PDA

View Full Version : Police Claim 21 yr old Charvis Carter shot himself while handcuffed in squad car



mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 09:31 AM
Here's another story about your local police. And you wonder we distrust often times have a down right hatred for the police department.

http://globalgrind.com/news/chavis-carter-shot-back-police-car-while-handcuffed-police-shot-himself-video (http://globalgrind.com/news/chavis-carter-shot-back-police-car-while-handcuffed-police-shot-himself-video)

theonedru
08-02-2012, 12:14 PM
Why not it has happened before and caught on police video so It entirely possible. Sometimes they mix up stuff and the guy doesn't get patted down and things like this happen. People do commit suicide you know

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 12:17 PM
Even if that is the case that is utter neglance and incompetence on the part of the police dept. Charges must be bought forth.

theonedru
08-02-2012, 12:38 PM
Maybe if the guy was a more law abiding citizen this situation would never have happened. Do not get mad at the cops its entirely the guys choice and fault

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 01:03 PM
We will never know that because the deceased will never have his day in court to answer the charges bought against him. I don't care what crime you are accused of cops are here to enforce the law...

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:17 PM
It's this attitude now that allows innocent people to be put in bad situations later. In my town, last summer, the police got a call that a guy was firing a gun near a golf course. Before they got to...

duwal
08-02-2012, 01:20 PM
well the simple thing is to not commit crimes to put yourself into a situation like that to begin with

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:23 PM
well the simple thing is to not commit crimes to put yourself into a situation like that to begin with
I'll refer you to my post above.

duwal
08-02-2012, 01:25 PM
I still don't understand why you don't trust police, only that you don't feel you should trust one particular officer. If someone on this board screws you out of a card deal are you then going to...

duwal
08-02-2012, 01:27 PM
I'll refer you to my post above.


in this case though we are talking about a guy that already had a warrant out for his arrest along with smoking marijuana and apparently had a firearm on him as well. You stay out of trouble and 99% of the time you will have a much better positive attitude and respect for those there to protect you and they'll have the same towards you

shrewsbury
08-02-2012, 01:31 PM
veggie, you speak for all people who don't like the police?

and that is not my local police, oh, and guess what if they are in your town they are your local police

there are idiots everywhere, but as usual people mass everyone together

like all christians are against gays
all republicans are racists
all police are bad

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:31 PM
I still don't understand why you don't trust police, only that you don't feel you should trust one particular officer. If someone on this board screws you out of a card deal are you then going to claim that you don't trust members of this site??

The difference is, through feedback and user names and a whole host of other ways, I can tell the difference between the guy who screwed me and someone else.

I can't tell the difference between two cops I've never met. Which one can I trust and which one will assault me? What special powers that police have do traders on a message board have? You can't beat me through a computer, but they can beat me in person.

Now, normally I would say you're right and it's the minority. Unfortunately, untrustworthy police are a daily thing now. I'm certain the majority are trustworthy, but which majority. Honestly, I feel bad for good cops. Because of the bad ones, and the amount of bad ones, I can't trust the good ones until I actually know them. Because of guys like this, I have to be suspicious of all until I know them. Otherwise, I'm going to be assaulted, it's only a matter of when.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 01:33 PM
in this case though we are talking about a guy that already had a warrant out for his arrest along with smoking marijuana and apparently had a firearm on him as well. You stay out of trouble and 99% of the time you will have a much better positive attitude and respect for those there to protect you and they'll have the same towards you


What about this case? A cop followed an innocent man with no criminal backround illegally across state lines then cowardly shot and killed him.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/19/AR2006011902346.html

I'm sorry but until the police do a better job at policing themselves I will never have any love or trust for the police.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:34 PM
in this case though we are talking about a guy that already had a warrant out for his arrest along with smoking marijuana and apparently had a firearm on him as well. You stay out of trouble and 99% of the time you will have a much better positive attitude and respect for those there to protect you and they'll have the same towards you

In this case the cop didn't assault him. I'm talking about the attitude that it doesn't matter what happens to a criminal in custody. If we start giving way and saying, "Oh well, he shouldn't have broken the law" and just write it off that way, more and more of the above officer I referenced will come forward, assaulting, abusing and neglecting good, honest people. If you're okay with that, then by all means say continue thinking it's okay when a criminal dies because of abuse or neglect.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:35 PM
What about this case? A cop followed an innocent man with no criminal backround illegally across state lines then cowardly shot and killed him.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/19/AR2006011902346.html

I'm sorry but until the police do a better job at policing themselves I will never have any love or trust for the police.

Amen

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 01:39 PM
veggie, you speak for all people who don't like the police?

and that is not my local police, oh, and guess what if they are in your town they are your local police

there are idiots everywhere, but as usual people mass everyone together

like all christians are against gays
all republicans are racists
all police are bad


The difference between the 3 groups is that joe christian or joe republican walking down the street has no special legal powers. If any of those two step to me the wrong way I can tell them off. If it gets physical I can legally defend myself. If a cop steps to me the wrong way he can be the tough guy he always wanted to be in high school because he carries a gun and a badge. I guarantee if he didn't have a gun and a badge he wouldn't be the tough guy that he makes himself out to be.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 01:40 PM
veggie, you speak for all people who don't like the police?

and that is not my local police, oh, and guess what if they are in your town they are your local police

there are idiots everywhere, but as usual people mass everyone together

like all christians are against gays
all republicans are racists
all police are bad

As for me, here we have national police. And veggie doesn't speak for me. I said I don't trust the police, never said anything about liking them.

duwal
08-02-2012, 01:47 PM
What about this case? A cop followed an innocent man with no criminal backround illegally across state lines then cowardly shot and killed him.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/19/AR2006011902346.html

I'm sorry but until the police do a better job at policing themselves I will never have any love or trust for the police.


but aren't you doing the same that you always post about others doing? Grouping together a whole group, organization, political party in a negative light when the example is given is only a small few people that might have done wrong. Are you not going to go to the movies because you don't trust that someone there won't try and shoot up the place? Not go to the post office because of hearing the examples of postal employees...well going postal. Do you not love or trust the U.S. military because of isolated bad incidents and altercations overseas?

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 01:54 PM
but aren't you doing the same that you always post about others doing? Grouping together a whole group, organization, political party in a negative light when the example is given is only a small few people that might have done wrong. Are you not going to go to the movies because you don't trust that someone there won't try and shoot up the place? Not go to the post office because of hearing the examples of postal employees...well going postal. Do you not love or trust the U.S. military because of isolated bad incidents and altercations overseas?

