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JustAlex
06-02-2012, 10:38 PM
Just a simple question with numerous of possible answers.

The reason I pose this question is because the major religions all share the same principle that Humans are alone in this universe.

This is what makes humanity so "unique".

However, what would happen if we found alien life from another world?

This would mean that human life is NOT unique to the universe and maybe God isn't the creator...


Anyways, I want to know what you guys think.

sublime420
06-02-2012, 11:31 PM
I can't really answer your question, but i'd just like to say that i believe without a doubt that there are aliens. Maybe not even in our galaxy, but i just think there has to be. Also, i think that most religous people would deny it, even it if it was proven, like they do with so many other things, just because they think that there "can't be" aliens. Science just isn't enough for people sometimes....

stlcardinalsfan
06-02-2012, 11:37 PM
what does being a christain have to do with not beleiving in aliens?

i think its possible to have aliens.....im a christain

no, who said earth is the only planet that has god/a jesus?

billions of miles away there could be another planet witht he same scenario.....kinda far fetched but plausable....i suppose.

sublime420
06-02-2012, 11:49 PM
Never said anything about Christians or Buddhists or whatever. The OP said that they all share that basic principle, and believing that statement, i said that many people would just blatantly deny it, even if it was in their face.

ensbergcollector
06-03-2012, 12:21 AM
i am a christian and it wouldn't shake my belief in God in the least.

i honestly don't know how hard core evolutionists don't believe in aliens. if we believe that all matter came from nothing, and then how can you look at all the galaxies and not assume that what happened here happened elsewhere.

JustAlex
06-03-2012, 01:04 AM
i honestly don't know how hard core evolutionists don't believe in aliens. if we believe that all matter came from nothing, and then how can you look at all the galaxies and not assume that what happened here happened elsewhere.

LOL, I'm not sure if I can call myself a "hardcore evolutionist" but I stay agnostic in the question of whether or not aliens exist.

Although I would guess that the existence of aliens is a lot more likely than god.

But I don't view aliens the way Hollywood movies view aliens, I do think that there could be life in other planets including this galaxy, but I DON'T think that they're flying around in disk shaped ships and landing on earth.

I believe that one day (and maybe I won't be around to see this) we will discover life outside of our planet......and even if some religious people won't admit it now, I believe their faith might be shaken if they find out that we are not the only life in the universe.

ensbergcollector
06-03-2012, 09:30 AM
LOL, I'm not sure if I can call myself a "hardcore evolutionist" but I stay agnostic in the question of whether or not aliens exist.

Although I would guess that the existence of aliens is a lot more likely than god.

But I don't view aliens the way Hollywood movies view aliens, I do think that there could be life in other planets including this galaxy, but I DON'T think that they're flying around in disk shaped ships and landing on earth.

I believe that one day (and maybe I won't be around to see this) we will discover life outside of our planet......and even if some religious people won't admit it now, I believe their faith might be shaken if they find out that we are not the only life in the universe.

i love the number of anti-christians on this board who are constantly saying some version of "i know christians don't say it, but i really know what they are thinking"

give me a break man

shrewsbury
06-03-2012, 11:33 AM
aliens? sure, there could be, but how would this disprove god? where does jesus say there are no aliens?

it is hard to say whether there are or not, but statistically it would seem plausible

if i was in the middle of no where and an alien ship landed, aliens came off of it and approached me, guess what is the first thing i would ask?

theonedru
06-03-2012, 12:44 PM
We cannot be the only ones out there. But of course the only way to prove it is if they came here in the open and presented themselves. And why would they do that when they would be attacked and if us successful, locked away and stripped of all advanced technology so we could make weapons to kill and destroy. I think they avoid us for a good reason we are not ready. Until then I keep an open mind to the possibility.

OnePimpTiger
06-03-2012, 02:53 PM
Just a simple question with numerous of possible answers.

The reason I pose this question is because the major religions all share the same principle that Humans are alone in this universe.

I've been a Christian most of my life and in church all of my life and I've never heard this. There is nothing in the Bible to indicate there is not life on other planets, it is not addressed. I'm sure there are some Christians who believe this, but I believe there most likely is life elsewhere. What would be so surprising about God making life elsewhere.


This is what makes humanity so "unique".

However, what would happen if we found alien life from another world?

This would mean that human life is NOT unique to the universe and maybe God isn't the creator...

