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View Full Version : Man finds racist message on tv in Ohio hotel room



mrveggieman
08-01-2012, 09:25 AM
http://thegrio.com/2012/07/31/man-finds-hello-nier-message-on-tv-in-motel-6-room/

ensbergcollector
08-01-2012, 09:29 AM
my first two thoughts:

1. obviously inexcusable and wrong

2. really, calling the naacp over this?

mrveggieman
08-01-2012, 09:33 AM
my first two thoughts:

1. obviously inexcusable and wrong

2. really, calling the naacp over this?


So what is he supposed to do when the hotel management blows him off by telling him that they will get back to him in 30 days? Call the local branch of the tea party for assistance? :rolleyes:

shrewsbury
08-01-2012, 09:41 AM
what makes you think the tea party would be for this? maybe they would get stuff done without all the name calling and finger pointing.

then lets get to the story, what channel was it on? what was its format? video insertion is not that easy and if it was not the hotels channel or a local community challenge I would like to know.

hotels do not have there own headend and though many use insertions methods for PPV type stuff, there would only be a few employees who would know how to use it.

mrveggieman
08-01-2012, 09:47 AM
what makes you think the tea party would be for this? maybe they would get stuff done without all the name calling and finger pointing.

then lets get to the story, what channel was it on? what was its format? video insertion is not that easy and if it was not the hotels channel or a local community challenge I would like to know.

hotels do not have there own headend and though many use insertions methods for PPV type stuff, there would only be a few employees who would know how to use it.

Obviously this guy would be the last person in the world that the tea party would want to help under the circumstances but the point I was trying to make was if hotel management refuses to help this guy he needs to have someone assist him. Or is it ok to pay his hard earned money to stay at a hotel and if he is subject to racist insults he should suck it up and deal with it and be happy that someone would even rent him a hotel room?

ensbergcollector
08-01-2012, 10:30 AM
no, the issue is, why does everything have to be a lawsuit and why does everyone need help? why couldn't he just say "wow, someone is a real idiot" and move on?

shrewsbury
08-01-2012, 10:38 AM
the fact is the only way this happened is over the hotels private channel, no other way. also it would have to be an employee on duty, though insertion can be done remotely how would he have known that guy was there. also this would have shown in every room, not just his, so were there no other people there? and I would strongly bet there are only 1-2 employees who know how to use the insertion equipment and at work when he was there, this should be an easy find and fire.

as far as the tea party i say it is unfair to assume they would not care, is it because most are white and racist?

ensbergcollector
08-01-2012, 10:48 AM
i misread the article. i didn't realize the message was programmed on the tv. i understand why he took it to an organization. my mistake, sorry

mrveggieman
08-01-2012, 11:39 AM
Also I mean to say man not may. Mods please correct. Thanks.

shrewsbury
08-01-2012, 12:19 PM
veggie, changed

cbuskstwar
08-01-2012, 12:29 PM
Call the local branch of the tea party for assistance? :rolleyes:

Why not?

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 12:36 PM
Why not?

For the sake of this, let's assume the Tea Party is not racist (and I'm not saying they are racist)

What are they going to do about it? Ultimately, no matter what a political party isn't really going to do anything. I would probably call the NAACP too. Calling any branch of any political party in this situation is a pretty useless exercise.

duwal
08-01-2012, 02:13 PM
so was there any footage showing it on the TV to prove the validity of his claim? Any other tenants of the Motel 6 notice the message as well and come forward?

duane1969
08-01-2012, 03:19 PM
so was there any footage showing it on the TV to prove the validity of his claim? Any other tenants of the Motel 6 notice the message as well and come forward?

That is a good question. Seems odd that he would be the only person in the motel who saw it. I am a bit familiar with the systems used to send internal messages over closed circuit TV systems to rooms and I don't think that it can be done on a room-by-room basis.

kevinh1919
08-01-2012, 04:06 PM
Silly question...

Why not call the police first?

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 04:29 PM
Silly question...

Why not call the police first?

Would local cops really have jurisdiction over something like this? Can they determine what's actually racist?

