they have a superiority complex. You don't give it, don't expect to get it.

And I am tired of your blanket statement that conservatives are racist and anti-Muslim. I take personal offense at it. I am a conservative as are most of my family and not one of us is racist or anti-Muslim. Considering you hold the record for the highest number of racist comments on this board you are the last person that should be pointing the finger at other people and calling them racist. Remove the beam from your own eye before you try to remove the sawdust from someone else's.

Not only this, but since his last name would be "Mansion", then he's clearly an uber-rich elitist. :winking0071:

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 12:29 PM
so let me get this straight just so it is on the record. If someone is not specifically looking out for the black community, they might as well be in the KKK?


Thanks for putting words in my mouth but I will repeat. If a black person works for any organization that is not in the best intrests of the black community he might as well work for the klan. Today's republican party clearly does not have the intrests of the black community at heart so any black person who is down with them might as well apply to join the klan.

ensbergcollector
04-26-2012, 12:34 PM
Thanks for putting words in my mouth but I will repeat. If a black person works for any organization that is not in the best intrests of the black community he might as well work for the klan. Today's republican party clearly does not have the intrests of the black community at heart so any black person who is down with them might as well apply to join the klan.

cool, just wanted it on the record

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 12:35 PM
cool, just wanted it on the record


No problem I stand by everything that I say.

duane1969
04-26-2012, 01:03 PM
Politicians regardless of race must work for all people in their elected area regardless of their race, religion, gender, sexual preference, political views etc. So naturally a black politician would have to work for blacks, whites etc, just like a white politican would have to work for blacks, whites, etc. However as I have said on numerous occasions if a black goes with an organization who clearly do not have the best intrests of black people at heart then he is a sellout. Allan West, Herman Cain, Micheal Steel, and others like them might as well work for the KKK. I would still feel the same way about them.

Ah, I see. So if a white politician does not work for the best interest of the white community then he is a sellout? And by default, a white politician who does work for the best interest of white people is not a racist either.


Not only this, but since his last name would be "Mansion", then he's clearly an uber-rich elitist. :winking0071:

Yeah, but everybody already knows that all Republicans are wealthy elitist...and apparently racist and anti-Muslim too. :rolleyes:

mrveggieman
04-26-2012, 01:08 PM
Ah, I see. So if a white politician does not work for the best interest of the white community then he is a sellout? And by default, a white politician who does work for the best interest of white people is not a racist either.



Yeah, but everybody already knows that all Republicans are wealthy elitist...and apparently racist and anti-Muslim too. :rolleyes:


Let me break this down nice and simple for everyone on here to understand. Politicians must work for everyone regardless of race, religion, political party, sexual preference, favorite soda, etc. However if a someone works for an organization who clearly does not have the bests intrests of their community at heart they are a traitor. Let's use Benedict Arnold for an example. He was with the united states at first then betrayed the united states to support england during the revolutionary war. Does that make sense to ya'll?

ensbergcollector
04-26-2012, 01:13 PM
Let me break this down nice and simple for everyone on here to understand. Politicians must work for everyone regardless of race, religion, political party, sexual preference, favorite soda, etc. However if a someone works for an organization who clearly does not have the bests intrests of their community at heart they are a traitor. Let's use Benedict Arnold for an example. He was with the united states at first then betrayed the united states to support england during the revolutionary war. Does that make sense to ya'll?

could you please share why you think the republican party does not have the best interest of blacks in mind? what policies or plans does the republican party support that is anti-black people?

AUTaxMan
04-26-2012, 01:13 PM
Things would be just as bad if you didn't have a separation of Church and State.

That's why we have it.

duane1969
04-26-2012, 01:34 PM
Let me break this down nice and simple for everyone on here to understand. Politicians must work for everyone regardless of race, religion, political party, sexual preference, favorite soda, etc. However if a someone works for an organization who clearly does not have the bests intrests of their community at heart they are a traitor. Let's use Benedict Arnold for an example. He was with the united states at first then betrayed the united states to support england during the revolutionary war. Does that make sense to ya'll?

Fallacy in your "break down". You have nothing but the comments of a few random people who are not party representatives to use as "proof" that the Republican party does not have the best interest of blacks at heart. I find it ironic that you categorize and label an entire group of people based on unfair generalizations.

Second. The Democratic party has a long, deep and storied history of anti-black sentiments, anti-black policies and racist rhetoric. The Democratic party's history of racism grossly overshadows anything the Republican party has done.

So using your logic. A black man that aligns himself with a group that does not have the best interest of blacks at heart is a sellout and traitor...then I guess that makes all black Democrats sellouts and traitors...Uncle Toms, if you will.

Star_Cards
04-26-2012, 01:41 PM
Thanks for putting words in my mouth but I will repeat. If a black person works for any organization that is not in the best intrests of the black community he might as well work for the klan. Today's republican party clearly does not have the intrests of the black community at heart so any black person who is down with them might as well apply to join the klan.

This comparison/statement is rather extreme.

duane1969
04-26-2012, 01:44 PM
This comparison/statement is rather extreme.

It seems to be an "all or nothing" mentality. Either you work for the betterment of blacks or you are a traitor.

habsheaven
04-26-2012, 01:45 PM
That's why we have it.

And that is why all those left-wing liberals are trying to keep it that way.

AUTaxMan
04-26-2012, 03:46 PM
And that is why all those left-wing liberals are trying to keep it that way.

Well, they're trying to pervert it to be more restrictive than originally intended, but that's another thread.

habsheaven
04-26-2012, 03:50 PM
Well, they're trying to pervert it to be more restrictive than originally intended, but that's another thread.

Quite possibly.