Poll: Who wins 2012 MVP?

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  1. #41
    I was gonna give my reasoning for picking Peyton, but this pretty much nails it.

    Quote Originally Posted by duane1969 View Post
    Gotta be Peyton Manning. Coming back from an injury, switching teams, and he still is 5th in yards, 2nd in TDs, 3rd in passer rating and leading the Broncos towards a first round bye in the playoffs and helping them be (in my opinion) the top contender for winning the Super Bowl.
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  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by ensbergcollector View Post

    Also, I stand by it, tim tebow took this broncos team to the second round of the playoffs. Why is what manning is doing so impressive?
    (not saying he doesn't deserve consideration, just unclear why people act like the broncos were a 2-14 team last year without peyton)
    Quote Originally Posted by ensbergcollector View Post
    i like how everyone discredits brady because the pats did well without him but those same people don't discredit manning when the broncos did well with tebow.
    So you think the Broncos with Tebow last year are just as successful and effective as the Broncos with Manning this year? I don't see where it is even remotely comparable. With Tebow the Broncos barely made the playoffs as a wildcard with an 8-8 record. With Manning the Broncos are 10-3, on an 8 game win streak and are the #3 AFC seed. With Tebow the Broncos had the #23 offense, with Manning they have the #4 offense.

    Compare that to the Patriots/Brady. Without Brady in 2008 the Patriots were 11-5 and had the #5 ranked offense. With Brady in 2009 the Patriots were 10-6 and had the #3 ranked offense. Significant argument can be made that the Patriots offense is as much about the system as the players.

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  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by Titantron View Post
    Anybody who is IMPARTIAL can watch Brady and Manning play and clearly see that Manning is better. It is clear that Manning has something that no other QB has. The arguments will always be there because of stats and super bowls and frankly an east coast media bias. Brady does a lot of dinking and dunking. Simply put, Brady wouldnt be Brady without his coach and his team. Marvin Harrison, Tony Dungy, Jeff Saturday, Dallas Clark, Brandon Stokely, Eric Decker, on and on and on wouldnt be names I could remember without Manning...Maybe marvin harrison, but he would be about as memorable as Lee Evans or some other good reciever that never really stood out over everybody else. Thats just reality. Brady has wins and he plays in a big city in the northeast. He is certainly better than Namath and Bradshaw, but those are two examples of good QBs that are great legends in NFL history because of where they played and not how they played. Again, Brady is much better than them, but... If they were the Jacksonville Patriots, it would be common knowledge that Manning is the best QB of this era and probably ever. Its certainly clear that Manning is more valuable this season and any other season.
    I'm impartial and I can see Manning isn't better than Brady.

    I do enjoy the knock on Brady, it's like everyone forgets what he was a major factor in reviving the career of Randy Moss, and had one of the best offensive seasons a lot of us may ever see.