That's incorrect. Just because there is life elsewhere doesn't mean it is human life or anything resembling human life. It always blows my mind how "open-minded" folks, including scientists, believe life anywhere else would have to fall under the rules of life on earth. Scientists looking for life elsewhere in the universe look for planets with water, atmospheres similar to earth, etc. Why? If the type of life hear on earth evolved from nothing, as they believe, why couldn't a different type of life evolve from a different type of nothing elsewhere? It really baffles me how they (specifically scientists) can be so naive about it.

themanishere
06-03-2012, 03:04 PM
I am a staunch, unwavering believer in the idea that we are an experiment, being watched through a microscope by a much higher life form for their entertainment.

GIGGITY

JustAlex
06-03-2012, 03:25 PM
i love the number of anti-christians on this board who are constantly saying some version of "i know christians don't say it, but i really know what they are thinking"

give me a break man

Well, I WAS a Christian for a longer time than I've been an "anti-christian"....and I always believed that God only made life on earth.

Why?

Because it wouldn't make sense to make life on other planets.

Genesis lays out the creation of the ENTIRE Universe, God ONLY made life on earth....I believe that if life was found on other planets this would be a big blow to the story of creation and God in general.

The Christian bible says we are made in God's image, and it lays out rules on how to live our lives and it IMO the bible shows that God is ONLY concerned about earth and Human life.....why would he also make life on other planets, it just doesn't make sense.


It always blows my mind how "open-minded" folks, including scientists, believe life anywhere else would have to fall under the rules of life on earth. Scientists looking for life elsewhere in the universe look for planets with water, atmospheres similar to earth, etc. Why? If the type of life hear on earth evolved from nothing, as they believe, why couldn't a different type of life evolve from a different type of nothing elsewhere? It really baffles me how they (specifically scientists) can be so naive about it.

Well, that's because Life CAN'T survive without water.

Water is the source of life every single organism needs it to survive.

If makes sense that if you're going to search for life, you need water!


Please don't say that we evolved from "nothing", because no scientist believes that.....abiogenesis (the theory of how life started) doesn't say we evolved from nothing, it's much more complex and it took billions of years to occur.

boba
06-03-2012, 08:45 PM
Well, I WAS a Christian for a longer time than I've been an "anti-christian"....and I always believed that God only made life on earth.

Why?

Because it wouldn't make sense to make life on other planets.

Genesis lays out the creation of the ENTIRE Universe, God ONLY made life on earth....I believe that if life was found on other planets this would be a big blow to the story of creation and God in general.

The Christian bible says we are made in God's image, and it lays out rules on how to live our lives and it IMO the bible shows that God is ONLY concerned about earth and Human life.....why would he also make life on other planets, it just doesn't make sense.



Well, that's because Life CAN'T survive without water.

Water is the source of life every single organism needs it to survive.

If makes sense that if you're going to search for life, you need water!


Please don't say that we evolved from "nothing", because no scientist believes that.....abiogenesis (the theory of how life started) doesn't say we evolved from nothing, it's much more complex and it took billions of years to occur.

At some point, something had to come from nothing. So we evolved from something that at some point originated from nothing.

JustAlex
06-03-2012, 08:53 PM
At some point, something had to come from nothing. So we evolved from something that at some point originated from nothing.

OK, here is the big difference between Religion and Science.

Science admits that it doesn't know how exactly everything came to being, but it continues to search for the truth by finding evidence.

Religion knows how everything happened, and it affixes it to a being called "God". Religion is NOT interested in knowing anything else, it is closed minded and there is nothing that will change it's ways. Now, here's where it gets interesting.....there are literally THOUSANDS of religions in this world, some are much bigger than others, however; THEY ALL DISAGREE with each other and each of them claims to be the "REAL TRUTH".

I've always been fascinated on how Christians can mock Islam, Hinduism, and all other religions but when we (atheist) mock or question their beliefs, that's NOT COOL...

If you want to say "we came from nothing" then you also have to admit that YOUR god also "came from nothing".

shrewsbury
06-03-2012, 09:08 PM
Science admits that it doesn't know how exactly everything came to being, but it continues to search for the truth by finding evidence.

sounds like religion

[QUOTE]Religion knows how everything happened, and it affixes it to a being called "God". Religion is NOT interested in knowing anything else, it is closed minded and there is nothing that will change it's ways. [QUOTE]

now you are generalizing. why would i be interested in the salutrean hypothesis, the aquatic hypothesis, the hobbits of flores, or numerous other things if i thought i had all the answers?