Honest questions, so no one think I'm attacking anyone:tongue0011:

kevinh1919
08-01-2012, 05:02 PM
Would local cops really have jurisdiction over something like this? Can they determine what's actually racist?

Honest questions, so no one think I'm attacking anyone:tongue0011:

Not sure on the jurisdiction, but I believe that's where I would start.

The police could have corroborated what he was seeing, taken pictures and possibly other evidence, knocked on other doors nearby, etc. They could have brought in the organization that would have jurisdiction (if they didn't).

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 05:12 PM
Not sure on the jurisdiction, but I believe that's where I would start.

The police could have corroborated what he was seeing, taken pictures and possibly other evidence, knocked on other doors nearby, etc. They could have brought in the organization that would have jurisdiction (if they didn't).

Are you saying that a local cop's corroboration is worth more than the chapter president of the NAACP? Are police impervious to racism and corruption while the NAACP aren't?

What if he got a racist cop who said, "This never happened," when in reality it did? (assuming it did, of course) At least he already knows the NAACP is on his side (not on this issue, but racially).

ensbergcollector
08-01-2012, 05:21 PM
Are you saying that a local cop's corroboration is worth more than the chapter president of the NAACP? Are police impervious to racism and corruption while the NAACP aren't?

What if he got a racist cop who said, "This never happened," when in reality it did? (assuming it did, of course) At least he already knows the NAACP is on his side (not on this issue, but racially).

if the NAACP wasn't contacted for a month, it seems they would have zero information outside of what he told them.

also, i would like to think that the police are worth more than the naacp. are you saying that if a black person ever has a legal problem they should contact the naacp first because the police responding might be racist? i doubt that is what you are saying but it comes across that way.

shrewsbury
08-01-2012, 05:24 PM
hope he took a cellphone pic or video of it

again, I am an RF Engineer, and I started at the bottom, I am very familiar how video insertion works. the only way it could e done on a room by room basis is if it is IP based, which I am going to guess it is not, because I have never seen a hotel or motel do this yet. Being that you do not have access to the local headend you would only be able to insert on your local channel, which mean the channel designed for the hotel/motel. This is present at nicer hotels but i never stayed at a motel 6 so I am unsure they even have a local insertion point.

you would have to insert via a character generator which has limited patterns, most often the default is the classic center box. you would have to know he checked in at what room he was in, then put in on, hoping he is going to turn tv on, then you would have to remove it, the whole process is quick if you know how to do it, less than a minute.

there is no way to track it, unless it is IP based, and even then it is hard to do.

who has access to the room and the knowledge to do it, who was on duty, and who would have a way to know which room you were in (i guess they could have followed you)

so what employees are left? not too many

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 05:31 PM
if the NAACP wasn't contacted for a month, it seems they would have zero information outside of what he told them.
umm...

Ross initially called Motel 6′s corporate offices, who said that they would get back to him within 30 days. He then contacted the Dayton chapter of the NAACP. The chapter’s president, Derrick Forward, who can also corroborate the message, did not...
???


also, i would like to think that the police are worth more than the naacp. are you saying that if a black person ever has a legal problem they should contact the naacp first because the police responding might be racist? i doubt that is what you are saying but it comes across that way.

This isn't a criminal matter, it's a civil matter. And yes, I'd like to think the police are above pretty much everyone. Unfortunately, that would be incredibly naive. Do you not understand why black people hesitate to call the cops? Do you not understand why a black man would contact someone he knows isn't prejudiced against him before someone who easily could be? Do you really think the cops are, in reality, more trustworthy than any other organization. I agree they should be, but I cannot say they are, because they aren't.

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 05:35 PM
hope he took a cellphone pic or video of it

again, I am an RF Engineer, and I started at the bottom, I am very familiar how video insertion works. the only way it could e done on a room by room basis is if it is IP based, which I am going to guess it is not, because I have never seen a hotel or motel do this yet. Being that you do not have access to the local headend you would only be able to insert on your local channel, which mean the channel designed for the hotel/motel. This is present at nicer hotels but i never stayed at a motel 6 so I am unsure they even have a local insertion point.

you would have to insert via a character generator which has limited patterns, most often the default is the classic center box. you would have to know he checked in at what room he was in, then put in on, hoping he is going to turn tv on, then you would have to remove it, the whole process is quick if you know how to do it, less than a minute.

