The bible - fact or fiction???

[Star_Cards]

as far as the link, I didn't read it all, but from my experience not all Muslims have the same views as terrorists that claim Islam and try to exterminate non islam believers. It's just like I know not all christians are like the nut jobs from the Westboro Baptist Church that protest military funerals.

[mrveggieman]

You this Islam vs Christanity reminds me of an old George Carlin joke that I'm going to paraphrase. "Do you believe in God? Yes. Do you believe in my God. No. Boom you're dead. My God is "bigger" than your God." Please note that I cleaned up this joke since this is a family website but we all know where he was going with it.

[habsheaven]

as I stated earlier, Islam has no Messiah. I can't say what those texts really mean but I do know Islam does not believe in Jesus other than that he was a prophet and not a Messiah.

Well apparently sanfran22 and AUtaxman do KNOW what those texts really mean. Luckily none of us have ever crossed paths with a practicing Muslim or we would be dead right now.

[mrveggieman]

Well apparently sanfran22 and AUtaxman do KNOW what those texts really mean. Luckily none of us have ever crossed paths with a practicing Muslim or we would be dead right now.

Good thing that we have never crossed paths with real "Christians" like jerry fallwell or terry jones or we would be dead right now.

[Wudeverbro]

Well apparently sanfran22 and AUtaxman do KNOW what those texts really mean. Luckily none of us have ever crossed paths with a practicing Muslim or we would be dead right now.

I'd have to think that they don't mean what they say in today's terms, otherwise as someone had stated earlier, we'd all be dead and only Muslims would be walking the Earth. I just know for my faith, the stories in the OT do not literally apply to present day terms but are a good teaching source for our faith.

As for the Westboro Baptist Church, I tried to contact them to no avail since they were bombarded with messages on their website. I go to a Baptist church myself and when I heard about what they did I was very saddened and wanted to rebuke them. it's people like them that make it very hard to share the Gospel with anyone.

[gatorboymike]

Actually, Christians DO have to follow the Mosiac law.

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."
- Matthew 5:17-18

Christian apologists will say that when he says "fulfill," he effectively means abolish. So he came not to abolish the law, but to abolish it? Suuuuuure. The only laws he supposedly abolished were the sacrificial laws, and if you want to stretch it, maybe the dietary laws too. Everything else, you're still instructed to uphold. That includes making war against non-Christians, killing and enslaving them.

And while we're shoulder-deep inside the borderline (musical reference FTW), Muslim apologists will try to brush off those verses in the Quran about making war on non-Muslims and slaying them wherever you find them by saying "Oh, that only means don't START a war. It's OK to make war and slay infidels if THEY start it. See, it says 'begin not hostilities' and 'do not slay the innocent.'" Of course, modern Islamic culture has made it clear that they consider other nations not being Muslim, in and of itself, to be the beginning of hostilities. And according to Islamic cleric Anjem Choudary, Britain's answer to Jerry Falwell, "when we say 'innocent people,' we mean Muslims." So it's open season on everyone else.

There, are you happy? I criticized Islam too. Now I don't want to hear this "oh, you atheists only talk about Christianity because secretly you know we're right, uh huh huh huh." Dispense with the pretense, Hortense.

[Wudeverbro]

Actually, Christians DO have to follow the Mosiac law.

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."
- Matthew 5:17-18

Christian apologists will say that when he says "fulfill," he effectively means abolish. So he came not to abolish the law, but to abolish it? Suuuuuure. The only laws he supposedly abolished were the sacrificial laws, and if you want to stretch it, maybe the dietary laws too. Everything else, you're still instructed to uphold. That includes making war against non-Christians, killing and enslaving them.

And while we're shoulder-deep inside the borderline (musical reference FTW), Muslim apologists will try to brush off those verses in the Quran about making war on non-Muslims and slaying them wherever you find them by saying "Oh, that only means don't START a war. It's OK to make war and slay infidels if THEY start it. See, it says 'begin not hostilities' and 'do not slay the innocent.'" Of course, modern Islamic culture has made it clear that they consider other nations not being Muslim, in and of itself, to be the beginning of hostilities. And according to Islamic cleric Anjem Choudary, Britain's answer to Jerry Falwell, "when we say 'innocent people,' we mean Muslims." So it's open season on everyone else.