[QUOTE]I've always been fascinated on how Christians can mock Islam, Hinduism, and all other religions[QUOTE]

how is this?

[QUOTE]If you want to say "we came from nothing" then you also have to admit that YOUR god also "came from nothing".[QUOTE]

this is the questions none of us know

AUTaxMan
06-03-2012, 09:18 PM
The reason I pose this question is because the major religions all share the same principle that Humans are alone in this universe.

I didn't know that. Where does it say this in the Bible?

JustAlex
06-03-2012, 09:35 PM
sounds like religion
NO, science is not a religion.

Scientists don't place their faith in anything, they do however have "Reasonable assumptions".

Science constantly changes once new evidence is found, Religion is DOGMATIC, it doesn't change nor is it willing to change.


now you are generalizing. why would i be interested in the salutrean hypothesis, the aquatic hypothesis, the hobbits of flores, or numerous other things if i thought i had all the answers?

Because maybe (I don't know) you are a "Moderate Christian"?

shrewsbury
06-03-2012, 09:55 PM
i guess i have been called worse

i believe anyone who practices anything would be researching and improving upon it all their life.

the bible doesn't hold all the answers and even most answers that is does have is up for debate, interpretation has everything to do with it, just like science, how the data is interpreted is who the hypothesis is derived.

when it comes to jesus and the matter of the universe and creation, there isn't a whole lot to go by. in fact the mention of adam and eve, the flood, or creation is very sparse and not really proclaimed as the truth or a story

as a christian, i am always looking at science to help me understand the world, life, and the universe.

theonedru
06-04-2012, 12:08 AM
I find it interesting that when religion is brought up here, Christianity always take to the front and dominates, how about we discuss this aspects via other religions. After all Christianity isn't the only one out there. I would be interested to know what Hindu texts say about this for instance since it is a very ancient religion.

shrewsbury
06-04-2012, 12:17 AM
theonedru

Sound
One Hindu creation story tells of the god Vishnu asleep within the coils of a huge cobra afloat on a vast ocean of darkness and nothingness. From the depths, a humming sound arose, forming the primal syllable of Om. The darkness dispersed, the air vibrated with energy, the god awakened and a beautiful lotus flower grew from his navel. Brahma, Vishnu's servant, sat within that lotus, and Vishnu ordered him to create the world before Vishnu himself disappeared. Brahma divided the lotus flower in three, with one part becoming the heavens, another the earth and the third the sky. This story explains why the syllable Om is one of the syllables of the Hindu religion. The Upanishads say this word contains the past, present and future.

Rebirth and Cosmic Cycles
For Brahma, who created the universe, one day equals 2,160,000,000 human years. At the end of one of these cosmic cycles, called a Kalpa, Brahma sleeps and the god Shiva dances the destruction of the world. Later, Brahma awakes and again creates the world. According to Hindu sacred texts, each Kalpa is divided into four stages, or yugas. In the first, peace and tranquility rule, but in each succeeding age, the world devolves further as people behave out of ignorance and greed. The Surya Siddhanta, an ancient Hindu astronomy text, identifies the current age as the Kali Yuga, the fourth and final stage of disorder before destruction.

Paradox: Dismemberment and Connection
The Rig Veda tells of a primal being, Purusha, with a thousand eyes, feet and hands. This being encompasses all places and all life. Purusha became bored and split himself to create the world. From Purusha's dividing of himself came all of the elements, the gods, men and all the myriad forms of life. All the world is therefore a part of this original being.

Purusha divided himself in order to have a loving, playful relationship with the beings that resulted from his splitting. Hinduism sees the universe is a form of divine play, or "lila." Humans can live either participating in this playfulness and creativity, perceiving a sense of the infinite, or under the veil of illusion, or "maya," believing in the world as finite and divided.

Multiple Deities
The tenth book of the Rig Veda tells of the creation of the world by Prajapati. Prajapati (who may be a form of Brahma) hatched from a golden egg. With his first breath, he created Agni, the god of fire, Indra, the god of lightning, and Soma, the lord of plants. With his next breath, Prajapati made the darkness. The tears he wiped away became the air, while those that fell became the oceans and those that were flung upward became the sky. While some tales state that his first wounds led to the creation of the seasons and planets, some stories explain that his first words created them instead.