Again none of those groups that you mentioned have any legal authority to say anything to me on a public street let alone start a comotion. When dealing with the police I have to be prepared for a possible conflict. If the cop shows that he is not a jerk then we can work the situation like two civilized adults but he has to prove it to me first. As far as the military is concerned I think that it would be better for me to keep my opinions to myself on that one.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 02:01 PM
Ok, first of all, do we all agree that the police should be held to a higher standard than the general public?

Because if some of us don't, then we need to backtrack to that portion of the discussion.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 02:21 PM
Ok, first of all, do we all agree that the police should be held to a higher standard than the general public?

Because if some of us don't, then we need to backtrack to that portion of the discussion.

Police as well as politicians.

duwal
08-02-2012, 02:26 PM
Ok, first of all, do we all agree that the police should be held to a higher standard than the general public?

Because if some of us don't, then we need to backtrack to that portion of the discussion.


Yes which is why I believe they should all be treated with the proper respect until they do something that absolves the trust I had in them, not condemn all

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 02:30 PM
Yes which is why I believe they should all be treated with the proper respect until they do something that absolves the trust I had in them, not condemn all


Every human being deserves the proper respect. However respect is a two way street. If cops feel that it is ok to disrespect others and the so called "good" cops remain quiet and hide behind the blue wall of silence don't get mad because the general public dosen't like let alone respect them.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 02:36 PM
Yes which is why I believe they should all be treated with the proper respect until they do something that absolves the trust I had in them, not condemn all

And I take a different approach. I don't trust them until they prove they can be trusted. That isn't to say I treat them with disrespect, I can respect someone I don't trust. My best friend since grade 9 is now a police officer and I couldn't show you a more stand-up guy. I've met some great cops. But I've also been harassed by cops on multiple occasions and no, I wasn't "acting suspicious" or breaking the law. Had I been, I likely would have been arrested. They had nothing to arrest me for, so they just made my life hell for 45 minutes at a time. I've had to read stories where they assault, even kill people for no real reason and end up with a paid vacation and a transfer. I can't trust any of them who I don't know because I can't tell by looking which one is going to treat me fairly and which one is going to kick me in the face or kill me without warning or reason. You may think less of me for that, but I think by automatically trusting them until they do something to kill that would be leaving myself wide open for abuse.

If a dog bites you are you going to trust the next one? What if he bites you? What if you read, almost daily, about vicious dogs all over the place biting people? Are you going to trust every dog until you actually see them bite someone? Are you going to go in to pet the dogs only to be bitten again and again?

ensbergcollector
08-02-2012, 02:37 PM
Every human being deserves the proper respect. However respect is a two way street. If cops feel that it is ok to disrespect others and the so called "good" cops remain quiet and hide behind the blue wall of silence don't get mad because the general public dosen't like let alone respect them.

you act like you forget all police forces have no connection with each other. I understand if a particular police force has had issues and therefore people don't trust them. however, every police officer who gets out of line seems to give people the right to disrespect all police. a police officer in dallas texas is not racist just because he didn't speak out about an action by an officer in ohio.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 02:41 PM
you act like you forget all police forces have no connection with each other. I understand if a particular police force has had issues and therefore people don't trust them. however, every police officer who gets out of line seems to give people the right to disrespect all police. a police officer in dallas texas is not racist just because he didn't speak out about an action by an officer in ohio.

I have never been to dallas,tx but I am sure it is a nice town. However if I had an encounter with police down there I would still keep my guard up until the cop in question proves that he is trustworthy and earns my respect. I don't know any cops in dallas and none of them know me and I sure that a lot of police down there would feel the same way about me.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 02:44 PM
I have never been to dallas,tx but I am sure it is a nice town. However if I had an encounter with police down there I would still keep my guard up until the cop in question proves that he is trustworthy and earns my respect. I don't know any cops in dallas and none of them know me and I sure that a lot of police down there would feel the same way about me.

Agree

habsheaven
08-02-2012, 02:50 PM
Sometimes I think I live in an alternate universe or something. I respect everyone I come across, UNTIL they give me a reason not to respect them. At least that's how my parents raised me, and it is how I raised my girls. To do otherwise just doesn't seem right.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 02:52 PM
Sometimes I think I live in an alternate universe or something. I respect everyone I come across, UNTIL they give me a reason not to respect them. At least that's how my parents raised me, and it is how I raised my girls. To do otherwise just doesn't seem right.

Who says distrust = disrespect?

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 03:00 PM
Sometimes I think I live in an alternate universe or something. I respect everyone I come across, UNTIL they give me a reason not to respect them. At least that's how my parents raised me, and it is how I raised my girls. To do otherwise just doesn't seem right.


Don't get me wrong Im not going to go up to some random cop and call him a gutless coward with a gun and a badge even though I may feel that way. However if one steps to me I'm going to be mentally prepared for some type of confrontation.

habsheaven
08-02-2012, 03:03 PM
Who says distrust = disrespect?

I don't know. Who?

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 03:10 PM
Sometimes I think I live in an alternate universe or something. I respect everyone I come across, UNTIL they give me a reason not to respect them. At least that's how my parents raised me, and it is how I raised my girls. To do otherwise just doesn't seem right.

Well, we're talking about distrusting the police, at least I am and I think veggie is too. Yet this "respect" thing keeps coming up, first from duwal, and now you. Since veggie and I have been talking about trust, I have to wonder how you two came to respect (maybe I'm missing something here). I don't trust Stephen Harper, but I sure do respect him. I respect all police but, the ones I don't know, I don't trust.

They have to earn my trust and lose my respect. One does not equate the other.

habsheaven
08-02-2012, 03:19 PM
I have never been to dallas,tx but I am sure it is a nice town. However if I had an encounter with police down there I would still keep my guard up until the cop in question proves that he is trustworthy and earns my respect. I don't know any cops in dallas and none of them know me and I sure that a lot of police down there would feel the same way about me.

I did not quote veggie when I made my comment but my comment was regarding this bolded part. Although he mentions both trust and respect, I only commented on the needing to "earn his respect".

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 03:23 PM
So I did miss something. Fair enough. I have been called a cop hater many times before for saying much ess than I have said here. I just want to clarify that I don't hate them and do respect them before anyone gets the wrong idea.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 03:28 PM
I did not quote veggie when I made my comment but my comment was regarding this bolded part. Although he mentions both trust and respect, I only commented on the needing to "earn his respect".