There, are you happy? I criticized Islam too. Now I don't want to hear this "oh, you atheists only talk about Christianity because secretly you know we're right, uh huh huh huh." Dispense with the pretense, Hortense.

Believe what you want, nothing in the Bible tells me that I need to "make war against non-Christians, kill and enslave them." If this is what you really believe about Christians, I really wish you the best of luck.

[mrveggieman]

Actually, Christians DO have to follow the Mosiac law.

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished."
- Matthew 5:17-18

Christian apologists will say that when he says "fulfill," he effectively means abolish. So he came not to abolish the law, but to abolish it? Suuuuuure. The only laws he supposedly abolished were the sacrificial laws, and if you want to stretch it, maybe the dietary laws too. Everything else, you're still instructed to uphold. That includes making war against non-Christians, killing and enslaving them.

And while we're shoulder-deep inside the borderline (musical reference FTW), Muslim apologists will try to brush off those verses in the Quran about making war on non-Muslims and slaying them wherever you find them by saying "Oh, that only means don't START a war. It's OK to make war and slay infidels if THEY start it. See, it says 'begin not hostilities' and 'do not slay the innocent.'" Of course, modern Islamic culture has made it clear that they consider other nations not being Muslim, in and of itself, to be the beginning of hostilities. And according to Islamic cleric Anjem Choudary, Britain's answer to Jerry Falwell, "when we say 'innocent people,' we mean Muslims." So it's open season on everyone else.

There, are you happy? I criticized Islam too. Now I don't want to hear this "oh, you atheists only talk about Christianity because secretly you know we're right, uh huh huh huh." Dispense with the pretense, Hortense.

Do we really need any more Jerry Fallwells? But on the cool even though I don't agree with being an atheist I can respect them because they can give an objective and unbiased answer on why they don't believe in any scriptures compared to religious nuts who can't give you a consistent let alone logical answer on why they believe in what they believe and why their religion is superior to all others.

[Wudeverbro]

Do we really need any more Jerry Fallwells? But on the cool even though I don't agree with being an atheist I can respect them because they can give an objective and unbiased answer on why they don't believe in any scriptures compared to religious nuts who can't give you a consistent let alone logical answer on why they believe in what they believe and why their religion is superior to all others.

I disagree that nonbelievers can all be objective and unbiased in answering questions about religion. Everyone has an agenda and atheists' main objective is to disprove and unsubstantiate any claims about what Christians/Muslims, etc believe. There may be no relative uniform belief from Atheists but each of them has some sort of agenda that is not really consistent from one Atheist to the next. Kind of like how some Christians differ in their interpretation of certain passages of the Bible.

[mrveggieman]

I disagree that nonbelievers can all be objective and unbiased in answering questions about religion. Everyone has an agenda and atheists' main objective is to disprove and unsubstantiate any claims about what Christians/Muslims, etc believe. There may be no relative uniform belief from Atheists but each of them has some sort of agenda that is not really consistent from one Atheist to the next. Kind of like how some Christians differ in their interpretation of certain passages of the Bible.

I like you because you are one of the few christians that I've read on here that makes an ounce of sense. However this is where we disagree somewhat. Most (but not all) atheists are not on a personal crusade to disprove religion. However most religious people are on a personal crusade to prove that their religion is right and if you don't follow theirs exactly as they perscribe you are doomed to hell. Atheists go about their daily business because atheism is not religion and faith means nothing to them. It's just like asking one of us on here about barbie dolls. However if you ask an atheist for their opinion about a religious issue they will tell you what they think. Again I am not an atheist nor am I supporting or endorsing atheism I am just giving respect where respect is due. I think that a lot of christians, muslims, and jews could learn a lot from atheists.