Read more: Hindu Beliefs About the Creation of the World | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/info_8120004_hindu-beliefs-creation-world.html#ixzz1wnLKl1AK



Read more: Hindu Beliefs About the Creation of the World | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/info_8120004_hindu-beliefs-creation-world.html#ixzz1wnLBw0n8

OnePimpTiger
06-04-2012, 09:13 PM
Well, that's because Life CAN'T survive without water.

Water is the source of life every single organism needs it to survive.

If makes sense that if you're going to search for life, you need water!


That's based on our current understanding of life in the universe...so you're telling me we understand everything about all life in the universe?

That's the narrow-mindedness of science. How many times has science learned something new? Not so long ago at all, science "knew" that atoms were the smallest particles in the universe...is that still the case? Right now, science's understanding is that life can't survive without water...do you want to make a wager that will always be our understanding?

JustAlex
06-04-2012, 09:19 PM
That's based on our current understanding of life in the universe...so you're telling me we understand everything about all life in the universe?

That's the narrow-mindedness of science. How many times has science learned something new? Not so long ago at all, science "knew" that atoms were the smallest particles in the universe...is that still the case? Right now, science's understanding is that life can't survive without water...do you want to make a wager that will always be our understanding?

Science openly admits that there is still many things it doesn't know and they pursue the truth and you call that "Narrow-mindedness"???

OK...


BTW, the fact that science is ever changing....that's a GOOD thing, that doesn't make science bad, it means it's WORKING.

Unlike religion!

OnePimpTiger
06-04-2012, 09:36 PM
You say this:


Science openly admits that there is still many things it doesn't know and they pursue the truth

immediately following this:


Well, that's because Life CAN'T survive without water.

Water is the source of life every single organism needs it to survive.

and you don't see the irony in that? I really cannot point it out any more clearly.


Unlike religion!

Red herrings don't work around here.

JustAlex
06-04-2012, 09:57 PM
and you don't see the irony in that? I really cannot point it out any more clearly.

LOL, OK.

So at the moment, our understanding of EVERY single organism is that they all need water to survive.

So now you want to play your game where "we don't really know that" and "I guess Science knows everything".


We have Scientific Laws which are under the assumption that the universe follows.

Ok fine, we don't have the 100% certainty that ALL life in the universe follows this law.

But if you want to play this game then.....We are also not 100% sure that the earth is really rotating around the sun, we are not 100% sure that gravity really exists, we are not 100% sure that the laws of thermodynamics are true....

And I could go on like that....we have observable assumptions and these assumptions are better than having nothing!


Red herrings don't work around here.

OK, but just so you know, we are discussing science AND religion, my final point was not meant to be a Red herring, but if you saw it that way, then I apologize.

Star_Cards
06-05-2012, 10:40 AM
I doubt it. Anyone who believes that God created everything would just say that god created the aliens as well. It's already said that God is over the universe hierarchically speaking. That's the issue with religion, there's always an "out" to explain things. If people believe that we were created by god it's not that far of a leap to think that the aliens would have been as well.

shrewsbury
06-05-2012, 10:51 AM
but you can say the same about science

OnePimpTiger
06-06-2012, 07:19 PM
But if you want to play this game then.....We are also not 100% sure that the earth is really rotating around the sun, we are not 100% sure that gravity really exists, we are not 100% sure that the laws of thermodynamics are true....

And I could go on like that....we have observable assumptions and these assumptions are better than having nothing!

You do go on like that...being incorrect. The earth rotating around the sun is 100% sure...we have studied everything involved in that scenario, there are no other possibilities. Gravity on earth is 100% sure...we have studied everything involved in that scenario, there are no other possibilities. When we have studied every planet in the universe, we will be able to say 100% if life in this universe requires water or not...until then it is only an assumption.

JustAlex
06-06-2012, 07:49 PM
You do go on like that...being incorrect. The earth rotating around the sun is 100% sure....we have studied everything involved in that scenario, there are no other possibilities. Gravity on earth is 100% sure...we have studied everything involved in that scenario, there are no other possibilities. When we have studied every planet in the universe, we will be able to say 100% if life in this universe requires water or not...until then it is only an assumption.

LOL, wow.