Yes he has to earn my respect. The only reason why anyone would listen to him in the first place is because he carries a gun. He has to do a lot more than throw his weight around to earn my respect.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 03:33 PM
Yes he has to earn my respect. The only reason why anyone would listen to him in the first place is because he carries a gun. He has to do a lot more than throw his weight around to earn my respect.

I disagree. Every human should be given respect until they lose it. It takes respecting someone, at least to some degree, to even treat them with dignity. If you're not willing to treat a cop with respect and dignity from the outset, then you can't complain when they return the favour.
If however, I approach with respect and they still treat me like garbage, that individual has lost my respect, not the whole force. The whole force has lost my trust because of the amount of individuals who couldn't even keep my respect.

habsheaven
08-02-2012, 03:38 PM
Yes he has to earn my respect. The only reason why anyone would listen to him in the first place is because he carries a gun. He has to do a lot more than throw his weight around to earn my respect.

So, if a police officer pulls you over for making an illegal turn, he has to earn your respect in the 5 minute encounter. By the time he does that (and I assume he does that by not acting like an idiot) you have both driven off and your respect serves no purpose. If on the other hand, you show a little respect to your fellow human being he is more likely to act in kind and everyone goes away happy (except you have a ticket). Just a thought.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 03:42 PM
So, if a police officer pulls you over for making an illegal turn, he has to earn your respect in the 5 minute encounter. By the time he does that (and I assume he does that by not acting like an idiot) you have both driven off and your respect serves no purpose. If on the other hand, you show a little respect to your fellow human being he is more likely to act in kind and everyone goes away happy (except you have a ticket). Just a thought.

Not only that, he's that much more likely to be that much more "respectable" to the next guy he comes across. If you're a jerk to him, it's just going to tick him off and he's more likely to be a jerk to the next guy. So, by not showing him respect (not trust, not affection, respect and dignity) you're actually screwing the next guy he runs into.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 03:53 PM
Not only that, he's that much more likely to be that much more "respectable" to the next guy he comes across. If you're a jerk to him, it's just going to tick him off and he's more likely to be a jerk to the next guy. So, by not showing him respect (not trust, not affection, respect and dignity) you're actually screwing the next guy he runs into.


On the same token if a cop acts like a jerk to someone that person could possibly be disrespectful to the next cop that he encounters. Remember respect is a two way street.

duwal
08-02-2012, 03:55 PM
Sometimes I think I live in an alternate universe or something. I respect everyone I come across, UNTIL they give me a reason not to respect them. At least that's how my parents raised me, and it is how I raised my girls. To do otherwise just doesn't seem right.

just seems like it would be a bit sadder of a life if you have to look at someone and immediately feel suspicious or on the defensive just because of the uniform that they carry even when that uniform is one that is there to look after your best interests. It takes a toll on a cop with all that they see that I know for sure none of us on here could handle that stress. Like they say there is no such thing as a routine call or stop.

duwal
08-02-2012, 03:59 PM
My best friend since grade 9 is now a police officer and I couldn't show you a more stand-up guy.


and how would you feel is someone was next to you, pointed him out and said 'screw that pig. They're all dirty pieces of crap' and then talking about what select other cops have done in random cities in the U.S. Would you be disgusted that they would say that when it was clearly unwarranted and undeserving? I would hope if I was that friend of yours that you'd think the guy was not right in the head to think that way

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 04:06 PM
On the same token if a cop acts like a jerk to someone that person could possibly be disrespectful to the next cop that he encounters. Remember respect is a two way street.

Yes, but if you start off with no respect, then it's your fault. If he starts out with no respect, then it's his fault. I'm just saying you can't approach an officer with a lack of respect and expect respect in return. If he has to "earn" your respect, then you're starting out with no respect. By all means, don't trust him until he proves himself trustworthy, but by no means do you have the moral right to treat any individual cop with disrespect off the bat


just seems like it would be a bit sadder of a life if you have to look at someone and immediately feel suspicious or on the defensive just because of the uniform that they carry even when that uniform is one that is there to look after your best interests.
Yes, it is sad that too many "bad" cops have created this system but they have. I can't see how anyone can fully trust an officer they do not personally know (or at least know of). I see that as either being naive or having an "in" with local cops. If corrupt policing was something rare or new, I'd be completely on your side with this. Unfortunately it's not new by any means and is not at all rare.


It takes a toll on a cop with all that they see that I know for sure none of us on here could handle that stress. Like they say there is no such thing as a routine call or stop.

Which is why I didn't become a cop. These people did. They knew what they were signing up for. They knew what their job would be and (presumably) knew they would be held to a higher standard than the general population. If they went through all the training and still didn't know how difficult, stressful and thankless a job they were signing up for, they are too stupid to be in authority of a sandwich, never mind the general populace.

mrveggieman
08-02-2012, 04:11 PM
Which is why I didn't become a cop. These people did. They knew what they were signing up for. They knew what their job would be and (presumably) knew they would be held to a higher standard than the general population. If they went through all the training and still didn't know how difficult, stressful and thankless a job they were signing up for, they are too stupid to be in authority of a sandwich, never mind the general populace.


CHURCH!! :love0030::love0030::love0030:

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 04:14 PM
and how would you feel is someone was next to you, pointed him out and said 'screw that pig. They're all dirty pieces of crap' and then talking about what select other cops have done in random cities in the U.S. Would you be disgusted that they would say that when it was clearly unwarranted and undeserving? I would hope if I was that friend of yours that you'd think the guy was not right in the head to think that way

1 - Is that what I've been saying. I'd say I've been careful not to say that but I don't need to be. I don't think that. I feel like you're suggesting I did and don't appreciate that. You can't equate "I don't trust police" with "Screw cops they're all pieces of crap" without looking stupid. Why is it whenever a statement is made, someone has to take it to the farthest possible reach?

2 - You assume I haven't heard him called a piece of crap or something comparable. I have, and I've told that person off. I've told off people who said the same of cops I didn't really know, but who had quickly proven to be good people. I've even told off people who've tried to tell me all cops are bad cops. I don't believe that, are you suggesting I do?
I don't trust anyone I don't know and a uniform isn't going to change that. It used to and it should, but police have proven themselves to be no better than you or I. The difference is they have authority, you and I don't. If I'm corrupt, I don't have the power to jail someone or tazer them or beat them or shoot them. Police do. Sure there's consequences (usually "you have to move somewhere they don't know you") but what do consequences matter if my jaw is shattered or I'm dead?