there is no way to track it, unless it is IP based, and even then it is hard to do.

who has access to the room and the knowledge to do it, who was on duty, and who would have a way to know which room you were in (i guess they could have followed you)

so what employees are left? not too many

From the article:

The chapter’s president, Derrick Forward, who can also corroborate the message, did not think it was a coincidence that this racist message appeared around the time of the predominantly black Macy’s Music Festival.
So I guess with the timing the thinking is it would have been done randomly knowing a black person would likely be in the room (and a white person likely wouldn't make a huge deal out of it).

Or it could be some employee with the skills and time to pull off this one time thing. Or it could all be made up. I just don't see how this man contacting the NAACP about it instead of the police says anything about the credibility of this story.

kevinh1919
08-01-2012, 06:00 PM
Are you saying that a local cop's corroboration is worth more than the chapter president of the NAACP? Are police impervious to racism and corruption while the NAACP aren't?

What if he got a racist cop who said, "This never happened," when in reality it did? (assuming it did, of course) At least he already knows the NAACP is on his side (not on this issue, but racially).

You're focusing solely on corroboration. I never stated whether or not I believe this happened.

Is the NAACP capable of collecting evidence beyond seeing the TV? Would any potential evidence or witness statements be upheld in court if they were collected by the NAACP and not the police?

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 06:25 PM
You're focusing solely on corroboration. I never stated whether or not I believe this happened.

Is the NAACP capable of collecting evidence beyond seeing the TV? Would any potential evidence or witness statements be upheld in court if they were collected by the NAACP and not the police?
What's wrong with contacting the NAACP first to get a second opinion. Honestly, if I turned on a motel TV and saw, "HEY THERE, WHITEY!" on the screen I would probably call the front desk and make a stink with them first. If they didn't take any action, I'd contact a lawyer the next day. At no point would I think to myself to call the police. If You were to legitimately hurt yourself on someone else's property due to their negligence, would you call the police? Would you want the police doing that while a bank is being robbed or a wife beaten? There is no way I'd call the police over a racial slur on a screen. I think if I were black, they'd be even further on my list because, honestly, I don't know if they're going to do something about it or cover it up and tell me it never happened while calling me the N word a few times for good measure. Be reasonable, a black man doesn't know what to expect when he calls the cops, even today. He knows what he should reasonably be able to expect, but he doesn't know what to expect. He does know what to expect from the NAACP though. He knows that they're either going to tell him it's not an issue or, more likely, agree that it's heinous and give advice on how to properly proceed. At the very least he knows he's not going to be further humiliated after reading this already offensive message.

So yeah, I'd call the NAACP too, if I were him. Then I'd call my lawyer. Of course, I'd also make certain to get a picture if I could, or at least more witnesses. There's no "evidence" to really collect in a case like this. I don't think the N word warrants dusting for prints or bring in the CSI.

At the same time, I'm purely speculating as much as you are. I'm just laying out why I understand him not calling the police over (in)directly being called a name.

ensbergcollector
08-01-2012, 06:59 PM
umm...

???



This isn't a criminal matter, it's a civil matter. And yes, I'd like to think the police are above pretty much everyone. Unfortunately, that would be incredibly naive. Do you not understand why black people hesitate to call the cops? Do you not understand why a black man would contact someone he knows isn't prejudiced against him before someone who easily could be? Do you really think the cops are, in reality, more trustworthy than any other organization. I agree they should be, but I cannot say they are, because they aren't.

my mistake. someone's comment earlier implied that he contacted the naacp when he did not get resolution from the motel. i misunderstood.

i still think it is a horrible precedent to set that if a black person has a problem they need to contact someone who is with a black organization because the police can't be trusted. it is thinking like that that has allowed racism to stay prevalent in our country.

i will also add it would never cross my mind to contact a lawyer or sue anyone over something like this. but, i understand that in our country, i am by far in the minority with that line of thinking.