I'm so glad that you know so much more than REAL scientists from NASA...

BTW, just so you know, if you accept Gravity to be "100% Real", then you should also accept that the earth, sun and in fact our entire galaxy were CREATED thanks to gravity.


Personally, I DO accept gravity to be true (and yes it's a THEORY), because we have reliable observations and assumptions that it is in fact real, even though we don't really know that the rest of the Universe works this way.

AUTaxMan
06-06-2012, 11:05 PM
we don't even know what gravity is.

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 09:07 AM
but you can say the same about science

what do you mean? science does exists. I assume that you are speaking specifically of the theory of how we were created without intelligent design? I agree, proof of aliens really doesn't solve any of debate about how the earth or humans were created. or religion in general for that matter.

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 09:16 AM
That's based on our current understanding of life in the universe...so you're telling me we understand everything about all life in the universe?

That's the narrow-mindedness of science. How many times has science learned something new? Not so long ago at all, science "knew" that atoms were the smallest particles in the universe...is that still the case? Right now, science's understanding is that life can't survive without water...do you want to make a wager that will always be our understanding?

science narrow minded? typically when something new comes to light people tend to use that new information to change their understanding of things. I don't see science as being narrow minded at all. If anything most people aren't personally vested in scientific theories or rules so if new information is found to disprove a theory or alter a rule most people accept that.

you examples of how they reformed their opinions on atoms is a perfect example. I personally don't know what the smallest particles in the universe is, but if they find something smaller than the atom I'm sure the scientific world will be open minded enough to change their view based on new evidence. Things like that are always changing in the scientific world as they find out new things and develop greater technology.

shrewsbury
06-07-2012, 09:18 AM
just like many in religion thinks they have all the answers, so does science.

when either is confronted with the unknown, they both cling to ideas to make them think they know

just like someone in religion can pull out the old "god made it that way" science can always say " there is a scientific explanation for it"

though ET was cute, he hardly solves the age old debate

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 09:33 AM
just like many in religion thinks they have all the answers, so does science.

when either is confronted with the unknown, they both cling to ideas to make them think they know

just like someone in religion can pull out the old "god made it that way" science can always say " there is a scientific explanation for it"

though ET was cute, he hardly solves the age old debate

I've never viewed science as having all of the answers. The knowledge that comes from the scientific world is at all varying levels. There are things that science knows for sure... things like the cure for polio, that the earth is not flat, how a rainbow is formed, what causes thunderstorms and so on. There are also a lot of things that are theories that aren't at varying levels of plausibility. To say that science thinks it has all of the answers is simply incorrect. You could say that they are searching for them, but the fact that there are scientists still looking for all sorts of things through their research is fact enough for me to say that science does not have all of the answers. for me, scientific ideals that are thought out and open to the rest of the scientific community for testing and counter arguments have much more validity than anything a religion can bring to the table as far as answers questions about how certain things in this world work.

shrewsbury
06-07-2012, 09:44 AM
i never said everyone, i said many


scientific ideals that are thought out and open to the rest of the scientific community for testing and counter arguments have much more validity than anything a religion can bring to the table as far as answers questions about how certain things in this world work.

but many are not. thunder, rain, the color of the sky, these are all easy things and religion doesn't really care about them, this is because nature takes care of all this, it is not about god or proving a god.

but science has some serious standstills and egos. einstien was nearly laughed at and it took two solar eclipses for anyone to even take him seriously.

the solutarian theory is not even researched by many because they are stuck with the siberian hypothesis, if tehy were truly open they would be looking into it. the hobbits of flores is perhaps the best modern example of main stream science not being open, they did everything they could to prove them wrong, when they could not, the digs were shut down and all is quiet on the flores front

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 10:07 AM
you simply referred to "science" so I really had no idea if you were speaking about specific things or in general. I assumed in general. I don't doubt that there are examples of scientists looking at things with a biased view if they are the ones that have come up with that specific study or what have you. That can be human nature and exists in all fields. I'd think that even in those instances there is other counter information out there that one can view depending on the specific topic. In the instance of einstein being laughed at... eventually his ideals gained acceptance and that shows an openmindedness, even if slow.

duane1969
06-07-2012, 10:15 AM
Seems to me that the existance of aliens would change our thoughts on a lot of issues, not just whether or not God exist.

