Favre pc - logos, lettermen, autos

[dfr52]

Agreed on the Mayo, its a nice looking card.

The shield and laundry tag are spectacular!

[the 'stache]

Your collection continues to amaze me, Oztatar! As a long time fan of Brett's (and one that's recently "forgiven" the team's prodigal son), I have gotten much enjoyment from the cards you have shared with us. Thank you so much!!

[mynameisjonas]

That donruss crusade is sharp, and the TTT pigskin card is something! I didn't know they had cards like those, it's the first one I've seen. Probably the coolest TTT design I'd say. I still like those Vikings cards, nice limited shield patch too.

[footballmike85]

i have not been following this thread like some of the other members but i did have a chance to look through all of the pictures and also read all of the stories/comments to go along with them. i was so captured by the story i couldnt stop reading. i am 26 years old and i have been collecting for 21 years. i remember pulling some of those inserts and being so excited about getting a rare card that had for that time unique qualities. it is so unfortunate that many of the younger collectors dont have any respect for the refractors and insert sets. the kids forget that it is not all about book or sell value its about collecting the player or team that you like and the stories behind the pulling/buying/trading for the cards. i came across your amazing thread while posting my own show thread and aspire to have a collection as great as yours someday.

my one problem with the thread is calling drew bledsoe an average quarterback. he was a top 15 quarteback of all time look up his stats i am sure you will be surprised when you find he is in the top ten in almost all catogories. besides the stats he helped bring along the best current quarterback in tom brady and IMO the best ever when he retires. most people didnt see it unless you watched the pats games in 2001 but bledsoe had a headset and would talk to brady and help him to understand the game. he also did it in dallas with romo who is not as good but still worth a mention.

sorry for starting a debate in you thread i just feel like bledsoe is like rodney dangerfield "he gets no respect"

my one question what is the total book value of your farve collection?

more importantly you have the nicest single player collection i have ever seen. i will be checking in for updates and pictures keep up the good work

[marinocollector]

my one problem with the thread is calling drew bledsoe an average quarterback. he was a top 15 quarteback of all time look up his stats i am sure you will be surprised when you find he is in the top ten in almost all catogories. besides the stats he helped bring along the best current quarterback in tom brady and IMO the best ever when he retires. most people didnt see it unless you watched the pats games in 2001 but bledsoe had a headset and would talk to brady and help him to understand the game. he also did it in dallas with romo who is not as good but still worth a mention.

sorry for starting a debate in you thread i just feel like bledsoe is like rodney dangerfield "he gets no respect"

OK.... I have to do this... Sorry, but after hearing all the comparisons of Bledsoe in his prime to Marino at the end of his career, I got sick of the Bledsoe hype.
Career QB Rating in the QB rating boom? 77.1 Not good. Looks decent from a historical perspective, but not when compared with his modern peers.
Not only did Bledsoe go 0-2 with a New England team that ended up winning a Super Bowl, he was replaced by a second year player who split time his senior year with Drew Henson. Brady has evolved into a QB of legendary status, but in no way did Brady have the skill set that Bledsoe had. Bledsoe, essentially, failed. Sure he came in to help lead the team to the playoff win, but at that time, it was Brady's team. Make matters worse, Bledsoe loses his spot and gets outperformed AGAIN by a late round draft pick in Dallas!
In my eyes, Bledsoe barely cracks the top 10 of QB's who played during a majority of his career.
Marino
Elway
Favre
Brady
Peyton
McNair
McNabb
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
All better QB's than Bledsoe. No way he's top 15. You still need to look at Brees, Rivers, Eli, Roethlisberger, Vick, Staubach, Aikman, Montana, Bob Griese, Tarkenton, Theisman, Namath, Unitas, Fouts, Bradshaw, Aaron Rodgers, Len Dawson, Starr, Stabler, Archie Manning. I imagine Drew Bledsoe belongs in the 40-50 best QB's of all time, and mainly for his skill set, not his performance on the field.

