PDA

View Full Version : 2 sherrif's deputies killed, 2 others injured in Louisanna shootout



mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 12:23 PM
http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world/2-sheriffs-deputies-dead-1500487.html

pghin08
08-16-2012, 12:25 PM
Shooting a cop is the lowest of the low.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 12:27 PM
Shooting a cop is the lowest of the low.

Shooting an innocent cop is pretty low. What is lower however is a cop who abuses his power to hurt and kill innocent people.

pghin08
08-16-2012, 12:29 PM
Shooting an innocent cop is pretty low. What is lower however is a cop who abuses his power to hurt and kill innocent people.

Where I'm from, that kind of stuff doesn't happen.

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 12:37 PM
Shooting an innocent cop is pretty low. What is lower however is a cop who abuses his power to hurt and kill innocent people.

is that necessary on a thread about cops who were killed?

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 12:39 PM
Where I'm from, that kind of stuff doesn't happen.

It happens everywhere it's just more common in some places more than others.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 12:41 PM
is that necessary on a thread about cops who were killed?

I feel bad for anyone who is killed while trying to do their job to take care of their familiy but I will not stick my head in the sand and pretend that a problem that exists really dosent exists just to be politically correct. What about the boy who got killed in the back of the police car in arkansas a few weeks ago? You conservatives were quick to pass judgment on him even though doing so wasn't very sensitive nor was it neccessary.

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 12:50 PM
I feel bad for anyone who is killed while trying to do their job to take care of their familiy but I will not stick my head in the sand and pretend that a problem that exists really dosent exists just to be politically correct. What about the boy who got killed in the back of the police car in arkansas a few weeks ago? You conservatives were quick to pass judgment on him even though doing so wasn't very sensitive nor was it neccessary.

no one was quick to pass judgment but you. you quickly said "we all know what really happened"


so if a security guard is killed, we should jump on the thread and talk about all the bad security guards in the country who abuse their power? no one is sticking their heads in the sand. it just isn't relevant in this thread.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 01:06 PM
no one was quick to pass judgment but you. you quickly said "we all know what really happened"


so if a security guard is killed, we should jump on the thread and talk about all the bad security guards in the country who abuse their power? no one is sticking their heads in the sand. it just isn't relevant in this thread.

Im just responding back to what someone said. Bottom line it is sad whenever anyone dies.

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 01:25 PM
no one was quick to pass judgment but you.
As I recall there was a fair number of, "If he didn't break the law he would still be alive."

Sounds like 'quick to judge' to me.

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 01:28 PM
Im just responding back to what someone said. Bottom line it is sad whenever anyone dies.

but that isn't the bottom line for you. the bottom line for you is to make sure everyone knows how much you dislike cops. your first reply on a thread about cops who were killed included this line "What is lower however is a cop who abuses his power to hurt and kill innocent people." that does not tell me that your thoughts were with the cops who died. it says you say an opportunity to bash police, again.

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 01:33 PM
but that isn't the bottom line for you. the bottom line for you is to make sure everyone knows how much you dislike cops. your first reply on a thread about cops who were killed included this line "What is lower however is a cop who abuses his power to hurt and kill innocent people." that does not tell me that your thoughts were with the cops who died. it says you say an opportunity to bash police, again.

You're taking this way too hard. Someone said nothing is lower, veggie came back with something he considers lower. It was a direct response, it was valid and it was topical.
The funny part is, as much as veggie talks down about cops, you talk down about/to veggie at least twice as much. You say he took an opportunity to bash cops, I say you took an opportunity to bash him, yet again.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 01:52 PM
You're taking this way too hard. Someone said nothing is lower, veggie came back with something he considers lower. It was a direct response, it was valid and it was topical.
The funny part is, as much as veggie talks down about cops, you talk down about/to veggie at least twice as much. You say he took an opportunity to bash cops, I say you took an opportunity to bash him, yet again.

It's all good though. I'm glad that I can give ensberg a reason to get out of his bed every morning. :winking0071:

duwal
08-16-2012, 02:48 PM
that's not quick to judge though. That is called the truth. And veggie Chavis was not a boy, he was a 21 year old man. A 21 year old man that was going around with weed and a gun on him while...