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 12:16 PM
Seems to me that the existance of aliens would change our thoughts on a lot of issues, not just whether or not God exist.

excellent point. that would definitely change a lot

shrewsbury
06-07-2012, 01:41 PM
i guess it would depend on what type of alien we are speaking of

theonedru
06-07-2012, 01:59 PM
Do you think it might not confuse it more so? You would have not only the hundreds if not thousands of various beliefs on earth, you would also have the untold possible millions from other worlds to contend with as well. And if contending with lifeforms more ancient than ourselves how would that come into play?

DaClyde
06-07-2012, 02:38 PM
Do you think it might not confuse it more so? You would have not only the hundreds if not thousands of various beliefs on earth, you would also have the untold possible millions from other worlds to contend with as well. And if contending with lifeforms more ancient than ourselves how would that come into play?

How do you quantify "confusion"? Why would adding another billion beliefs make any difference?

theonedru
06-07-2012, 02:53 PM
How do you quantify "confusion"? Why would adding another billion beliefs make any difference?

We cannot come to a mutual understanding/respect with the ones we have now, let alone alien dogma.... How would say a Christian or Jew or even Hindu whose roots go back only a few thousand years deal with the possibility of an alien relgion who beliefs may be tens of thousands if not maybe millions year older

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 02:53 PM
I really don't think most religious people would change their religious beliefs if we knew 100% that there were aliens. For me, not being religious, I could imagine it changing a lot of my thoughts on certain things.

Star_Cards
06-07-2012, 02:55 PM
We cannot come to a mutual understanding/respect with the ones we have now, let alone alien dogma.... How would say a Christian or Jew or even Hindu whose roots go back only a few thousand years deal with the possibility of an alien relgion who beliefs may be tens of thousands if not maybe millions year older

good point. their beliefs would probably have put off a lot of others and that could go for things outside of religion as well.

OnePimpTiger
06-07-2012, 08:55 PM
science narrow minded? typically when something new comes to light people tend to use that new information to change their understanding of things. I don't see science as being narrow minded at all. If anything most people aren't personally vested in scientific theories or rules so if new information is found to disprove a theory or alter a rule most people accept that.

you examples of how they reformed their opinions on atoms is a perfect example. I personally don't know what the smallest particles in the universe is, but if they find something smaller than the atom I'm sure the scientific world will be open minded enough to change their view based on new evidence. Things like that are always changing in the scientific world as they find out new things and develop greater technology.

Particles smaller than the atom have already been discovered and they are now accepted. Science does adjust their beliefs and theories once they've been absolutely proven wrong...but until they are proven wrong, they are 100% correct. That is the narrow-mindedness. It's similar to 100% guaranteeing that Fred won't die and claiming anyone who doesn't agree is ignorant...until he dies, then saying "Well, we've modified our theory, of course Fred can die...but Bob definitely will never die."

It's kind of hard to keep the same theories when they've been proven wrong...but waiting until they are to change them is hardly being open-minded about alternative possibilities.

DaClyde
06-09-2012, 02:09 PM
Science does adjust their beliefs and theories once they've been absolutely proven wrong...but until they are proven wrong, they are 100% correct. That is the narrow-mindedness.


That's simply untrue, you're confusing "science" with "morons". Once something is proven, it becomes a fact. Until it is proven, it is still a scientific theory, subject to further discussion and testing. Everything else is just superstition or ignorance. It's like all those idiots that "believe" Barack Obama is a Muslim just because his middle name is Hussein. They don't allow any facts to impede their "belief" despite all the evidence to the contrary.

shrewsbury
06-09-2012, 02:27 PM
if aliens landed on earth and communicated with us, it would prove christianity to be correct. (how did you like that one?)

if not, i would cross that bridge when it came, you can speculate anything you like, but how much time should one waste speculating, rather than living?

Theodor Madison
06-09-2012, 02:40 PM
we will never know, for all you know the aliens may be more religious than ourselves. the proof of god may be brought by aliens. Perhaps God will allow the existence of aliens just to satisfy your own disbelief. To be honest we we deserve all except the Love of God, for we tend to draw to all but God.

OnePimpTiger
06-09-2012, 11:06 PM
That's simply untrue, you're confusing "science" with "morons". Once something is proven, it becomes a fact. Until it is proven, it is still a scientific theory, subject to further discussion and testing. Everything else is just superstition or ignorance.

That's what it's meant to be...but that's not what science today is.