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 07:26 PM
my mistake. someone's comment earlier implied that he contacted the naacp when he did not get resolution from the motel. i misunderstood.

i still think it is a horrible precedent to set that if a black person has a problem they need to contact someone who is with a black organization because the police can't be trusted. it is thinking like that that has allowed racism to stay prevalent in our country.

i will also add it would never cross my mind to contact a lawyer or sue anyone over something like this. but, i understand that in our country, i am by far in the minority with that line of thinking.

I would say it's racism that allows that reasoning to continue.

kevinh1919
08-01-2012, 07:26 PM
What's wrong with contacting the NAACP first to get a second opinion. Honestly, if I turned on a motel TV and saw, "HEY THERE, WHITEY!" on the screen I would probably call the front desk and make a stink with them first. If they didn't take any action, I'd contact a lawyer the next day. At no point would I think to myself to call the police. If You were to legitimately hurt yourself on someone else's property due to their negligence, would you call the police? Would you want the police doing that while a bank is being robbed or a wife beaten? There is no way I'd call the police over a racial slur on a screen. I think if I were black, they'd be even further on my list because, honestly, I don't know if they're going to do something about it or cover it up and tell me it never happened while calling me the N word a few times for good measure. Be reasonable, a black man doesn't know what to expect when he calls the cops, even today. He knows what he should reasonably be able to expect, but he doesn't know what to expect. He does know what to expect from the NAACP though. He knows that they're either going to tell him it's not an issue or, more likely, agree that it's heinous and give advice on how to properly proceed. At the very least he knows he's not going to be further humiliated after reading this already offensive message.

So yeah, I'd call the NAACP too, if I were him. Then I'd call my lawyer. Of course, I'd also make certain to get a picture if I could, or at least more witnesses. There's no "evidence" to really collect in a case like this. I don't think the N word warrants dusting for prints or bring in the CSI.

At the same time, I'm purely speculating as much as you are. I'm just laying out why I understand him not calling the police over (in)directly being called a name.

I'll play the "what if" game with ya. What if the NAACP representative was really a spy working on behalf of (insert any anti-NAACP group)?

Surely, we can agree what was allegedly on the TV brings about a different light than just being called a name. Isn't that what makes it racial? Why else would he call the NAACP?

Do you really believe that most African Americans don't trust the police?

I wouldn't call the police or a lawyer in your scenario. On the flipside, if it were my negligence that caused injury to someone else, I would feel obligated to pay the medical bills.

If this incident really did happen, surely we're all smart enough to realize this would be an act of an individual, not Motel 6. Who are you going to sue?

Wickabee
08-01-2012, 07:58 PM
I'll play the "what if" game with ya. What if the NAACP representative was really a spy working on behalf of (insert any anti-NAACP group)?

Surely, we can agree what was allegedly on the TV brings about a different light than just being called a name. Isn't that what makes it racial? Why else would he call the NAACP?

Do you really believe that most African Americans don't trust the police?

I wouldn't call the police or a lawyer in your scenario. On the flipside, if it were my negligence that caused injury to someone else, I would feel obligated to pay the medical bills.

If this really incident did happen, surely we're all smart enough to realize this would be an act of an individual, not Motel 6. Who are you going to sue?

I was merely speculating as to why he would call the police. If you want to "play a game" got to the playground

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 12:19 AM
i was merely speculating as to why he would call the police. If you want to "play a game" got to the playground

lol.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 12:49 AM
lol.

My thoughts exactly. Why is it difficult to expect a black man to not trust the police. Hell I'm white and I don't trust them. I also have to wonder if the police even would get involved at all. This isn't an assault. It's not a criminal matter. No police necessary.

theonedru
08-02-2012, 01:09 AM
http://thegrio.com/2012/07/31/man-finds-hello-nier-message-on-tv-in-motel-6-room/

1. If this was a slur pointed towards a white person or other race would it be as big an issue for you.

2. You do know that posting a link to this story is an scf violation because of the slur in the article even though it is partially edited out.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 08:16 AM
Ok I just got busted by the SCF police. I am guilty as charged and beg for the mercy of the court. <br />
<br />
On that note as you all know I am black and don't trust the police let alone any gov't agency...

shrewsbury
08-02-2012, 08:19 AM
I guess living in a small town makes things different for me, I not only trust the police but know every officer in town, all good people.

habsheaven
08-02-2012, 08:46 AM
I used to bowl in a league full of cops. They are just like you and me. Most are great people, but there are always a couple that leave you wondering how they ever got the job.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 08:53 AM
I used to bowl in a league full of cops. They are just like you and me. Most are great people, but there are always a couple that leave you wondering how they ever got the job.