Again, it seems as if you're suggesting I've said something I've never even come close to, or at least that I condone it. I've been very clear the police deserve respect off the bat, but not trust. If I'm wrong in what you're suggesting please let me know. I just don't see any other way to take this post. I've gone so far out of my way to make this point clear, I have to wonder if you've actually read anything I've posted or just the part where I said I don't immediately trust police and, in your head, turned me into a cop hater.

shrewsbury
08-02-2012, 05:05 PM
i find it weird that people say they don't trust the police overall, i have never had an issue nor personally seen any cop do anything wrong (except videos)

theonedru
08-02-2012, 05:32 PM
The police did none of what you claim. Why the guy have a warrent out for his arrest as well as a gun in his possesion if he was a law abiding citizen? Just because they guy was black doesn't mean...

theonedru
08-02-2012, 05:35 PM
Its a jilted position cops have. You have the rare few that do something wrong and people interpete it as being widespread because thats 99% of what you see of them in the news. What do you not see in the news on a regular basis are the law abiding cops who simply do their job, or the ones that stick their necks out in the name of good. But according to a few on here due to a biased view they do not exist.

habsheaven
08-02-2012, 07:17 PM
Police are not near as bad as wickabee and veggie think. Not counting the obvious things that they do that capture the headlines, they still get the "I was wronged" attitude from "joe nobody" everyday. It comes with the territory. "Why did you pull ME over? Those other guys were speeding too." Frankly, if a cop isn't saving your life at the time, you think he's an idiot for how he "treats" YOU.

duwal
08-02-2012, 08:22 PM
1 - Is that what I've been saying. I'd say I've been careful not to say that but I don't need to be. I don't think that. I feel like you're suggesting I did and don't appreciate that. You can't equate "I don't trust police" with "Screw cops they're all pieces of crap" without looking stupid. Why is it whenever a statement is made, someone has to take it to the farthest possible reach?

2 - You assume I haven't heard him called a piece of crap or something comparable. I have, and I've told that person off. I've told off people who said the same of cops I didn't really know, but who had quickly proven to be good people. I've even told off people who've tried to tell me all cops are bad cops. I don't believe that, are you suggesting I do?
I don't trust anyone I don't know and a uniform isn't going to change that. It used to and it should, but police have proven themselves to be no better than you or I. The difference is they have authority, you and I don't. If I'm corrupt, I don't have the power to jail someone or tazer them or beat them or shoot them. Police do. Sure there's consequences (usually "you have to move somewhere they don't know you") but what do consequences matter if my jaw is shattered or I'm dead?

Again, it seems as if you're suggesting I've said something I've never even come close to, or at least that I condone it. I've been very clear the police deserve respect off the bat, but not trust. If I'm wrong in what you're suggesting please let me know. I just don't see any other way to take this post. I've gone so far out of my way to make this point clear, I have to wonder if you've actually read anything I've posted or just the part where I said I don't immediately trust police and, in your head, turned me into a cop hater.


I wasn't suggesting anything, merely playing out a potential scenario where someone aggressive would say something like that.

But with that I'm done with this, none of us are going to change each others minds on how we should treat all cops

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 08:54 PM
Police are not near as bad as wickabee and veggie think. Not counting the obvious things that they do that capture the headlines, they still get the "I was wronged" attitude from "joe nobody" everyday. It comes with the territory. "Why did you pull ME over? Those other guys were speeding too." Frankly, if a cop isn't saving your life at the time, you think he's an idiot for how he "treats" YOU.

While yo are correct, My problems with the police have nothign to do with, "Why did I get pulled over?" I've never had so much as a speeding ticket. I also think you think I'm saying.more against them than I actually am.

Wickabee
08-02-2012, 09:01 PM
I wasn't suggesting anything, merely playing out a potential scenario where someone aggressive would say something like that.

But with that I'm done with this, none of us are going to change each others minds on how we should treat all cops

I'm certain we agree police should.be treated with respect, unless you don't. So no need to change any minds there. What you don't seem to realize is that there's a diffrrence between respect and trust. Trust is not necessary for respect to exist. If you weren't suggesting anything, I fail to see anything even resembling a coherent point in your scenario.

JustAlex
08-02-2012, 10:33 PM
like all christians are against gays
Technically ALL christians are against gays.

Just like ALL crhistians are against every other "sin" mentioned in the bible.

theonedru
08-02-2012, 11:33 PM
Technically ALL christians are against gays.

Just like ALL crhistians are against every other "sin" mentioned in the bible.

Who cared what Christians are against, can we stay on topic in relation to the OT

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 08:15 AM
The police did none of what you claim. Why the guy have a warrent out for his arrest as well as a gun in his possesion if he was a law abiding citizen? Just because they guy was black doesn't mean the world was out to get him like you pretty much always claim when you posint out things like this, all whle ignoring the non black guy that did the same thing awhile back in a police station.....

Do you have a link to this story? I would love to see it.

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 08:36 AM
Speaking of the police he is another story that shows how trustworthy our police officers are:

http://www.ajc.com/news/dekalb/dekalb-police-captain-fired-1486167.html

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 08:52 AM
I've been reading and watching videos on this story.

It's unbelievable.

I'm not sure what to think.....I want to know MORE!

But I'm going to say right now, that I DON'T believe the story the cops are saying.....that doesn't mean that they really did murder this guy, but I'm thinking that maybe there was a struggle or something similar and maybe the cops accidentally killed him.

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 08:57 AM
Even if that is the case someone still should be charged for covering up what really happend. Someone needs to go to jail over this and do some serious time.

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 09:03 AM
Oh, I agree! <br />
<br />
Don't get me wrong, I'm NOT defending the cops.....I know very well their terrible history when it comes to these matters. <br />
<br />
Some cops in this country are absolutely out of control!...

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 09:18 AM
So if cops are supposedly good people why do they never call their own out for things like this? This is exactly why we do not trust, respect or have any love for the police. The guy who did this is a gutless coward who probably got beat up everyday in the schoolyard.

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 10:22 AM
guys, there are literally thousands upon thousands of cops doing there jobs. sorry that people don't write news stories or make videos about all the one's doing the right thing. just because you can find videos of people doing the wrong thing, does mean it reflects on anywhere close to the majority.

