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  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by marinocollector View Post
    I am confused how you don't want value to be added by parallel cards, only seeing value in GU'd and Auto's, yet also want lower pack prices. Also, minimum wage was different in your youth, as an hour wage could get 7-8 packs of basic cards. Today, your child could get 7-8 packs of Score Football with minimum wage. the option is still there, but your child wishes to spend it on something more expensive (based on your wording.) Not everything in the world needs to be created for all budgets. That makes more valuable items less valuable. This product is priced VERY fair based on the fact, in 1995, Topps Finest would have cost the same as this product does, only this one includes autograph cards as well.
    My point is that there is no intrinsic value based on the color the card company decides to use. There is absolutely no boost in value of the actual card because it's blue, or red, or green, regardless of the print run.

    Now, it can be argued that no value is added because someone who happens to be good at baseball, or basketball, or badminton signs a piece of cardboard. But, at the very least, autographs have held value as a collectible for ages. A baseball costs about $3.99, and basically has for decades, but a baseball signed by Mantle has always been more.

    I have a hard time with something being exponentially more valuable because of the CMYK combination. You quote inflation, but Matchbox cars cost about a buck today, and really have for as long as I can remember. Let's say they were even half that. So they've doubled in price in the last 30 years. A pack of baseball cards 30 years ago cost about .50. Today? The average price (from base to, say Topps Five Star, which retails at $500) is probably closer to $50. That's nowhere near the average inflation rate.

    And my kid is six. His budget is based on whatever someone gives him. It's not like he's choosing to spend his $5 or $10 and spending it on something more expensive, or even WANTING to spend it on something more expensive. We go into the card shop, he decides he wants basketball, or baseball, or whatever, and he gets the least expensive packs because that's where his money gets spread out the most. But, even then, that doesn't get much and that's my point.
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  2. #32
    there is no actual value to any card for any reason other than popularity and a market for it. cards are made of cardboard, they don't have actual legit value.

    you have no point, it's a market, just like the stock market, there is no ACTUAL value.... it's a fluctuating market based on popularity, this is how almost everything in the real world works, almost nothing is based on actual value.

    nike shoes aren't worth what they cost, levi's jeans aren't worth what they cost, cell phones aren't worth what they cost...... almost nothing is actual cost. welcome to 2012.

  3. #33
    Obviously Nike shoes aren't worth the $5 that the material costs (plus the minimal labor costs Nike incurs by doing business overseas.)

    My point of view (and take it or leave it) is that card makers and the free market dictate what a card is worth by color...which REALLY has no value. Presuming they're using an off-set press, it's a mixture of four inks. Nothing more, and nothing less.

    A cell phone's value/price is not soley dictated by the parts and labor, although obviously a smartphone costs more both in parts and the amount of labor required...it's dictated by what the device does. A simple phone (or your card, here) will always cost less because it does less. If the IDENTICAL MODEL, regardless of the color, be it black, or blue, or red - as long as it only dials a number and places a call, obviously the value is the same. If it's an iphone (auto or jersey), and the device actually does more, well, it's worth the extra money.

    THAT is my argument - a card that the manufacturer had to go through the trouble to create - albeit most of the time now that means sending out a sheet of stickers for someone to sign - and there's something special about it, maybe a signature, or a piece of Babe Ruth's bat...that, to me, has a value to it. Not the fact that Panini decided that, say, ONLY every 1000th sheet in the print run would be gold. ZERO % more labor goes into making them. They just happen to be rarer because there are fewer sheets of cardboard to cut.

    Maybe this is a rambling mess, but...anyway, agree to disagree.
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  4. #34

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    This is clearly like why in Baseball Bowman Chrome Red Refractors /25 always sell for a solid amount no matter who the player is. It could be a joke prospect or a superstar base, but the fact that the set and card is in such demand, the prices just normally get jacked up more then they actually should. Like someone stated before, a Bonus Shot /10 and a Prizm Gold /10, yes they may be the same rarity in pulling, but one set is more popular then the other and one has a more appeal to collectors that the prices just will never be the same.
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  5. #35
    limiting a print run of an official release always makes something more valueable, nike lebron/jordans have limited print runs of certain shoes that cost more and fly off the shelves, exactly the same, the iphone comes in white and all the sudden flys off the shelves..... you have no point man, it's all market value...... has nothing to do with actual value of the cardboard it's printed on.

  6. #36
    As I said, I get all of that (I thought the whole "cell phone cost isn't based on parts and labor" thing was a good analogy, but maybe not...)

    No matter how anyone tries to market a parallel, all it is - at the end of the day - is a base card in a different color. You bring up the white iPhone, but Apple didn't jack up the cost because of the color. It costs the exact same as the black one. Maybe people snatch them up quicker, but they do it at the same price, not at a premium.

    If someone wants to pay tens, hundreds, in some case thousands of dollars for a parallel - more power to them. But, that's why some of my rainbows wil never be complete. I can't bring myself to pay $75 bucks for a /10 that is, in effect, the exact same card as a /499.

    If someone wants to pay those prices - cool - to each his own, and more power to them for doing something that makes them happy.
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  7. #37
    Quote Originally Posted by jmintz View Post
    As I said, I get all of that (I thought the whole "cell phone cost isn't based on parts and labor" thing was a good analogy, but maybe not...)

    No matter how anyone tries to market a parallel, all it is - at the end of the day - is a base card in a different color. You bring up the white iPhone, but Apple didn't jack up the cost because of the color. It costs the exact same as the black one. Maybe people snatch them up quicker, but they do it at the same price, not at a premium.

    If someone wants to pay tens, hundreds, in some case thousands of dollars for a parallel - more power to them. But, that's why some of my rainbows wil never be complete. I can't bring myself to pay $75 bucks for a /10 that is, in effect, the exact same card as a /499.

    If someone wants to pay those prices - cool - to each his own, and more power to them for doing something that makes them happy.
    Panini didn't jack up the cost of this card because it is /10. It cost the same amount from the manufacturer as the 3 base cards in the pack.

    The premium appears in the aftermarket because of the limited print run. Although you fail to see the value of a card with a different color and a shorter print, the fact of the matter is that the collecting community as a whole accepts these variations, often cherishing them. I, myself, feel most parallels are over priced and not necessary, but my point of view does not diminish its value to the public.

    My basic reason for commenting in this thread is, as a collector, I find it frustrating to see people bust wax, and get blasted when asking fair prices. Wax is VERY expensive, and to pull one of 3000 total cards in a box is VERY difficult and costly to do. With the amount of brick and mortar stores in business, it would mean only ONE gold refractor per store. IF one's community had a card shop, one would have a 1:300 chance that their shop would have the ONE player they collect. That's big odds, odds I think collectors no, longer understand because of the internet. I know eBay creates an illusion that these cards are readily available, but when a popular release like Prizm pops up, these cards dry up FAST.
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