Yeah my best friend from back home is a cop in dc and he is a good guy. Unfortunately the bad cops give the good cops a black eye. When dealing with the police you never know if you are dealing with a good one or a bad one. It's kind of like how you tell your children don't talk to strangers. Obvisouly not everyone in the world is a bad person who wants to hurt children but you can't take chances with children and strangers just like not every cop is bad but you never can be too sure when dealing with the police.

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 09:00 AM
My thoughts exactly. Why is it difficult to expect a black man to not trust the police. Hell I'm white and I don't trust them. I also have to wonder if the police even would get involved at all. This isn't an assault. It's not a criminal matter. No police necessary.

I'll assume you mean "why is it difficult to understand why a black man does not trust the police" (or something along those lines).

Every organization in the world is made up of people. When people are involved, all bets are off.

I get that there are some people in life that have had a "run-in" with an overzealous police officer, state trooper, etc. Heck - I've had them. It doesn't mean I'm going to cast evil thoughts on EVERY police officer in the world.

If you were walking in the parking lot and a group of guys targeted you and began calling you racial slurs...do you think a call to the police would be warranted? I do...

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 09:03 AM
I used to bowl in a league full of cops. They are just like you and me. Most are great people, but there are always a couple that leave you wondering how they ever got the job.

Agree completely.

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 09:06 AM
Yeah my best friend from back home is a cop in dc and he is a good guy. Unfortunately the bad cops give the good cops a black eye. When dealing with the police you never know if you are dealing with a good one or a bad one. It's kind of like how you tell your children don't talk to strangers. Obvisouly not everyone in the world is a bad person who wants to hurt children but you can't take chances with children and strangers just like not every cop is bad but you never can be too sure when dealing with the police.

Isn't that true about every person in the world, no matter their skin color, religious background, police/government affiliation, etc?

Respectfully.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 09:11 AM
Isn't that true about every person in the world, no matter their skin color, religious background, police organization, etc?

Respectfully.


Agree. However the average joe walking the streets usually does not carry a gun with them and has no special legal powers. If the average joe comes up to you on the streets mouthing off to you, you can tell them off without fear of arrest. That is not the case with the police.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 12:19 PM
I'll assume you mean "why is it difficult to understand why a black man does not trust the police" (or something along those lines).

Every organization in the world is made up of people. When people are involved, all bets are off.

I get that there are some people in life that have had a "run-in" with an overzealous police officer, state trooper, etc. Heck - I've had them. It doesn't mean I'm going to cast evil thoughts on EVERY police officer in the world.

If you were walking in the parking lot and a group of guys targeted you and began calling you racial slurs...do you think a call to the police would be warranted? I do...

Woah woah woah. I said I don't trust the police, I didn't "cast evil thoughts" at anyone. I don't trust the police because too many of them are corrupt. Since I can't tell the difference between a corrupt cop and a good cop, I can't trust any policeman until I've gotten to know them. I know there are good police, my best friend is a cop for crying out loud. I trust him, but I don't trust them. You know what I was saying. You know it was speculation, yet you're still treating this like an argument not a discussion. If I was in a parking lot and people started yelling slurs at me, yeah I'd call a cop because I'd be afraid a beating was next.
If I walked into a hotel room and the television started calling me names, I wouldn't call the cops. I think I can take the TV.

I don't appreciate the light you're trying to cast on me. Please don't say I "cast evil thoughts" on anyone or suggest I'm a cop hater again. It's pointless BS and has added nothing. If you can't understand what I've been saying, you're beyond my help. The help of most, I would guess.