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 10:27 AM
alex - very credible video! let's talk to the mom and the kid. let's not talk to any unbias witnesses, let's not talk to the police, etc. Instead, let's talk to two people and then let's speculate for 5 minutes. and really, the police are anti-middle class? come on

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 10:34 AM
alex - very credible video! let's talk to the mom and the kid. let's not talk to any unbias witnesses, let's not talk to the police, etc. Instead, let's talk to two people and then let's speculate for 5 minutes. and really, the police are anti-middle class? come on

Right I'm sure that the police will always be objective and non-biased.

gladdyontherise
08-03-2012, 10:41 AM
So if cops are supposedly good people why do they never call their own out for things like this? This is exactly why we do not trust, respect or have any love for the police. The guy who did this is a gutless coward who probably got beat up everyday in the schoolyard.

You keep saying "we", who is "we"?

gladdyontherise
08-03-2012, 10:44 AM
guys, there are literally thousands upon thousands of cops doing there jobs. sorry that people don't write news stories or make videos about all the one's doing the right thing. just because you can find videos of people doing the wrong thing, does mean it reflects on anywhere close to the majority.

I've met some cops that I thought were tools, and I've met others that are really nice people. I've seen (well, saw pictures) of a cop that beat the crap out of my brother for no real reason other than on a technicality, and at work, i've seen a couple of cops come in that are just really nice and respectful.

To lump all cops and say they are good or bad is just not fair. Of course you'll get stories of cops doing bad things, because cops that do the right thing doesn't sell.

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 10:44 AM
Right I'm sure that the police will always be objective and non-biased.

and if there was a video of just the police side i would say the same thing. you default to assume if someone accuses the police of something then they are telling the truth. I default that anytime only half the story is given, the news story is probably not trustworthy.

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 10:44 AM
alex - very credible video! let's talk to the mom and the kid. let's not talk to any unbias witnesses, let's not talk to the police, etc. Instead, let's talk to two people and then let's speculate for 5 minutes. and really, the police are anti-middle class? come on
OK, that's fair, we should hear from the other side.

But let me ask you something......under what circumstances do you think is reasonable for a cop to use a Taser on a 12 YO little girl???


She could have been harassing the cop for all we know....that is still NOT a good enough reason to Taze her....TWICE!

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 10:52 AM
OK, that's fair, we should hear from the other side.

But let me ask you something......under what circumstances do you think is reasonable for a cop to use a Taser on a 12 YO little girl???


She could have been harassing the cop for all we know....that is still NOT a good enough reason to Taze her....TWICE!

i don't know, he tries to cuff mom so the girl attacks him? No, if she was just harassing the cop I will be the first one saying he was out of line.

and can we please stop with underexaggerating people's ages for dramatic effect? call her a kid sure, but a little girl? people use that to describe 5 and 6 years olds. not middle school students.

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 10:53 AM
OK, that's fair, we should hear from the other side.

But let me ask you something......under what circumstances do you think is reasonable for a cop to use a Taser on a 12 YO little girl???




She could have been harassing the cop for all we know....that is still NOT a good enough reason to Taze her....TWICE!

Exactly if that cop couldn't calm down that little girl w/o tazing her he needs to immediately be fired and forced to repay back his entire salary.

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 10:53 AM
You keep saying "we", who is "we"?


Most people that I know.

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 11:10 AM
Exactly if that cop couldn't calm down that little girl w/o tazing her he needs to immediately be fired and forced to repay back his entire salary.
Definitely fired.....and if I'm the mom, you can be sure a LAWSUIT is on it's way.

There is absolutely NO excuse for tazing an unarmed 12 YO girl....NONE!

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 11:13 AM
Definitely fired.....and if I'm the mom, you can be sure a LAWSUIT is on it's way.

There is absolutely NO excuse for tazing an unarmed 12 YO girl....NONE!

so if she was attacking the officer while he was trying to cuff the mom, he had no excuse for tazing her?

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 11:18 AM
so if she was attacking the officer while he was trying to cuff the mom, he had no excuse for tazing her?
Would you taze her?

How much harm can a 12 YO do?

Did you see the video, she's very skinny.

Are cops not trained in these situations?

How bad have our law enforcement become if they can't even control a prepubescent girl without using a taser?

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 11:20 AM
Would you taze her?

How much harm can a 12 YO do?

Did you see the video, she's very skinny.

Are cops not trained in these situations?

How bad have our law enforcement become if they can't even control a prepubescent girl without using a taser?

ok, at what age is it ok to taze someone who is assaulting a police officer?

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 11:31 AM
ok, at what age is it ok to taze someone who is assaulting a police officer?
Maybe they shouldn't be using tasers in non violent situations.

What did cops do before tasers were invented?

It's time to have more competent law enforcement.....using a taser is the LAZY way to subdue a suspect, and it's a travesty to ever use it on an unarmed child.

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 11:33 AM
They just beat people into submission with their nightsticks.

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 11:39 AM
They just beat people into submission with their nightsticks.
LOL, I guess so...

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 11:43 AM
I think that all cops should be tazed as a part of their training so that they will know what it feels like.

shrewsbury
08-03-2012, 11:44 AM
this child and her mother were not compliant with the police, this is the issue, not what he had to do to get them to be compliant.

so not only is the mother breaking the law, she is teaching her children it is ok to not be compliant with the police.

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 11:57 AM
this child and her mother were not compliant with the police, this is the issue, not what he had to do to get them to be compliant.

so not only is the mother breaking the law, she is teaching her children it is ok to not be compliant with the police.
Wait a minute.

At the time she was cuffed, she was NOT breaking the law, the cops got her for unpaid tickets.

LOL, really???

Unpaid tickets.....this merits an arrest?

Read this:

"Charlene Bratton, of North County, had outstanding warrants on traffic violations and an officer recognized her in Victoria's Secret (http://mehlville-oakville.patch.com/listings/victorias-secret-173) while patrolling through the mall. "

http://mehlville-oakville.patch.com/articles/12-year-old-tased-during-incident-at-south-county-mall


BTW.....the 12 YO Girl did NOT do anything to the cop, by his OWN admission:

"When asked why the police officer had to tase Dejamon, police said the she was making a scene and interfering with the arrest."


Reading all of this is making me VERY MAD!!!!

This Cop is an idiot, and an incompetent COWARD, he should be LOCKED UP himself.

I hope the mom sues the department for EVERY LAST PENNY!

JustAlex
08-03-2012, 11:59 AM
Question to shrew and ensberg......why are you guys defending these cops?