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 02:56 PM
Please, by that same logic anyone in a car accident is at fault because they were in the car. All those people would still be alive if they jad gone to bed instead of the new Batman too. <br />
Not to...

duwal
08-16-2012, 03:01 PM
Please, by that same logic anyone in a car accident is at fault because they were in the car. All those people would still be alive if they jad gone to bed instead of the new Batman too.
Not to mention, last I heard the penalty for that isn't death.



actually all of the people who went to see the Batman premier would still be alive if the killer didn't have a gun on him......well just like how Chavis would be alive if he didn't have a gun on him

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 03:11 PM
actually all of the people who went to see the Batman premier would still be alive if the killer didn't have a gun on him......well just like how Chavis would be alive if he didn't have a gun on him

He'd be alive if neglect wasn't standard procedure for prisoners.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 03:16 PM
he'd be alive if neglect wasn't standard procedure for prisoners.


truth!!

duwal
08-16-2012, 03:19 PM
He'd be alive if neglect wasn't standard procedure for prisoners.


he'd be alive if he wasn't a prisoner to begin with

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 03:23 PM
truth!!

veggie - since we are talking about the previous incident, when you said (in the original thread) that at worst someone needs to be punished for not finding the gun in a search, i agree completely. even if the police version is completely accurate, someone should face consequences for doing a horrible search. It is unacceptable if this person was placed in the car with a gun on their person. I think the difference in my opinion and yours, is i default to assuming the police did a poor job and should be punished while I think you default to the idea that the police either killed him in cold blood or were purposefully negligent. if I am wrong about your stance, I apologize, it wasn't intentional.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 03:23 PM
So it goes back to guilty until proven innocent. If you are arrested but not found guilty of any charges then too bad you should have never been fasley arrested in the first place. What about they...

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 03:25 PM
veggie - since we are talking about the previous incident, when you said (in the original thread) that at worst someone needs to be punished for not finding the gun in a search, i agree completely. even if the police version is completely accurate, someone should face consequences for doing a horrible search. It is unacceptable if this person was placed in the car with a gun on their person. I think the difference in my opinion and yours, is i default to assuming the police did a poor job and should be punished while I think you default to the idea that the police either killed him in cold blood or were purposefully negligent. if I am wrong about your stance, I apologize, it wasn't intentional.


If you, I or anyone else were working any other job and someone dies because of neglence then I can assure that we would be going to jail as well as facing a lawsuit. Why should cops be given a pass when someone dies because of thier workplace neglience?

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 03:27 PM
If you, I or anyone else were working any other job and someone dies because of neglence then I can assure that we would be going to jail as well as facing a lawsuit. Why should cops be given a pass when someone dies because of thier workplace neglience?

that is exactly what I was saying. i don't think they should get a pass at all. was that not clear in my post?

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 03:40 PM
that is exactly what I was saying. i don't think they should get a pass at all. was that not clear in my post?


You pretty much said that they should only get a slap on the wrist. If it were one of us we would be facing hard time up the river. Cops should face the same if not a worse punishment because they betrayed their oath. Let me ask you if someone dies because of a cops neglience what type of any jail sentence do they deserve?

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 03:48 PM
You pretty much said that they should only get a slap on the wrist. If it were one of us we would be facing hard time up the river. Cops should face the same if not a worse punishment because they betrayed their oath. Let me ask you if someone dies because of a cops neglience what type of any jail sentence do they deserve?

i never said or implied that they should only get a slap on the wrist. Just because I said i think it is negligence and not purposeful negligence does not mean I think they should get a light punishment. I think you are making assumptions. If someone dies as a result of a cops negligence, it would obviously depend on the situation, but they should be tried under that states laws for accidental death IMO.

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 03:51 PM
i never said or implied that they should only get a slap on the wrist. Just because I said i think it is negligence and not purposeful negligence does not mean I think they should get a light punishment. I think you are making assumptions. If someone dies as a result of a cops negligence, it would obviously depend on the situation, but they should be tried under that states laws for accidental death IMO.

There is a huge difference between an unintentional accident and being willfully irresponsible and causing the death of another human being.

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 03:54 PM
we might just need to agree to disagree. I am not giving the police a free pass in any way and feel they should be charged and not just reprimanded in house. However, willfully irresponsible...

mrveggieman
08-16-2012, 04:00 PM
It's no different from someone leaving their gun laying around and their child shoots themself or someone else. Actually the police would be worse because they are supposed to be the trained...

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 04:31 PM
he'd be alive if he wasn't a prisoner to begin with

He'd be alive if he stayed home and stared at the wall. We can play this stupid game all day, the fact remains his crimes did not deserve death. At the very least he deserved a trial. At the VERY least he deserved basic human dignity.
Knowing how often police arrest the wrong guy, which is a low percentage but still often, I'm amazed anyone puts up with this simply because "he's a criminal".