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 12:31 PM
Woah woah woah. I said I don't trust the police, I didn't "cast evil thoughts" at anyone. I don't trust the police because too many of them are corrupt. Since I can't tell the difference between a corrupt cop and a good cop, I can't trust any policeman until I've gotten to know them. I know there are good police, my best friend is a cop for crying out loud. I trust him, but I don't trust them. You know what I was saying. You know it was speculation, yet you're still treating this like an argument not a discussion. If I was in a parking lot and people started yelling slurs at me, yeah I'd call a cop because I'd be afraid a beating was next.
If I walked into a hotel room and the television started calling me names, I wouldn't call the cops. I think I can take the TV.

I don't appreciate the light you're trying to cast on me. Please don't say I "cast evil thoughts" on anyone or suggest I'm a cop hater again. It's pointless BS and has added nothing. If you can't understand what I've been saying, you're beyond my help. The help of most, I would guess.

You get all of that out of my comments on this thread?

You're taking my comments WAY out of context. Not once did I call you a cop hater.

cast evil thoughts = whatever the reasoning behind your distrust of police

BTW, the TV didn't allegedly have that statement broadcasting all by itself. If it happened, there had to have been a person (or persons) behind the act. Is it possible that a beating was next?

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 12:45 PM
You get all of that out of my comments on this thread?

You're taking my comments WAY out of context. Not once did I call you a cop hater.

cast evil thoughts = whatever the reasoning behind your distrust of police

BTW, the TV didn't allegedly have that statement broadcasting all by itself. If it happened, there had to have been a person (or persons) behind the act. Is it possible that a beating was next?

1 - How am I not supposed to take "cast evil thoughts" as anything but "hate cops"? I certainly don't see how "distrust" leads to "evil". If that's really what you meant, and I have my doubts, that was a terrible choice of words.

2 - Obviously some person had to put that on the TV. I'm not stupid. However, with no one in the room, I have to wonder if he thought he was in danger? That's the only reason I'd call the police (making your example of a gang of racists in a parking lot completely moot). Since the TV is the only other one in the room, I imagine I'd be pretty safe. If you call the police every time your feelings are hurt, I would accuse you of misusing police services.

3 - What I object to most, besides veiled accusations, is the fact that you think his calling the NAACP in this case somehow discredits it and that if he had called the police first, you would totally believe this, but because he called the NAACP he's probably lying. At least, that's the vibe your posts have. All I've tried to do is explain why the fact he called the NAACP doresn't say anything one way or the other and you can't accept that. Why is it you can't accept that it does make sense to call someone other than the police? I'll say it again THIS ISN'T A CRIMINAL MATTER.

I think you've been, and are still in your last post being, deliberately obtuse. You're not understanding on purpose for the sake of an argument I'm not even having with you. I'm not saying calling the police was the totally wrong move, I'm simply saying it's perfectly reasonable to understand his calling someone else for several reasons, not the least of which are this is a civil matter, not criminal, and it's not unreasonable for him to foresee more racism from the cops (I know racist cops are very rare in the States, but...)

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 01:22 PM
1 - How am I not supposed to take "cast evil thoughts" as anything but "hate cops"? I certainly don't see how "distrust" leads to "evil". If that's really what you meant, and I have my doubts, that was a terrible choice of words.

I'm open to having anyone else associated with this thread chime in and state if they think I labeled you as a cop hater (or being deliberately obtuse).

2 - Obviously some person had to put that on the TV. I'm not stupid. However, with no one in the room, I have to wonder if he thought he was in danger? That's the only reason I'd call the police (making your example of a gang of racists in a parking lot completely moot). Since the TV is the only other one in the room, I imagine I'd be pretty safe. If you call the police every time your feelings are hurt, I would accuse you of misusing police services.

3 - What I object to most, besides veiled accusations, is the fact that you think his calling the NAACP in this case somehow discredits it and that if he had called the police first, you would totally believe this, but because he called the NAACP he's probably lying. At least, that's the vibe your posts have. All I've tried to do is explain why the fact he called the NAACP doresn't say anything one way or the other and you can't accept that. Why is it you can't accept that it does make sense to call someone other than the police? I'll say it again THIS ISN'T A CRIMINAL MATTER.

