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View Full Version : The official "I'm tired of abortion being an issue" thread.



pghin08
08-27-2012, 03:59 PM
It seems like this election cycle, like most in recent memory, just can't get enough abortion talk. I was perusing my local paper to find that a PA Senate candidate is against "all" abortions. The exact title of the article was "GOP Senate candidate Smith: No exceptions to allow abortion". I'm sorry, did I miss a day in school somewhere? Or can Senators just supersede the Supreme Court now?

My point is, who cares? Why does this matter? Why can't we talk about legit issues that need to be resolved? To pro-lifers, I'm sorry that Roe v. Wade and Planned Parenthood v. Casey didn't go your way, but this whole "abortion being the main topic of an election" thing needs to end now. We have very real problems that need to be addressed, and this isn't helping.

Wickabee
08-27-2012, 04:03 PM
It seems like this election cycle, like most in recent memory, just can't get enough abortion talk. I was perusing my local paper to find that a PA Senate candidate is against "all" abortions. The exact title of the article was "GOP Senate candidate Smith: No exceptions to allow abortion". I'm sorry, did I miss a day in school somewhere? Or can Senators just supersede the Supreme Court now?

My point is, who cares? Why does this matter? Why can't we talk about legit issues that need to be resolved? To pro-lifers, I'm sorry that Roe v. Wade and Planned Parenthood v. Casey didn't go your way, but this whole "abortion being the main topic of an election" thing needs to end now. We have very real problems that need to be addressed, and this isn't helping.

The answer to this is simple. It's easier to argue over abortion. You're either pro-choice or pro-life. Everything else takes a lot more effort. That's why no politician will leave it alone, it's a great fallback.
Personally, I'm wondering where all this "real discussion" that Ryan was supposed to bring with him is. Not a knock against one party or the other, but the media went bananas with the "FINALLY we will get to talk issues"

That's the last I heard of anything.

ShawnMC13
08-27-2012, 04:07 PM
If they spend their time wasting their breathe on abortion than they won't have to address issues we actually care about... it's dirty politics 101.

pghin08
08-27-2012, 04:09 PM
I really don't mean to sound insensitive about abortion. I have my personal beliefs on it, and I'm fine with my position. It's like you guys have said, it just serves as a distraction from more tangible issues, and it's extremely troubling.

AUTaxMan
08-27-2012, 04:13 PM
It's only made a topic so that people's attention is is deflected from issues that really matter. People respond to the abortion issue emotionally, so it's low-hanging fruit for politicians who aren't interested in discussing more boring yet more important issues. And for the record, it is largely the media who perpetuates the topic on behalf of the democrats.

mrveggieman
08-27-2012, 04:31 PM
Yeah even though I am against abortion I almost always vote for pro abortion canidates because most of the anti abortion canidates are garbage and I would elect them dog catcher.

JustAlex
08-27-2012, 04:34 PM
There is nothing to talk about in terms of abortion.

NONE!

It is a perfectly safe medical procedure that is backed up by good science and the the SCOTUS is not changing it's mind anytime soon.

mrveggieman
08-27-2012, 04:42 PM
There is nothing to talk about in terms of abortion.

NONE!

It is a perfectly safe medical procedure that is backed up by good science and the the SCOTUS is not changing it's mind anytime soon.

On the cool I could stomach a little consistency from both sides. If the conservatives want abortion illegal there should be manditory sex ed and free distribution of contraceptions to prevent abortion. If the refuse they should not say one word about abortion and it should remain legal. Gasp did I just say that?

Wickabee
08-27-2012, 04:45 PM
It's only made a topic so that people's attention is is deflected from issues that really matter. People respond to the abortion issue emotionally, so it's low-hanging fruit for politicians who aren't interested in discussing more boring yet more important issues. And for the record, it is largely the media who perpetuates the topic
Yes! Exactly!

on behalf of the democrats.

*sigh* You were so close.

JustAlex
08-27-2012, 05:14 PM
Everyone gather around, it's time to play.......TRADE OFF!

How about this.....we make abortion illegal except in cases of rape, incest or in life and death situations to the mother.

The Trade off....

Gay Marriage becomes 100% legal no ifs, ands, or buts.....WAIT, there's more!

Sex education is taught in EVERY single school and U.S politicians promise NEVER to politicize these three topics EVER again....anyone that does so will automatically be disqualified for whatever office they are running!