    Peyton Manning is great, no denying it, Brady is just better.
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  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by ensbergcollector View Post
    Also, I stand by it, tim tebow took this broncos team to the second round of the playoffs. Why is what manning is doing so impressive?
    (not saying he doesn't deserve consideration, just unclear why people act like the broncos were a 2-14 team last year without peyton)
    There is one key difference, Tim Tebow is an awful QB who was benefited from a great amount of luck and help from his defense, Peyton Manning is an elite QB.
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  5. #45
    I know this is off topic...but how are the Broncos getting a first round bye?
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  6. #46
    I use to think Brady was ALWAYS overrated. But then I started watching him closer and analyzing his command, his accuracy, his consistency and realized he is an Elite QB. Anyone who says he is only good because of his Coaches, or his supporting cast is just bias on many aspects they wish they had in there teams starting QB. Of course Brady is good because of his coaching and of course Brady is good because of his team but thats because he has always had the talent to be excellent and he was placed in the right place to produce his talent. Brady will be in the Hall of Fame and will most likely win another super bowl but this years MVP is very debatable but each side has valid points. A majority of individuals said we expect Peyton to preform the way he currently is but thats just stereo typing his earlier career. There was skepticism that we would never see Peyton "perform" again. and the same argument could be made with Peterson. Peterson was destined not to produce after surgery yet he has defied odds. Peyton has made a team that was "playoff" bond last year into a Super bowl bond team. So my vote is Peyton for MVP and Peterson for Come Back Player. Yeah Luck is a huge reason the Colts have had success but he was the first pick in the NFL draft which means that the Colts were the worst team in the NFL. So Wilson could have went first and led the colts to the same current record. Not dishing on Luck just saying the colts might have tanked last year to be "lucky" this year. But Luck is my Rookie of the year pick.
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  7. #47
    I'll put my 2 cents in too. might as well lol. while i dont think brady has a cleat path to the mvp award i'll say this. i was NOT a brady fan. i was the first to say he was over rated because of the system he's in. i do believe he's so good because he's been in the same system for so long. HOWEVER; brady throws a lot more than just 10 yard passes. after watching the trainwreck on monday night against houston i gained new respect for him as a player. i know he was on top of his game, but he was seriously unstopable. i have rarely ever seen a qb play that well for 4 quarters against anyone. much less houston. he's not just a ten yard passer. he threw many passes over 20 yards and completed almost all of them with the receiver being double or triple covered. he put the ball where only the receivers could catch it. i have seen schaub play like that on occasion, but not consistantly. when he plays like that he's lights out. brady is a great qb. to say there's a clear difference between him and manning is wrong. manning use to have more long passes. when he ran the offense in indianapolis he set the plays up that way. brady can do just the same. its just the offense he runs isnt like what manning use to run. i do think it shuld come down to manning or AP for mvp, but saying brady is clearly not as good as manning is obsurd. ive held my opinions for a long time about him, and watching what he can do and does do when he shreds your team give light on the situation. i'll put it this way. if brady was qb in houston they would be immediate sb favorates. with manning they wouldnt be. thats what made my mind up about him. although as i said i dont think he's the clear cut favorite for mvp.
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  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by duane1969 View Post
    So you think the Broncos with Tebow last year are just as successful and effective as the Broncos with Manning this year? I don't see where it is even remotely comparable. With Tebow the Broncos barely made the playoffs as a wildcard with an 8-8 record. With Manning the Broncos are 10-3, on an 8 game win streak and are the #3 AFC seed. With Tebow the Broncos had the #23 offense, with Manning they have the #4 offense.

    Compare that to the Patriots/Brady. Without Brady in 2008 the Patriots were 11-5 and had the #5 ranked offense. With Brady in 2009 the Patriots were 10-6 and had the #3 ranked offense. Significant argument can be made that the Patriots offense is as much about the system as the players.
    while some of it is definitely the system but what is the argument for 2001-2006? everyone points to 2008 but that year they had pro bowlers at pretty much every position so yes a stiff like cassel could even get to 11 wins with that squad.
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  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by duane1969 View Post
    So you think the Broncos with Tebow last year are just as successful and effective as the Broncos with Manning this year? I don't see where it is even remotely comparable. With Tebow the Broncos barely made the playoffs as a wildcard with an 8-8 record. With Manning the Broncos are 10-3, on an 8 game win streak and are the #3 AFC seed. With Tebow the Broncos had the #23 offense, with Manning they have the #4 offense.

    Compare that to the Patriots/Brady. Without Brady in 2008 the Patriots were 11-5 and had the #5 ranked offense. With Brady in 2009 the Patriots were 10-6 and had the #3 ranked offense. Significant argument can be made that the Patriots offense is as much about the system as the players.
    definitely not trying to compare peyton and tebow. My issue is everyone always points to the record the patriots had when brady was out as a sign that he isn't that important. Also, tebow went 7-4, you can't put orton's 1-4 start on his stats. Everyone is acting like Manning has taken a 2-14 team to the playoffs. He has taken a playoff team and made them much better offensively. While his year is impressive, to act like he has done something miraculous is a little misleading. I don't think there is anyone in the world who didn't think Manning would make the broncos better offensively.
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  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by BradyToMoss View Post
    while some of it is definitely the system but what is the argument for 2001-2006? everyone points to 2008 but that year they had pro bowlers at pretty much every position so yes a stiff like cassel could even get to 11 wins with that squad.
    For me the most telling aspect about the system is Brady's early years. He never had the "struggle" that young QBs do. From his first season to now he has always been a statistical standout. I have to think that being in a system that either plays to his skills or that makes good players great is at least part of it. No QB that was considered a career back-up and not drafted until the end of the draft should have a start to their career as strong as he did, and Cassel's performance in the system lends to that argument a bit.

    With that said, I think that Brady has absolutely mastered the system. He has clearly taken his game to next level within the system. He is doing better now with "pretty good" players than he was doing 6 or 7 years ago with Pro Bowl players. If you compare 2002 to 2011 you can see that he really has mastered the system. He only threw 10 more passes in 2011 than in 2002 but he threw for 1471 more yards, 11 more TDs and the same INTs.

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