I really want to know!

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 12:05 PM
I think that all cops should be tazed as a part of their training so that they will know what it feels like.

I don't know about the US but here they are.

I think tazers are fine for police but someone needs to admit they can kill and the cops need WAY better training with them.

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 12:21 PM
I think that all cops should be tazed as a part of their training so that they will know what it feels like.

at least in texas they are. they are tazed and pepper sprayed for that exact reason. I know sometimes they are told to use tazers because they don't cause permanent damage. If the girl was becoming physical with the officer, if he pushed her and she fell she could break her arm or something else.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 12:29 PM
at least in texas they are. they are tazed and pepper sprayed for that exact reason. I know sometimes they are told to use tazers because they don't cause permanent damage. If the girl was becoming physical with the officer, if he pushed her and she fell she could break her arm or something else.

The idea that tazers "don't cause damage" is a complete load.

Here's an experiment, conducted by my beloved RCMP, that shows how to kill someone with tazers

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1CR_k-dTnDU

This man was a little drunk, very dehydrated, completely confused and didn't speak English (he spoke Polish). Now, if you'll watch the video, he's in no position to hurt anyone but himself. Getting an interpreter to the site would have probably saved this guy's life. You'll notice once the police shows up, he calms right down. The the 4 cops line up and point their tazers, which remember, cause no damage, and, well, watch the video.

theonedru
08-03-2012, 12:59 PM
Do you have a link to this story? I would love to see it.

even better google this and you can watch it

guy shoots himself in police custody video

I would provide a direct link but thats against the rules

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 01:01 PM
even better google this and you can watch it

guy shoots himself in police custody video

I would provide a direct link but thats against the rules

I saw something like that a while back on one of those banned from tv types of videos. I'm not sure if it is the same story you are talking about. They guy was sitting at a table uncuffed with a loaded gun. It sounds like a set up to me. All the cops involved need to be locked up for a long long time.

theonedru
08-03-2012, 01:59 PM
I saw something like that a while back on one of those banned from tv types of videos. I'm not sure if it is the same story you are talking about. They guy was sitting at a table uncuffed with a loaded gun. It sounds like a set up to me. All the cops involved need to be locked up for a long long time.

I amazed at the bigotry and discrimination you show and delusional conspiracy theories you abound to, how all cops are evil and everyone is out to get the black man and all that junk, you ever realize you are just as bad as those you post about? All anyone has to do is read most of your threads and see the same thing.

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 02:02 PM
Did I say anything in our recent dialouge about &quot;the black man.&quot; I don't care what race the cop is if he does something stupid he needs to fry. I even posted a story about a black cop who murdered...

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 02:07 PM
I amazed at the bigotry and discrimination you show and delusional conspiracy theories you abound to, how all cops are evil and everyone is out to get the black man and all that junk, you ever realize you are just as bad as those you post about? All anyone has to do is read most of your threads and see the same thing.

Has veggie ever said "all cops are evil"? Or is that something you read into that just wasn't there?
I've seen him say he doesn't trust cops and I've seen him say he doesn't respect cops until they show him respect.
I've not seen him say all cops are evil.

I do not trust cops just because they're cops. Individual officers need to earn my trust. I do think they should be treated with respect, as they should treat other with respect and everyone should be treated as respect. They don't need to earn my respect, they already have it. Trust is a different issue. Police everywhere hand out their own brand of vigilante justice far too often. They abuse and neglect prisoners, which is wrong. It is not the job of an officer or officers to determine who should be punished or carry out that punishment. That is the job of courts and prisons. Too many police have forgotten that. It's unfortunate for good, well-intentioned officers that I can't trust them, but I can't tell the difference between one and the other by looking at them, so I can't trust them until I have something to go on individually.

Did I just call all cops evil? Did I "cast evil thoughts" on them? Do I want to do away with police?

I'm asking you outright what you think I just said.

theonedru
08-03-2012, 02:34 PM
Has veggie ever said "all cops are evil"? Or is that something you read into that just wasn't there?
I've seen him say he doesn't trust cops and I've seen him say he doesn't respect cops until they show him respect.
I've not seen him say all cops are evil.

I do not trust cops just because they're cops. Individual officers need to earn my trust. I do think they should be treated with respect, as they should treat other with respect and everyone should be treated as respect. They don't need to earn my respect, they already have it. Trust is a different issue. Police everywhere hand out their own brand of vigilante justice far too often. They abuse and neglect prisoners, which is wrong. It is not the job of an officer or officers to determine who should be punished or carry out that punishment. That is the job of courts and prisons. Too many police have forgotten that. It's unfortunate for good, well-intentioned officers that I can't trust them, but I can't tell the difference between one and the other by looking at them, so I can't trust them until I have something to go on individually.

Did I just call all cops evil? Did I "cast evil thoughts" on them? Do I want to do away with police?

I'm asking you outright what you think I just said.

Once again you focus on something a rare few of them do and cast it up as the majority of them are guilty of it, its not as bad as you believe it to be.

theonedru
08-03-2012, 02:35 PM
Has veggie ever said "all cops are evil"? Or is that something you read into that just wasn't there?
I've seen him say he doesn't trust cops and I've seen him say he doesn't respect cops until they show him respect.
I've not seen him say all cops are evil.

I do not trust cops just because they're cops. Individual officers need to earn my trust. I do think they should be treated with respect, as they should treat other with respect and everyone should be treated as respect. They don't need to earn my respect, they already have it. Trust is a different issue. Police everywhere hand out their own brand of vigilante justice far too often. They abuse and neglect prisoners, which is wrong. It is not the job of an officer or officers to determine who should be punished or carry out that punishment. That is the job of courts and prisons. Too many police have forgotten that. It's unfortunate for good, well-intentioned officers that I can't trust them, but I can't tell the difference between one and the other by looking at them, so I can't trust them until I have something to go on individually.

Did I just call all cops evil? Did I "cast evil thoughts" on them? Do I want to do away with police?

I'm asking you outright what you think I just said.

Once again you focus on something a rare few of them do and cast it up as the majority of them are guilty of it, its not as bad as you believe it to be.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 02:38 PM
Once again you focus on something a rare few of them do and cast it up as the majority of them are guilty of it, its not as bad as you believe it to be.