Is it going to take an innocent dying for you to care? Or is it just that it's not you so it doesn't matter?

duwal
08-16-2012, 06:08 PM
He'd be alive if he stayed home and stared at the wall. We can play this stupid game all day, the fact remains his crimes did not deserve death. At the very least he deserved a trial. At the VERY least he deserved basic human dignity.
Knowing how often police arrest the wrong guy, which is a low percentage but still often, I'm amazed anyone puts up with this simply because "he's a criminal".

Is it going to take an innocent dying for you to care? Or is it just that it's not you so it doesn't matter?


no his crimes did not deserve him dying however him shooting himself results in his passing. But his crimes also put him in that scenario, enough where he had already been arrested multiple times and had the warrant to arrest and take him into custody. I'm 35, never been arrested or locked up in jail, only physical confrontations I have had were the fights I had when I played hockey. It is easy the path you choose your life to go down, you can do your best to change your path when your way starts going bad but some just choose not to. I'm pretty sure you have not been arrested either, am I correct?

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 06:16 PM
no his crimes did not deserve him dying however him shooting himself results in his passing. But his crimes also put him in that scenario, enough where he had already been arrested multiple times and had the warrant to arrest and take him into custody. I'm 35, never been arrested or locked up in jail, only physical confrontations I have had were the fights I had when I played hockey. It is easy the path you choose your life to go down, you can do your best to change your path when your way starts going bad but some just choose not to. I'm pretty sure you have not been arrested either, am I correct?

You're saying actions have consequences. Fine. If he hadn't committed those crimes, he'd still be alive.

But

Those deputies wouldn't have been killed if they'd become mechanics again. When you become an officer, you know being shot and killed is a very realistic possibility. Now, their choice was more noble, but in both cases the victim's choices led to the ultimate result of death. Why is one an incredibly sad affair while the other is "his own fault"?
Why is the guy who shot the cops an evildoer but the cop(s) who didn't do their job properly, which would have prevented a death, glossed over?

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 07:07 PM
You're saying actions have consequences. Fine. If he hadn't committed those crimes, he'd still be alive.

But

Those deputies wouldn't have been killed if they'd become mechanics again. When you become an officer, you know being shot and killed is a very realistic possibility. Now, their choice was more noble, but in both cases the victim's choices led to the ultimate result of death. Why is one an incredibly sad affair while the other is "his own fault"?
Why is the guy who shot the cops an evildoer but the cop(s) who didn't do their job properly, which would have prevented a death, glossed over?

one is "his own fault" because he shot himself. not much more clear cut then that.

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 07:09 PM
one is "his own fault" because he shot himself. not much more clear cut then that.

And if the cops had done their jobs properly, he wouldn't have been able to. Not much more clear cut than that.

(the argument wasn't about him shooting himself, it's about his being a criminal making it his fault because he wouldn't have been in custody)

ensbergcollector
08-16-2012, 07:30 PM
And if the cops had done their jobs properly, he wouldn't have been able to. Not much more clear cut than that.

(the argument wasn't about him shooting himself, it's about his being a criminal making it his fault because he wouldn't have been in custody)

i actually came back to clarify. i was in the middle of bathing my daughter when i posted that. I agree wholeheartedly that if the cops had done their job he wouldn't be dead. and i know the argument wasn't about him killing himself. I don't think you can put all the blame on him or all the blame on the police. he ultimately chose to kill himself and put himself in a position to be arrested and have a gun. However, if the police had done their job, he would still be alive.

Wickabee
08-16-2012, 07:43 PM
i actually came back to clarify. i was in the middle of bathing my daughter when i posted that. I agree wholeheartedly that if the cops had done their job he wouldn't be dead. and i know the argument wasn't about him killing himself. I don't think you can put all the blame on him or all the blame on the police. he ultimately chose to kill himself and put himself in a position to be arrested and have a gun. However, if the police had done their job, he would still be alive.

Yes. It all comes down to choices. I don't think the policemen are entirely to blame, or even mostly to blame.. You're right, he killed himself, no one else. But you're also right that, had they done their job properly, he'd still be alive.
I also want to clarify that I'm not sad for him. A little for his family, but mostly for the people who suffer and/or die because of police negligence because, "Who cares they're just criminals" or brutality because, "The courts don't do their job, so I'll do it for them."

I wonder what the reaction would have been if he'd shot one of the cops instead.* Would that be their fault for not conducting a proper search?

* - No. I did not just say I wish he'd shot the cop instead. Nor did I imply that his shooting a cop would have been a good, funny or even better alternative. I simply wondered something.