If so, why are scientists only searching for life in the universe on planets that have atmospheres similar to earth's and/or water? Because, even though it has in no way been proven that life requires this, it is accepted as fact. Likewise with evolution...it is a scientific theory that has not yet been proven, but anyone who points out that it hasn't yet been proven is mocked and called anti-science.

Everyone likes to say science is open-minded and, yes, it does change positions over time...but in each generation, there are always things that are "fact" that are later proven false. It has been that way for hundreds of years and still is today.

habsheaven
06-09-2012, 11:45 PM
They are searching for life similar to ours because that is the easiest most recognizable life for them to find. Life as we know it requires certain basics so it only makes sense to look for those building blocks first. Where would you start looking if you ignore those building blocks? You wouldn't have a clue where to look or what to look for. It makes perfect sense and it isn't an admission that scientists think life can only exist similar to what we know. It just happens to be all we have to go on when initiating a search.

theonedru
06-10-2012, 01:02 AM
I love it how someone mentions God/religion and everyone automatically shoots to Christianity.... How about an actual ancient religion like Hinduism, Judaism or the likes. They are more open minded towards things than Christianity

shrewsbury
06-10-2012, 09:56 AM
[QUOTE] How about an actual ancient religion like Hinduism, Judaism or the likes. They are more open minded towards things than Christianity[QUOTE]

really??

DaClyde
06-10-2012, 11:13 AM
That's what it's meant to be...but that's not what science today is.

If so, why are scientists only searching for life in the universe on planets that have atmospheres similar to earth's and/or water? Because, even though it has in no way been proven that life requires this, it is accepted as fact. Likewise with evolution...it is a scientific theory that has not yet been proven, but anyone who points out that it hasn't yet been proven is mocked and called anti-science.

Everyone likes to say science is open-minded and, yes, it does change positions over time...but in each generation, there are always things that are "fact" that are later proven false. It has been that way for hundreds of years and still is today.

I think you're getting far too much of your "science" information from the news media and people supporting some political agenda.

OnePimpTiger
06-10-2012, 03:37 PM
I think you're getting far too much of your "science" information from the news media and people supporting some political agenda.

That's not where I get my science, but I completely agree that's the problem. Unfortunately, the percentage of scientists that aren't pushing some kind of political agenda is vastly on the decline.

Star_Cards
06-11-2012, 09:56 AM
Particles smaller than the atom have already been discovered and they are now accepted. Science does adjust their beliefs and theories once they've been absolutely proven wrong...but until they are proven wrong, they are 100% correct. That is the narrow-mindedness. It's similar to 100% guaranteeing that Fred won't die and claiming anyone who doesn't agree is ignorant...until he dies, then saying "Well, we've modified our theory, of course Fred can die...but Bob definitely will never die."

It's kind of hard to keep the same theories when they've been proven wrong...but waiting until they are to change them is hardly being open-minded about alternative possibilities.

To me showing that they change when new evidence it found proves that they are not narrow minded. If they adjust rules based on new findings then that shows they are open to change if they have the evidence. If they refused to change even with new evidence that would be narrow mindedness. I get your point, but the community has proven that once something new is found out they adjust their thoughts on a matter.

Star_Cards
06-11-2012, 10:00 AM
I love it how someone mentions God/religion and everyone automatically shoots to Christianity.... How about an actual ancient religion like Hinduism, Judaism or the likes. They are more open minded towards things than Christianity

well I think that is because that is what the majority of the U.S. is. That's what we know and what surrounds us. I don't know as much about the other religions and don't know many people who are of those faiths.

shrewsbury
06-11-2012, 10:21 AM
onedru, you are wrong

TheNati97
06-15-2012, 07:41 AM
Well, that's because Life CAN'T survive without water.

Water is the source of life every single organism needs it to survive.

If makes sense that if you're going to search for life, you need water!



life on this planet and life as we know it can not survive with out water that does not mean life else where cant survive simply off nitrogen or some other gas

Star_Cards
06-15-2012, 08:08 AM
life on this planet and life as we know it can not survive with out water that does not mean life else where cant survive simply off nitrogen or some other gas

very true, but when looking for life on other planets it would be looked at based on what we know to be true. It's what knowledge we are familiar with so they can look for similarities. If we don't know of another life form that lives off of something unfamiliar to us we really have no way of knowing what exactly to look for.

