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  1. #11
    The answer to veggie's original question can be summed up nicely by Alex's signature. Only Atheism practices LOGIC and REASON. Every religion, whether it has 1 follower or 1 billion followers, all rely on their members casting logic aside.
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  2. #12


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    ssuming my particular blief system were a "religion" the answer is, it's not.
    "He's gone crazy," "You have to snap out of it," "Take your meds," or, "Don't be such a downer" serve only to mock, belittle, and make light of mental illness. Such phrases only continue the negative stigma and keep those who suffer from getting help. If these phrases, or phrases like them, are part of your at-hand vocabulary, you are part of the problem. #STOPtheStigma

  3. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
    I feel sorry for you Alex, if we lived by GOD'S standards that have been here since the beginning of time, not just since America was established, we would all be better off. Where has your secular country got you-into the mess America now is? The fall of America began when prayer was removed from school and Americas secular way of thinking began. It has continued under Obama, who will continue to drive America down, until either revolt occurs, we are taken over by China, or the LORD returns. Good day sir, we have nothing in common and no need to converse. I pray you find the TRUTH, cause hell is busting wide open with "secular" thinkers like yourself.
    I guess there is no point to responding to something like this.

    The only thing I want to say is that you don't have to feel sorry for me.

    I use reasoning and logic to make my decisions in life.
    Logic and Reason is all you need.

  4. #14
    Habs, your definition of logic and reason are quite different than mine. SO you can say anyone who practices any form of religion is less logical than any atheist? if so, you are the one who's logic is in question.

    veggie, I don't think my religion is better I just believe everything came from something, the logic you can get something from nothing doesn't seem, well very logical. Their was an initial movement, something started all of this.

    I love science and continue to research all forms of religion and history. At this point in time I do believe that Jesus was a from of God on Earth and for that reason, I accept Him as the way. I know it sounds crazy and there is no "proof" I could provide you. but the logic habs speaks of is what has lead me this way so far. logic for me is knowing what I want to know and then figuring out how I can get to the point of knowing it.
    Religion of all kind, evolution, astrology, the Iching, all point to a single source. Though I feel that this form of life will never lead me to truly finding this one source, I do feel the need to try an understand what it could be. Whether science, religion, philosophy, or anything else can give me that answer, I will look there.

    As I stated above at this point Jesus seems to hold more answers than anything else. I do not think I know better because of this, simply I believe I am right and I am willing to be proven wrong.
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  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
    If you ever take the time to read the documents, you will find references to the BIBLE and to our Lord, our Savior.
    Follow the archelogy of the Bible. Mostly written by weirdos that lived in Caves, 99% of the New Testament was written by mooks that didn't even know the yeshua.

    If you ever look at Roman History which is fact based, jesus was a criminal non-entity. The gospels written by other early brainwashers were done hundreds of years following his death.

    Ghosts aren't fathers. Jesus was just a guy. The Bible is a piece of literature written in gibberish with regard to common sense.

    It is not the word of any god. It is written by men that were afraid of solar eclipse and going off the edge of the Earth on a boat.
    Last edited by centrehice; 11-30-2012 at 10:24 PM.

  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Bobby View Post
    I feel sorry for you Alex, if we lived by GOD'S standards that have been here since the beginning of time, not just since America was established, we would all be better off. Where has your secular country got you-into the mess America now is? The fall of America began when prayer was removed from school and Americas secular way of thinking began. It has continued under Obama, who will continue to drive America down, until either revolt occurs, we are taken over by China, or the LORD returns. Good day sir, we have nothing in common and no need to converse. I pray you find the TRUTH, cause hell is busting wide open with "secular" thinkers like yourself.
    Wow. That is very Christian of you (Maybe, not? Depends on the Christian you ask). I am glad secular thinkers like Alex and myself do not have to fear hell. I guess you live a life full of fear, right?
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  7. #17



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    Quote Originally Posted by centrehice View Post
    Follow the archelogy of the Bible. Mostly written by weirdos that lived in Caves, 99% of the New Testament was written by mooks that didn't even know the yeshua.

    If you ever look at Roman History which is fact based, jesus was a criminal non-entity. The gospels written by other early brainwashers were done hundreds of years following his death.
    Of course the Romans viewed Jesus as a criminal. He claimed to be a King and they executed him.

    The gospels were written in A.D. 60-70, 30-40 years after Jesus was executed, which is a relatively short time. It's kind of like if someone who was at the Twin Towers on 9/11 and witnessed the events first hand, writes down their recollection of what happened twenty years from now.
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  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by tpeichel View Post
    Of course the Romans viewed Jesus as a criminal. He claimed to be a King and they executed him.

    The gospels were written in A.D. 60-70, 30-40 years after Jesus was executed, which is a relatively short time. It's kind of like if someone who was at the Twin Towers on 9/11 and witnessed the events first hand, writes down their recollection of what happened twenty years from now.
    I disagree. We have video, audio and first hand accounts from the day of the event. Your anology is flawed based on this information.

    Memories change minute to minute, day to day, year to year. Find a book written by a witness at the crucifixon of Christ that the majority of scholars agree on and then we can talk.

    Until then it is just your faith.
    Last edited by drtom2005; 12-01-2012 at 12:14 AM.
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  9. #19



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    Quote Originally Posted by drtom2005 View Post
    I disagree. We have video, audio and first hand accounts from the day of the event. Your anology is flawed based on this information.

    Memories change minute to minute, day to day, year to year. Find a book written by a witness at the crucifixon of Christ that the majority of scholars agree on and then we can talk.
    I was simply comparing the time period between when Jesus died and when the Gospels were written to someone who witnessed a modern historical event. 20 years from now, an eye witness could certainly write down what they remember happening. People have done this throughout history.

    If you read Luke, he is taking on the role of historian:

    Since many have undertaken to set down an orderly account of the events that have been fulfilled among us, just as they were handed on to us by those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and servants of the word, I too decided after investigating everything carefully from the very first, to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, so that you may know the truth concerning the things about which you have been instructed.

    I don't think there is a lot of argument about whether or not Christ was crucified. I think all accounts agree on the important parts, that the Romans killed him.
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  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by tpeichel View Post
    I was simply comparing the time period between when Jesus died and when the Gospels were written to someone who witnessed a modern historical event. 20 years from now, an eye witness could certainly write down what they remember happening. People have done this throughout history.

    If you read Luke, he is taking on the role of historian:

    Since many have undertaken to set down an orderly account of the events that have been fulfilled among us, just as they were handed on to us by those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and servants of the word, I too decided after investigating everything carefully from the very first, to write an orderly account for you, most excellent Theophilus, so that you may know the truth concerning the things about which you have been instructed.

    I don't think there is a lot of argument about whether or not Christ was crucified. I think all accounts agree on the important parts, that the Romans killed him.
    People got crucified all of the time in ancient Rome. The question is whether the man known as Jesus(from the Bible) was real. There is no data to support he was real.

    We have contempory reports of Alexander the Great and maybe Julius Ceasar's death mask(this is debated by scholars, but most agree one is real). This would be evidence. The Shroud of Turin has been carbon dated to the Middle Ages(not Jesus' time).
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