[dfr52]

OK.... I have to do this... Sorry, but after hearing all the comparisons of Bledsoe in his prime to Marino at the end of his career, I got sick of the Bledsoe hype.
Career QB Rating in the QB rating boom? 77.1 Not good. Looks decent from a historical perspective, but not when compared with his modern peers.
Not only did Bledsoe go 0-2 with a New England team that ended up winning a Super Bowl, he was replaced by a second year player who split time his senior year with Drew Henson. Brady has evolved into a QB of legendary status, but in no way did Brady have the skill set that Bledsoe had. Bledsoe, essentially, failed. Sure he came in to help lead the team to the playoff win, but at that time, it was Brady's team. Make matters worse, Bledsoe loses his spot and gets outperformed AGAIN by a late round draft pick in Dallas!
In my eyes, Bledsoe barely cracks the top 10 of QB's who played during a majority of his career.
Marino
Elway
Favre
Brady
Peyton
McNair
McNabb
Steve Young
Kurt Warner
All better QB's than Bledsoe. No way he's top 15. You still need to look at Brees, Rivers, Eli, Roethlisberger, Vick, Staubach, Aikman, Montana, Bob Griese, Tarkenton, Theisman, Namath, Unitas, Fouts, Bradshaw, Aaron Rodgers, Len Dawson, Starr, Stabler, Archie Manning. I imagine Drew Bledsoe belongs in the 40-50 best QB's of all time, and mainly for his skill set, not his performance on the field.

The QB rating boom didn't occur till the late 90's/early 2000's and by then the talent on the Patriots had really diminished. The OL wasn't very good and the WR's were about the same. Belichick & Weiss quickly turned the Pats around w/ excellent coaching and game planning. Brady has developed into a HOF'er but in 2001 he was not a key piece to their success. He was essentially along for the ride as the defense won games. Looking at the year Bledsoe had in 2002 I have no doubts that he could have won a Super Bowl w/ the Pats in 2001, especially since he took over and won the Championship game for Brady in 2001.

Bledsoe lost his job b/c the Cowboys OL had trouble pass blocking and he had no mobility.

[marinocollector]

The QB rating boom didn't occur till the late 90's/early 2000's and by then the talent on the Patriots had really diminished. The OL wasn't very good and the WR's were about the same. Belichick & Weiss quickly turned the Pats around w/ excellent coaching and game planning. Brady has developed into a HOF'er but in 2001 he was not a key piece to their success. He was essentially along for the ride as the defense won games. Looking at the year Bledsoe had in 2002 I have no doubts that he could have won a Super Bowl w/ the Pats in 2001, especially since he took over and won the Championship game for Brady in 2001.

Bledsoe lost his job b/c the Cowboys OL had trouble pass blocking and he had no mobility.

How can you say the Patriots weren't very good in the early 2000s when they won Super Bowls in 2001, 2003, and 2004?
Notice how the OL wasn't good in New England and the OL wasn't good in Dallas? But two QB's with good footwork managed to make good plays in the same offense?

Lets go into the Career stats...
6th in Completions and Attempts, 8th in yardage, 14th in TDs, 81st in Rating, Sacked the 6th most, 163rd in yards/attempt, 3rd in attempts/game, 77th in pass completion

98-95 career record. Only 3 seasons of 10+ wins.
I also can't put a QB in the top 15 All Time who only made the playoffs 3 times.

Seems like a QB who's teams depended on him to win games with his arm. Which he did, half of the time.
Drew Bledsoe on the 2001 Patriots? 0-2.
Tom Brady, first time NFL starter? 11-3.

Drew Bledsoe on the 2006 Cowboys? 3-3.
Tony Romo, first time NFL starter? 6-4.

Both players had a 10 point QB rating increase over Bledsoe on the same teams.

Once again, I think Bledsoe had a good skill set, good enough to put him in the top 40-50 QBs all time, but anything higher I feel is unwarranted.

[dfr52]

]How can you say the Patriots weren't very good in the early 2000s[/b] when they won Super Bowls in 2001, 2003, and 2004?
Notice how the OL wasn't good in New England and the OL wasn't good in Dallas? But two QB's with good footwork managed to make good plays in the same offense?

Lets go into the Career stats...
6th in Completions and Attempts, 8th in yardage, 14th in TDs, 81st in Rating, Sacked the 6th most, 163rd in yards/attempt, 3rd in attempts/game, 77th in pass completion

98-95 career record. Only 3 seasons of 10+ wins.
I also can't put a QB in the top 15 All Time who only made the playoffs 3 times.

Seems like a QB who's teams depended on him to win games with his arm. Which he did, half of the time.
Drew Bledsoe on the 2001 Patriots? 0-2.
Tom Brady, first time NFL starter? 11-3.