TheNati97
06-15-2012, 08:31 AM
right, im not disagreeing with that just saying that if your open to the idea of life around the universe other than what we know of on this rock we call earth why limit your possibilities of what can sustain life to oxygen and water. im not suggesting looking for planets with water is a bad thing just that it seems like a close minded outlook on a open minded topic.

habsheaven
06-15-2012, 08:48 AM
right, im not disagreeing with that just saying that if your open to the idea of life around the universe other than what we know of on this rock we call earth why limit your possibilities of what can sustain life to oxygen and water. im not suggesting looking for planets with water is a bad thing just that it seems like a close minded outlook on a open minded topic.

I wouldn't characterize it as "closed-minded". As stated, they look for signs of life as they know it. In doing so I doubt that they close their eyes to other signs that they may find.

TheNati97
06-15-2012, 08:59 AM
ok well either way i dont see how it makes a difference. for conversation sake lets say astronomers find a planet with an atmosphere and oceans closely resembling earth, breaking news right? then the BUT comes into play. the but being its millions of years away considering life as we know it has been around a couple thousands years and getting anywhere near a planet like that would require a million+ year space trip involving human reproduction in zero gravity which has never been done i fail to see why resources and money are being pumped into this search.

habsheaven
06-15-2012, 09:15 AM
We pump money into this type of research because it is in our nature to seek and learn. If you consider how knowledge has expanded exponentially in our history it is not unreasonable to think we will get to a point of knowing how to overcome obstacles that look insurmountable now.

Star_Cards
06-15-2012, 09:26 AM
right, im not disagreeing with that just saying that if your open to the idea of life around the universe other than what we know of on this rock we call earth why limit your possibilities of what can sustain life to oxygen and water. im not suggesting looking for planets with water is a bad thing just that it seems like a close minded outlook on a open minded topic.

I don't think it's closed minded. It's a starting point. I'm sure people looking for other life forms throughout the universe are open to the possibilities of other life forms being able to live off of other things besides water and oxygen. They are also more than likely open minded to the fact that these elements could be something we've never even seen before.

Star_Cards
06-15-2012, 09:31 AM
ok well either way i dont see how it makes a difference. for conversation sake lets say astronomers find a planet with an atmosphere and oceans closely resembling earth, breaking news right? then the BUT comes into play. the but being its millions of years away considering life as we know it has been around a couple thousands years and getting anywhere near a planet like that would require a million+ year space trip involving human reproduction in zero gravity which has never been done i fail to see why resources and money are being pumped into this search.

we pump money into this research because it gives us awesome things like Tang and velcro. lol

honestly it's because humans have a drive to try to learn and understand things that are foreign to us. I do understand the tax payer money in such researching versus spending it here at home, but you never know what sort of findings will be uncovered that could have huge impact here on earth. Something even more revolutionary than Tang.

TheNati97
06-15-2012, 09:35 AM
We pump money into this type of research because it is in our nature to seek and learn. If you consider how knowledge has expanded exponentially in our history it is not unreasonable to think we will get to a point of knowing how to overcome obstacles that look insurmountable now.

its also in our nature to seek and destroy. knowledge has expanded yet technology has not changed much in terms of space travel in 50 years.. same old shuttles going out of the atmosphere. it is extremely unreasonable to think technology will advance to the point of folding space, worm holes, warp speed or what ever it would take to make trips of such distances when the main focus around the world seems to be money and war not making advances in space travel.

Star_Cards
06-15-2012, 09:37 AM
its also in our nature to seek and destroy. knowledge has expanded yet technology has not changed much in terms of space travel in 50 years.. same old shuttles going out of the atmosphere. it is extremely unreasonable to think technology will advance to the point of folding space, worm holes, warp speed or what ever it would take to make trips of such distances when the main focus around the world seems to be money and war not making advances in space travel.

space exploration is definitely not what it was during the cold war. I'm pretty sure these days we aren't spending nearly as much as we had.

TheNati97
06-15-2012, 09:41 AM
well even during the cold war space travel was about who could do it first to gain the upper hand on the enemy no?

Star_Cards
06-15-2012, 10:23 AM
well even during the cold war space travel was about who could do it first to gain the upper hand on the enemy no?

yeah. it was more about showing the soviets that we could get their faster. had there not been a cold war I'd assume that our space exploration would have been much slower.