I think you've been, and are still in your last post being, deliberately obtuse. You're not understanding on purpose for the sake of an argument I'm not even having with you. I'm not saying calling the police was the totally wrong move, I'm simply saying it's perfectly reasonable to understand his calling someone else for several reasons, not the least of which are this is a civil matter, not criminal, and it's not unreasonable for him to foresee more racism from the cops (I know racist cops are very rare in the States, but...)

1 - I get that this forum is a bit different than others, but I didn't come here to single you out or to start "trouble". It's a slow day for me, so I thought I'd post here. I was simply trying to have a healthy discussion. If you don't believe me, I don't know what else to tell you.

2 - I'm not sure I'd feel safe. How did "they" know a black man would be in that room? My guess is that someone KNEW he was in that room. I wouldn't think anyone would be hiding in the room, but I'd be a bit concerned about stepping out onto the balcony.

3 - Read number 2 as to why I think it is a criminal matter. What you're objecting to the most, I still have yet to give my thoughts on. I don't know if it did or not happen. How is it that you already know my take on this? (This thread is the ONLY time I've posted in the P&R section). If it did happen, I think those that would call someone other than the police are in the minority, not the majority. That's all I am saying. Nothing more.

Deliberately obtuse, really? I think I've been cordial in my responses to you.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:27 PM
1 - I get that this forum is a bit different than others, but I didn't come here to single you out or to start "trouble". It's a slow day for me, so I thought I'd post here. I was simply trying to have a healthy discussion. If you don't believe me, I don't know what else to tell you.

2 - I'm not sure I'd feel safe. How did "they" know a black man would be in that room? My guess is that someone KNEW he was in that room. I wouldn't think anyone would be hiding in the room, but I'd be a bit concerned about stepping out onto the balcony.

3 - Read number 2 as to why I think it is a criminal matter. What you're objecting to the most, I still have yet to give my thoughts on. I don't know if it did or not happen. How is it that you already know my take on this? (This thread is the ONLY time I've posted in the P&R section). If it did happen, I think those that would call someone other than the police are in the minority, not the majority. That's all I am saying. Nothing more.

Deliberately obtuse, really? I think I've been cordial in my responses to you.

1 - If you want to have a healthy discussion, fine. If you want to have an argument, which is how you've been approaching this, I'm not interested.

2 - From the article:

this racist message appeared around the time of the predominantly black Macy’s Music Festival.
So it's not unreasonable for someone to have assumed a black person would be in there and see the message. Sure it's a gamble, but the odds were on that side.

3 - It's not a criminal matter until he thinks someone is in the room. It seems to me like he was pretty sure no one was in the room, judging by his actions.

You've been aggressive and, I believe, have been deliberately misunderstanding or flat out not reading some of my posts. Cordial I don't agree with either, but this is not a productive area of discussion.

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 01:42 PM
1 - With all due respect, isn't a healthy discussion about the "back and forth" of points? I can't control how you think I'm approaching this subject. I don't think I've given any indication otherwise. I've stated as such on one of the prior posts.

2 - I agree with the odds. I'm not sure how that changes anything. Again - I never once stated whether or not I believe this story to be true. (to be honest, I don't think there are enough details in the article to determine one way or the other) My point has never had anything to do with whether or not it's true.

3 - Help me understand why it's not a criminal matter until he thinks someone is in the room? (I'm not being deliberately obtuse. I'm trying to understand your viewpoint for the sake of the discussion)

How have I been aggressive? Do you mean by the number of posts in this thread?

I try to treat people here as if we're having a "face to face" discussion. I don't hide behind keyboards, call people names, flex internet muscles, etc. (I'm not saying you do these things)

I don't know how else to get this point across to you.

Respectfully,

Kevin

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:55 PM
1 - With all due respect, isn't a healthy discussion about the "back and forth" of points? I can't control how you think I'm approaching this subject. I don't think I've given any indication otherwise. I've stated as such on one of the prior posts.

2 - I agree with the odds. I'm not sure how that changes anything. Again - I never once stated whether or not I believe this story to be true. (to be honest, I don't think there are enough details in the article to determine one way or the other) My point has never had anything to do with whether or not it's true.

3 - Help me understand why it's not a criminal matter until he thinks someone is in the room? (I'm not being deliberately obtuse. I'm trying to understand your viewpoint for the sake of the discussion)

How have I been aggressive? Do you mean by the number of posts in this thread?