DEAL???

AUTaxMan
08-27-2012, 05:24 PM
Everyone gather around, it's time to play.......TRADE OFF!

How about this.....we make abortion illegal except in cases of rape, incest or in life and death situations to the mother.

The Trade off....

Gay Marriage becomes 100% legal no ifs, ands, or buts.....WAIT, there's more!

Sex education is taught in EVERY single school and U.S politicians promise NEVER to politicize these three topics EVER again....anyone that does so will automatically be disqualified for whatever office they are running!

DEAL???

I would take that deal in a heartbeat. Unfortunately, the politicians can't be trusted to keep their end of the bargain.

habsheaven
08-27-2012, 05:50 PM
Everyone gather around, it's time to play.......TRADE OFF!

How about this.....we make abortion illegal except in cases of rape, incest or in life and death situations to the mother.

The Trade off....

Gay Marriage becomes 100% legal no ifs, ands, or buts.....WAIT, there's more!

Sex education is taught in EVERY single school and U.S politicians promise NEVER to politicize these three topics EVER again....anyone that does so will automatically be disqualified for whatever office they are running!

DEAL???

No thanks. People in favour of pro-choice and gay-marriage are in the RIGHT. The majority will realize that in time. No need to "throw women under the bus" in favour of the LGBT community.

JustAlex
08-27-2012, 11:03 PM
No thanks. People in favour of pro-choice and gay-marriage are in the RIGHT. The majority will realize that in time. No need to "throw women under the bus" in favour of the LGBT community.
Definitely agree, but as you know, when you do a compromise you gotta give up something to get something.

To be very fair, no one likes abortion, NO ONE!

Time after time we have argued on here the merits of pro-choice, and why even though it's something nobody likes, it's just that....a choice!

A choice that is NOT up to anyone but the individual woman.

I always imagine what it must feel like for a woman to walk into an abortion clinic while all the pro-lifers are outside shaming her and telling her disgusting names such as "Baby-Killer" and that she's going to hell for murder.

Seriously, why do they care so much?

If they really were pro-life they would be in favor of MORE sex education in schools, MORE contraception in order to prevent unwanted pregnancy, and they shouldn't be against welfare for the poor women who need that help to raise a child.


I know if I was a woman and I didn't have the money to raise a child, I probably would abort as well!

Does that sound terrible?

Maybe, but what could I do?

(I guess here is where all the pro-lifers will say I should place the child into adoption).


LOL, the only cost would be 9 full months of inconvenience to my life!

pghin08
08-27-2012, 11:03 PM
It's only made a topic so that people's attention is is deflected from issues that really matter. People respond to the abortion issue emotionally, so it's low-hanging fruit for politicians who aren't interested in discussing more boring yet more important issues. And for the record, it is largely the media who perpetuates the topic on behalf of the democrats.

Sorry, I totally disagree. I think that if Dems had their way, nobody would talk about it. It's the politicians that keep bringing it up, the media just reports it. Republicans have totally used abortion as a way to unify their base solidly against at least one issue.

Tivo32
08-27-2012, 11:09 PM
I know if I was a woman and I didn't have the money to raise a child, I probably would abort as well!

Does that sound terrible?

Maybe, but what could I do?

(I guess here is where all the pro-lifers will say I should place the child into adoption).


LOL, the only cost would be 9 full months of inconvenience to my life!

We're going to make a joke about aborting an unborn child / fetus / whatever proper term now? Have we stooped that low?

All of this, especially the parts bolded, make you look incredibly immature.

Whether you agree or disagree with someone, or whether they argue in a reasonable matter isn't as important as you at least showing some respect to people. If you want respect shown to you, please start by showing it to other people. It will go a long way. Everyone here knows you dislike the GOP, you dislike conservative Christians, and you dislike the idea of God. You, at times, have a whole heck of a lot to offer in the way of constructive arguments that have caused me to stop and think. But then you go on rants that leave me scratching my head.

Maybe if some of us start showing more respect to each other, more people will follow suit.

Wickabee
08-27-2012, 11:22 PM
We're going to make a joke about aborting an unborn child / fetus / whatever proper term now? Have we stooped that low?

All of this, especially the parts bolded, make you look incredibly immature.


Nowhere in there did I see anything that would resemble a joke. I think you placed the wrong attitude on what was said.