Drew Bledsoe on the 2006 Cowboys? 3-3.
Tony Romo, first time NFL starter? 6-4.

Both players had a 10 point QB rating increase over Bledsoe on the same teams.

Once again, I think Bledsoe had a good skill set, good enough to put him in the top 40-50 QBs all time, but anything higher I feel is unwarranted.

Yes the Pats got better after Bledsoe left b/c of coaching and Brady's development but the defense was still the heart of those teams. Bledsoe was never in a great passing system or had the benefit of an outstanding defense like Brady. Bledose might have started 0-2, but won when the Pats needed him most in the Championship game.

I wouldn't say Brady or Romo had better footwork but rather younger legs when they took over for Bledsoe. The Pats OL also started to play better toward the end of the 2001 season.

Cassel didn't have a rating jump of 10 points but he looked pretty darn good in the Pats system for a QB who hadn't started since high school.

[marinocollector]

Yes the Pats got better after Bledsoe left b/c of coaching and Brady's development but the defense was still the heart of those teams. Bledsoe was never in a great passing system or had the benefit of an outstanding defense like Brady. Bledose might have started 0-2, but won when the Pats needed him most in the Championship game.

I wouldn't say Brady or Romo had better footwork but rather younger legs when they took over for Bledsoe. The Pats OL also started to play better toward the end of the 2001 season.

Cassel didn't have a rating jump of 10 points but he looked pretty darn good in the Pats system for a QB who hadn't started since high school.

The coaching was better after he left? He was there when it got better! The team did not respond to Bledsoe? Why is that?!?! I don't know, but to see two different QB's to come into the same systems and replace Bledsoe, and wildly outperform him, I cannot put him in the top 15 All Time.
The line didn't get better with Brady. The OL gave up an average of 3 sacks in a game, still Brady won for the 01 Pats. And with a weighted average of over 3000 yards passing and 20 TDs for the NFL season, that makes a great first year starting.
Also, Bledsoe didn't do THAT great in the AFC Championship game. he made a few plays that helped, but still had 40% completion percentage. The culture changed for that team when Brady was QB. That culture was still there when Bledsoe filled in. In that second game of the season, which the Patriots lost, Bledsoe had a rating of under 50 while the Pats D allowed only 10 points. The first game against the Bengals the Pats lost 23-17.
As far as Cassell goes, the culture was already changed. A great QB has that effect on a team. Also, the Patriots were 16-0 the season before. 5 or 6 losses the next season is a HUGE drop off. A drop off caused by not having Brady at QB. It would be similar to how everyone made such a big deal about Olandis Gary coming in for Terrell Davis and running for 1200 yards. Nice and dandy, but TD had 2k the year before. Big difference.

[OZTATAR]

Okay, it's my thread, so I should outline my thoughts - even if it is about Bledose and not Favre!

I may have been a little unkind saying Bledsoe was only average - I would say he is above average, and while he was not as good as the other QBs in the good category in my good/bad/ugly category (which is why I didn't say he was good because he wasn't compared to those) he was still a pretty good QB

That being said I don't think he was great, and I will show why - by comparing him to Favre (who else?), Marino and the QB I hate (along with Eli Manning) more than any other, John Elway.

Winning Percentage

Bledsoe - 50.8% (98 - 95)
Favre - 62.4% (186 -112) remember the Packers were 4 and 12 the season before Favre took over and 0-2 the season he took over, but he lead them to a 9 - 7 record
Marino - 61.3% (147 -93)
Elway - 64.3% (148 -82-1)

QB Rating

Bledsoe - 77.1
Favre - 86.0
Marino - 86.4
Elway - 79.9

Completion Percentage

Bledsoe - 57.2%
Favre - 62.0%
Marino - 59.4%
Elway - 56.9%

TD to Int ratio

Bledsoe - 1.22:1 (251 to 206)
Favre - 1.51:1 (508 to 336)
Marino - 1.67:1 (420 to 252)
Elway - 1.33:1 (300 to 226)

Now while statistically Blesdoe may be close to Elway, when it comes to winning oprecentage he isn't close. From a statistical and winning standpoint he isn't close to Favre or Marino. I therefore think that he isn't close to being a great QB. A fairly good one yes, but great no.