The problem is, if I ignore that, I'm setting my self up for eventual abuse, neglect or death. I'd rather be slighlty paranoid than very dead, thanks. You also seem to still be stuck on the idea that I don't like police or treat them differently. Neither of those things are true. I don't trust police because I DON'T KNOW THEM, just as I don't really trust you because I DON'T KNOW YOU.

You're trying to paint me as something I'm not. You can believe whatever you want, but please, don't perpetuate your misguided ideas of me. I find that disrespectful and everyone should be respected.

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 03:16 PM
Nobody is trying to paint you as anything. We are simply commenting on what you say. How you read it is all on you.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 03:35 PM
Nobody is trying to paint you as anything. We are simply commenting on what you say. How you read it is all on you.

Well start reading my posts as they're written. That's all I ask. It's being heavily suggested that I have something against cops. I don't. Popular opinion is I should trust them sight unseen and no questions asked. I don't. Because I don't, it's continually being suggested that I and veggie (who's never said this either) hate cops. We think they're evil and cast evil thoughts on them and treat them differently, with disrespect, hatred and unwarranted suspicion. That simply isn't true, and I don't appreciate these suggestions being made.

I also understand how you guys can trust anyone, cop or not, no questions asked, simply because of what he's wearing. That just seems stupid to me.

Oh, and saying it's "a rare few" who abuse their power is laughable. It's definitely the minority, but "rare" and "few" are not words I would use to describe the problem.
But I suppose the police are one of those completely infallible groups who do no wrong and my saying I don't trust someone I don't know regardless of their job means I hate them. There's no logic in that, but hey, logic is unnecessary when someone says "police are just people."

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 03:42 PM
Well start reading my posts as they're written. That's all I ask. It's being heavily suggested that I have something against cops. I don't. Popular opinion is I should trust them sight unseen and no questions asked. I don't. Because I don't, it's continually being suggested that I and veggie (who's never said this either) hate cops. We think they're evil and cast evil thoughts on them and treat them differently, with disrespect, hatred and unwarranted suspicion. That simply isn't true, and I don't appreciate these suggestions being made.

I also understand how you guys can trust anyone, cop or not, no questions asked, simply because of what he's wearing. That just seems stupid to me.

Oh, and saying it's "a rare few" who abuse their power is laughable. It's definitely the minority, but "rare" and "few" are not words I would use to describe the problem.
But I suppose the police are one of those completely infallible groups who do no wrong and my saying I don't trust someone I don't know regardless of their job means I hate them. There's no logic in that, but hey, logic is unnecessary when someone says "police are just people."

The mere fact that you keep using the word "suggested" suggests to me that it is your perception of our words that is the problem. No one has SAID anything for you not to appreciate. On the contrary, you putting words in our mouths is not appreciated.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 03:45 PM
The mere fact that you keep using the word "suggested" suggests to me that it is your perception of our words that is the problem. No one has SAID anything for you not to appreciate. On the contrary, you putting words in our mouths is not appreciated.

I can tell when someone is making an accusation of me without saying the actual words. That has nothing to do with how I'm reading it and everything to do with how it's being written. I've been called a cop hater for not trusting them in many, many different ways. Everything that's written here was used as a lead-up to "therefor you hate cops" elsewhere.

You guys are just omitting the last sentence. I can read what you're saying. Why can't you read what I am saying. And again, how can you trust someone based solely on where he works and how he's dressed for that job?

shrewsbury
08-03-2012, 03:47 PM
wickabee, don't feel bad, i am a gay hater and anti christian, according to some on here

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 03:52 PM
wickabee, don't feel bad, i am a gay hater and anti christian, according to some on here

Oh yes, I know. I'm also a Democrat, heathen, Wiccan, blind follower of Obama and secret agent of the Great Liar.
That I can handle.
Having it suggested that I hate cops, or being told that I cast evil thoughts on all officers or even that I treat officers differently because their cops, I can't. Especially when the fact of the matter is those who trust them completely because they're cops are the ones treating them differently. I'm treating them no differently than I treat anyone else. Apparently that means I think they're evil and hate them.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 04:12 PM
Oh yeah I forgot, I am also racist against white people.

mrveggieman
08-03-2012, 04:21 PM
Hell I was accused of being pro abortion and making offensive remarks about blacks even though I am black. Go figure.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 04:29 PM
Hell I was accused of being pro abortion and making offensive remarks about blacks even though I am black. Go figure.

Man, we should get together. You tell me why you hate blacks, I'll tell you why I hate whites. We can televise it and confuse EVERYBODY!


Seriously though, I'm not racist, I hate everyone equally.

ensbergcollector
08-03-2012, 04:52 PM
Hell I was accused of being pro abortion and making offensive remarks about blacks even though I am black. Go figure.

don't recall the pro abortion thing but you have been pretty open about making offensive remarks about some blacks. calling people uncle toms is offensive. so you being black has not kept you from making offensive remarks about blacks.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 05:01 PM
don't recall the pro abortion thing but you have been pretty open about making offensive remarks about some blacks. calling people uncle toms is offensive. so you being black has not kept you from making offensive remarks about blacks.

If a black person yelling the N word on a stage isn't offensive to blacks, what else could a black person possibly say that's offensive to all blacks?

Or is criticism racist now?

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 06:59 PM
I can tell when someone is making an accusation of me without saying the actual words. That has nothing to do with how I'm reading it and everything to do with how it's being written. I've been called a cop hater for not trusting them in many, many different ways. Everything that's written here was used as a lead-up to "therefor you hate cops" elsewhere.

You guys are just omitting the last sentence. I can read what you're saying. Why can't you read what I am saying. And again, how can you trust someone based solely on where he works and how he's dressed for that job?

That's just great! Another board member with the uncanny ability to read people's minds. I can't wait until I have that ability. Next time, before you get offended by what you read in my mind, confirm it with me first. If I wanted to say you HATE cops, I would. It's not like it is against the TOS or anything. :frusty:

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 07:03 PM
Hell I was accused of being pro abortion and making offensive remarks about blacks even though I am black. Go figure.

Nobody accused you of being pro-abortion. I challenge you to find where I said it. For the record, because I say what I mean I don't need to "suggest" or "imply" it. I told you straight out that IF you are in favour of a raped woman getting an abortion then you are pro-choice. That is an UNDENIABLE FACT. I'm sorry if you can't accept it but it's true.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 07:12 PM
That's just great! Another board member with the uncanny ability to read people's minds.
Not minds. Posts. Because I can tell when something is being said in a veiled way does not mean I can read minds. And for the record, I have already outright been told that I "cast evil thoughts" on police. So even if I couldn't comprehend English nuances, I've still been called a cop hater.`Unless there`s some way to take that without hating cops but, being that I comprehend English, I don`t see one.