Tivo32
08-27-2012, 11:31 PM
Nowhere in there did I see anything that would resemble a joke. I think you placed the wrong attitude on what was said.

Ok then maybe I'm wrong. And if I'm wrong I apologize.

The way he worded it made it sound like that it's not even worth carrying the baby full term to put the baby up for adoption because it's 9 months of inconvenience on his life. That is taking it a bit too far for me. As someone who has seen first hand how deeply hurt young married couples are when they find out they can't have children on their own, I take it as incredible unfair to make a joke or slight or suggest that adoption is a laughable thing to ask instead of adoption. If he didn't want it to be taken as a joke maybe he should have left out the "LOL" in all caps.

JustAlex
08-27-2012, 11:40 PM
We're going to make a joke about aborting an unborn child / fetus / whatever proper term now? Have we stooped that low?

All of this, especially the parts bolded, make you look incredibly immature.

Whether you agree or disagree with someone, or whether they argue in a reasonable matter isn't as important as you at least showing some respect to people. If you want respect shown to you, please start by showing it to other people. It will go a long way. Everyone here knows you dislike the GOP, you dislike conservative Christians, and you dislike the idea of God. You, at times, have a whole heck of a lot to offer in the way of constructive arguments that have caused me to stop and think. But then you go on rants that leave me scratching my head.

Maybe if some of us start showing more respect to each other, more people will follow suit.
I'm sorry if it seemed like a poor joke, but I promise it was not.

What I'm trying to say is that some people say, "hey, if you don't want the child don't abort it, place it for adoption"......yes, in a perfect world I guess everyone would do that. But let's be honest, it's a HUGE inconvenience.

It's Painful, it's a heavy burden, and it could cost someone financially speaking too much to bear.

As a man, I will never know what it's like, but I can imagine......the morning sickness, the fact that your body will take a lot out of you, the mood swings, the horrible pain of child birth.

C'mon these are very frightening aspects of pregnancy!


Again, I must definitely say, I was NOT making any jokes.

JustAlex
08-27-2012, 11:49 PM
If he didn't want it to be taken as a joke maybe he should have left out the "LOL" in all caps.
Oh, I see.

OK, I guess should explain.

The way I type and speak is that I use third person speech a lot.

In other words, I respond to my own questions, I talk to myself while typing and I laugh at myself.

This may sound weird.....but that's only because I think of myself that way in the way I talk/type....LOL.

Tivo32
08-27-2012, 11:52 PM
You know what, thank you for your response. I appreciate it. :)

Have a good night.

Tivo32
08-27-2012, 11:54 PM
What I'm trying to say is that some people say, "hey, if you don't want the child don't abort it, place it for adoption"......yes, in a perfect world I guess everyone would do that. But let's be honest, it's a HUGE inconvenience.

This is where, I personally think, the private sector needs to take big steps. Whether it's non-profits or religious institutions or someone. I think if more young, expectant mothers knew they would have someone to help (financially, emotionally, etc.) them along the way, there would be less abortions. The "legality" of abortions would no longer be important.

mrveggieman
08-28-2012, 07:54 AM
Everyone gather around, it's time to play.......TRADE OFF!

How about this.....we make abortion illegal except in cases of rape, incest or in life and death situations to the mother.

The Trade off....

Gay Marriage becomes 100% legal no ifs, ands, or buts.....WAIT, there's more!

Sex education is taught in EVERY single school and U.S politicians promise NEVER to politicize these three topics EVER again....anyone that does so will automatically be disqualified for whatever office they are running!

DEAL???


DOUBLE:

CHURCH!!! :love0030::love0030::love0030:
CHURCH!! :love0030::love0030::love0030:

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 08:13 AM
Last time I checked, there are 1,000's of children that go un-adopted and spend their first 18 years of life in the system. Pro-lifers can claim adoption is a viable alternative but in reality it is not. Also, for many women the choice of; carrying the child for 9 months and giving it up for adoption is a lot harder to choose than aborting the fetus and trying to move on with your life.

Tivo32
08-28-2012, 10:47 AM
Last time I checked, there are 1,000's of children that go un-adopted and spend their first 18 years of life in the system. Pro-lifers can claim adoption is a viable alternative but in reality it is not. Also, for many women the choice of; carrying the child for 9 months and giving it up for adoption is a lot harder to choose than aborting the fetus and trying to move on with your life.