I try to treat people here as if we're having a "face to face" discussion. I don't hide behind keyboards, call people names, flex internet muscles, etc. (I'm not saying you do these things)

I don't know how else to get this point across to you.

Respectfully,

Kevin

1 - There's back and forth and there's aggressive arguing. I'll have to take your word for it. I still don't totally believe you, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt.

2 - How does that not change anything? You suggested he should be scared someone is going to beat him. Someone would have to be in the room or waiting outside, If he figured there was no one, why would he call the police?

3 - Let me ask you this. If someone (not group) calls you a name but in no way threatens you physically, would you call the police? I would sincerely hope you wouldn't call them over hurt feelings, though I suppose you would somewhat be within your rights. Until he's physically threatened or not rented a room because he's black, then sure, call the police. In this case, the direct racism is coming from the TV. Police can't arrest a TV.

All I've said is I understand why he didn't call the police. I don't understand how you don't understand that, I just don't. I try to treat this forum as "face-to-face" as well. In a face-to-face, if I think someone is getting aggressive and disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing, I call them out on it because I see it as detrimental to any conversation. This instance is no different. If I was wrong, I apologize and respectfully suggest you find better wordings.

-Ty

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 02:13 PM
LOL. Why even say you'll give me the benefit of the doubt, especially when you also state that you don't totally believe me in the same sentence.

I didn't say he SHOULD be scared because the TV had that phrase. I'm looking the beyond a physical WORD. I'm looking into who broadcasted it, how'd they know he was in the room, the "venom" behind racism, etc. If the phrase read, "Hey, dummy", I don't think the article is even written.

Of course I wouldn't call the police over hurt feelings.

This isn't walking through the parking lot of your favorite team's rival. The phrase that was referenced in the article goes beyond simple name-calling.

You never once asked my stance on the topic. I don't mind being called out when it's appropriate. I don't think it was warranted in this instance.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 02:29 PM
LOL. Why even say you'll give me the benefit of the doubt, especially when you also state that you don't totally believe me in the same sentence.

I didn't say he SHOULD be scared because the TV had that phrase. I'm looking the beyond a physical WORD. I'm looking into who broadcasted it, how'd they know he was in the room, the "venom" behind racism, etc. If the phrase read, "Hey, dummy", I don't think the article is even written.

Of course I wouldn't call the police over hurt feelings.

This isn't walking through the parking lot of your favorite team's rival. The phrase that was referenced in the article goes beyond simple name-calling.

You never once asked my stance on the topic. I don't mind being called out when it's appropriate. I don't think it was warranted in this instance.

1 - Because, as I've said before this isn't a productive area of discussion. LOLOLOLOLOLOL

2 - I've explained there's no reason to believe they knew beyond a shadow of a doubt a black person would be in the room. If a white person saw the same phrase, there's a darn good chance this article wouldn't have been written either.

3 - Good. That would a waste of resources.

4 - How does it go beyond name-calling? He turned on the TV and there was a message calling him a name. Nothing else. Sounds like name-calling to me. Racist name-calling is still name-calling.

5 - You've made your stance pretty clear through this whole discussion. Your skeptical because he called the NAACP when you would have called the police. If that's wrong, then I apologize, but I see no other reason for you to be stuck this line of "Why oh why didn't he call the police?"

kevinh1919
08-02-2012, 03:23 PM
We disagree on this point, which I think is critical in understanding each other's views. I believe the action in this article goes beyond simple name-calling. I don't take it as childish or immature behavior.

I have to believe the gentleman in the room did, too, since he felt threatened enough to reach out to someone.

My first post was not to discredit the article or what happened. It was an honest question.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 03:26 PM
We disagree on this point, which I think is critical in understanding each other's views. I believe the action in this article goes beyond simple name-calling. I don't take it as childish or immature behavior.

I have to believe the gentleman in the room did, too, since he felt threatened enough to reach out to someone.
My first post was not to discredit the article or what happened. It was an honest question.
And my response was an honest answer. I still fail to see why who he called matters at all unless trying to discredit the story. I also don't understand why it's unreasonable that he didn't call the police.