I can't wait until I have that ability. Next time, before you get offended by what you read in my mind, confirm it with me first. If I wanted to say you HATE cops, I would. It's not like it is against the TOS or anything. :frusty:

The I apologize. I still think you`ve heavily suggested I hate cops, while being careful not to say it (probably so I couldn`t claim you said it, but I digress). The fact remains what has been said has been said, and I know where at least that person stands. You`ve claimed I think the police are worse than they are. That wouldn`t be because I hate them though, right.

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 07:20 PM
Not minds. Posts. Because I can tell when something is being said in a veiled way does not mean I can read minds. And for the record, I have already outright been told that I "cast evil thoughts" on police. So even if I couldn't comprehend English nuances, I've still been called a cop hater.`Unless there`s some way to take that without hating cops but, being that I comprehend English, I don`t see one.

I'm not sure when/who said this. By those three words being out of context, I have no idea if that equates to cop hater.

The I apologize. I still think you`ve heavily suggested I hate cops, while being careful not to say it (probably so I couldn`t claim you said it, but I digress). The fact remains what has been said has been said, and I know where at least that person stands. You`ve claimed I think the police are worse than they are. That wouldn`t be because I hate them though, right.

No, it wouldn't be. It was stated because you show a greater amount of distrust for the police in your posts than I do. It has nothing to do with hate. I "HATE" the emotion of hate. I do not believe in HATING anyone. So I am positive I would not imply that someone else hates something. But again, you know me better than I know myself.



Responses in bold.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 08:06 PM
Responses in bold.

I hate that. It makes it harder to properly respond, but whatever.

1 - It wasn't you who said it and it's completely in context. If you're really interested you can look for it in this thread somewhere in the first 5 or so pages, I think.

2 - So you're saying you trust the police the exact correct amount, but I don't. Ok, I guess you're right because you say so.

Seriously man, what's wrong with the fact I don't trust the police. Which isn't to say I distrust them. Not trusting means I think they could do some horrible things to me. Distrust tells me I think think they will. That's a huge difference.

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 08:32 PM
I hate that. It makes it harder to properly respond, but whatever.

1 - It wasn't you who said it and it's completely in context. If you're really interested you can look for it in this thread somewhere in the first 5 or so pages, I think.

2 - So you're saying you trust the police the exact correct amount, but I don't. Ok, I guess you're right because you say so.

Seriously man, what's wrong with the fact I don't trust the police. Which isn't to say I distrust them. Not trusting means I think they could do some horrible things to me. Distrust tells me I think think they will. That's a huge difference.

1) Now I am really confused. The only mention of "casting evil thoughts" I can find is on page 9, post 88; and it is YOU saying it?

2)Where do I say that I trust police the EXACT right amount? Where do I talk about what is the right amount of TRUST you should give police? Once again, you are putting words in my mouth.

3) It's going to take me awhile to grasp your concept of how "not trusting" and "distrusting" the police are two different things. Regardless, I did not comment on whether or not you were wrong to "not trust" the police. I commented on the reason I think you do not trust the police. Not being you or knowing all your personal interactions with the police I can't say you are wrong. It's too subjective.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 08:53 PM
1) Now I am really confused. The only mention of "casting evil thoughts" I can find is on page 9, post 88; and it is YOU saying it?
*sigh* I thought it was in this thread. I'll look and find it. If it doesn't exist, it's been edited.

2)Where do I say that I trust police the EXACT right amount? Where do I talk about what is the right amount of TRUST you should give police? Once again, you are putting words in my mouth.
You said they aren't as bad as I think they are and you said you think that because I trust them less than you. What else can that mean?

3) It's going to take me awhile to grasp your concept of how "not trusting" and "distrusting" the police are two different things. Regardless, I did not comment on whether or not you were wrong to "not trust" the police. I commented on the reason I think you do not trust the police. Not being you or knowing all your personal interactions with the police I can't say you are wrong. It's too subjective.

It's easy, man. Don't trust means I think he may do something bad to me. Distrust means I think he will. One is a possibility, the other an absolute. Not hard. Also, refresh my memory, why do I not trust the police? I'll keep in mind you know you don't know for certain


Response in bold

habsheaven
08-03-2012, 09:17 PM
1) I will leave you to figure that one out. It's has nothing to do with me anyway.

2) It means exactly what you just said. I don't think they are as bad as you do, and you trust them less than me because of our different overall opinion of them. NOWHERE is there any mention of who's level of trust is right, let alone EXACTLY right.

3) You can keep repeating what you think the difference in the phrases are. I can read, I saw the explanation the first time. I just don't buy it. Not trusting and distrusting are the same thing in my language. If they mean different things to you, we will have to just agree to disagree.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 09:28 PM
1) I will leave you to figure that one out. It's has nothing to do with me anyway.
Yeah, that's what I said. I'll find it.


2) It means exactly what you just said. I don't think they are as bad as you do, and you trust them less than me because of our different overall opinion of them. NOWHERE is there any mention of who's level of trust is right, let alone EXACTLY right.
Ok, this is where you're wrong. You tell me I think they are worse than they are and therefor my level of non-trust is out of whack. Your reasoning is that you trust them more than I do. What other conclusion can possibly be drawn from that. If I don't trust them enough BECAUSE you trust them more, then what?


3) You can keep repeating what you think the difference in the phrases are. I can read, I saw the explanation the first time. I just don't buy it. Not trusting and distrusting are the same thing in my language. If they mean different things to you, we will have to just agree to disagree.
If they mean the same to you then fine, I distrust them, but what does that change? I've said the entire time that I respect them, I just don't trust them. There seems to be a few people (not necessarily saying you per se) who can't understand how not trusting them and not respecting them are NOT the same thing.

Wickabee
08-03-2012, 09:40 PM
Habs, it's in the thread about the black guy getting a message on the TV. After I say I don't trust the cops, he says it's because of some run in I've had with an overzealous cop and that he's had runs with overzealous cops but he doesn't "cast evil thoughts on all cops because of it" and then tried to claim that wasn't saying I hate cops. I don't know how I could "cast evil thoughts" on anyone without hating them.

Of course, he didn't use the exact word hate, so the second I defend myself against the (veiled) accusation, I am immediately putting words in his mouth. Kind of like what's happened here.