You're right. As it currently stands it is not a viable alternative for all pregnant women. I'm not sure if it ever will be. But it doesn't mean that given the right funding and support it couldn't become a more viable alternative. I don't think every pregnant woman would choose to have the baby and place the child into the adoption system, but if that number could increase by 10 or 15% that is a big difference. Once again, it comes down to people (mainly people who are pro-life and Christians / churches) stepping up and giving charitably to this cause.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 11:13 AM
Statistics show that the number of abortions in the US each year is averaging approx. 1.2 million per year. This is not something that "charity" could handle. It would require more (dreaded by the right) government intervention and beauracracy and millions (if not billions) of dollars annually to deal with it.

Theoretically you may be able to reduce that 1.2 million per year significantly by promoting birth control and sex education but of course that too would require a huge investment of funds.

Wickabee
08-28-2012, 12:00 PM
Everyone says "except rape and incest" but what about medical conditions? I know one girl, not sure what the exact issue was, but she had an abortion because the chances of her dying if she carried to full term were like 80%.
Is that a viable enough reason for abortion for anyone? Or should she have died?

boba
08-28-2012, 12:06 PM
My answer to the op.

If abortion is in fact killing a life, and 1 million people are being killed in the USA every year, then it should be the top priority of every politician.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 12:13 PM
Everyone says "except rape and incest" but what about medical conditions? I know one girl, not sure what the exact issue was, but she had an abortion because the chances of her dying if she carried to full term were like 80%.
Is that a viable enough reason for abortion for anyone? Or should she have died?

Everyone says "except rape and incest" because in cases where the mother's health is at risk it is a given that MOST are agreeable with performing an abortion.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 12:15 PM
My answer to the op.

If abortion is in fact killing a life, and 1 million people are being killed in the USA every year, then it should be the top priority of every politician.

I agree with you, but the key to your statement is "IF". And the law has decided that it is not "killing a life".

Wickabee
08-28-2012, 12:18 PM
Everyone says "except rape and incest" because in cases where the mother's health is at risk it is a given that MOST are agreeable with performing an abortion.

I would think so too, but if a law was written as it's being set forth here, it wouldn't be.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 12:26 PM
I am 100% sure that ANY such law would include a provision regarding the mother's health.

Wickabee
08-28-2012, 12:29 PM
I just brought it up because it hasn't been yet. In this particular instance the child, apparrntly, would have likely been alright. I'm curious if aborting a child that will likely be okay to save the mother's life is okay for the anti crowd here or if they consider ir her punishment for sex.

mrveggieman
08-28-2012, 12:30 PM
My answer to the op.

If abortion is in fact killing a life, and 1 million people are being killed in the USA every year, then it should be the top priority of every politician.


Most politicians are full of it. They claim that they want to protect the uborn and they value human life by being against abortion but have no problem sending someone elses 18 year old baby to either die or kill someone elses babies in meaningless wars overseas.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 12:49 PM
I just brought it up because it hasn't been yet. In this particular instance the child, apparrntly, would have likely been alright. I'm curious if aborting a child that will likely be okay to save the mother's life is okay for the anti crowd here or if they consider ir her punishment for sex.

I'm not sure what you are getting at here. I have never heard of anyone (pro-life) that thinks the possible death of the mother is not a reasonable reason to abort.

Wickabee
08-28-2012, 12:54 PM
I'm not sure what you are getting at here. I have never heard of anyone (pro-life) that thinks the possible death of the mother is not a reasonable reason to abort.

I've been told if the child is likely to survive then abortion is wrong. That's where this is coming from.

What I'm getting at is pretty straightforward, so I'm not sure what your problem is.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 01:24 PM
I've been told if the child is likely to survive then abortion is wrong. That's where this is coming from.

What I'm getting at is pretty straightforward, so I'm not sure what your problem is.

You've been told that if the child is likely to survive and the mother may die, than abortion is wrong?

Wickabee
08-28-2012, 01:30 PM
You've been told that if the child is likely to survive and the mother may die, than abortion is wrong?

Yes. That it's "playing God" deciding who lives and who dies.

habsheaven
08-28-2012, 02:15 PM
Yes. That it's "playing God" deciding who lives and who dies.

Okay. Well I have rarely ever heard anyone take that stance. And I cannot think of anyone on here who has taken that stance, although when you frame it as "playing God" maybe a few of them will re-consider.