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  1. #51


    Wickabee's Avatar

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    Alex: Would you have more respect for Christians if they suddenly pulled a 180 on their beliefs about homosexuality?
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  2. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by shrewsbury View Post
    wrong again, nothing was written by Jesus, nothing.
    lol, didn't I say the ENTIRE bible was written by man?

    Quote Originally Posted by shrewsbury View Post
    for nearly four hundred years after Jesus, no Bible existed, so were there no Christians?
    There were christians, but it was a small cult....and yes, I'm using the correct terminology, it was a cult at the beginning.

    Quote Originally Posted by shrewsbury View Post
    and you are incorrect when saying all of Christianity does, but I will give you most Christians in modern times does.
    Christians gotta clean up their outdated religion, that's not too much to ask for.

    Quote Originally Posted by shrewsbury View Post
    don't need an updated version, because it just will repeat again. Christians need to be concerned about what Jesus taught, the meaning of His message, not what people are telling us the message was or could have been.
    Ok fine.....then like I said, if the christian religion takes ALL the evil stuff out, then I'll change my views.

    Until then, the majority of christians are following an evil book filled with hateful things against those they don't understand and view as "sinners".

    Quote Originally Posted by shrewsbury View Post
    The Bible, like any tool, can be used for good or bad, it just depends on who is using it and their skill.
    And many christians use it as a shield to cover up their real bigotry against gays.

    Others use it to condemn those they disagree with and tell them they are going to hell....in fact a lot of them do this.

    And only a very small minority actually live a life where they don't judge others, don't call others sinners for not believing what they don't believe, don't try to impose their beliefs down everyone's throats and simply want to live peaceful with the rest of humanity while respecting their differences.
    "Islam is the mother load of bad ideas" -Sam Harris

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  3. #53
    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Cards View Post
    I'm not sure I follow. Are you saying that women's lib is all a farce and women weren't looked at as less then men and didn't have fewer rights?

    Nope Im just saying I think its tied together and that is by "design". Just look up who funded the womens lib movement. Combine that with birth right limitations in China. Millions of men in China feel forced to turn to other men for companionship. Combine that with the fact that EVERY woman in westernized civilization is encouraged to play the victimization card constantly forcing divorce rates up. Don't tell me this doesn't lead men into homosexuality because Im pretty sure it does. Now just put 2+2 together and throw in a disease that is fatal such as HIV/AIDS that predominately attacks gay men and what do you have?

    Dont get me wrong I am not attacking J Collins, in fact I commend him for coming out. I believe in this day and age people should NOT stay in the closet because it to dangerous because of bi sexuality and the increased risk this can cause by causing STDs to spread to other social demographics.

  4. #54
    Quote Originally Posted by Wickabee View Post
    Alex: Would you have more respect for Christians if they suddenly pulled a 180 on their beliefs about homosexuality?
    You know what really, honestly doesn't make sense to me?

    If the majority of christians.....Protestant christians.....really believe that the old laws do not apply anymore, why don't they make that clear?

    Why don't they say, hey listen, all that stuff in Leviticus and the OT is outdated and we don't believe it, we should take it out because SOME christians will be confused and believe that those laws still apply.

    As for the NT, there are some things we agree with and some we don't.

    Love your neighbor even your enemy, treat others as you would want to be treated.....this does NOT mean you accuse others of being sinners just because they live differently than you, that is NOT your job as a christian.

    Your job is to love, understand, and sure go ahead and pray for those that don't have Jesus in their hearts.

    But in the mean time, live your life as Jesus would have wanted, love your family, help the poor, needy, sick, desperate, do not look down on others.

    Wow....it would be very hard to say anything bad about that type of religion.

    A religion whose only goal is to promote love and help others, not to judge, not to point fingers, not to impose it's beliefs on the masses.

    But that's not what we see.

    The #1 reason why gays are still not allowed to marry in the U.S is because of Christianity, that is a stone cold fact.

    The #1 reason why science is under attack in schools is because of Christian beliefs that contradict the core of Biology and Cosmology.

    ^These things matter, a whole group of people are treated differently, and our understanding of our world in the only way we can understand it (naturally) is under attack.

    No way in hell can I stay quiet while I see that.
    "Islam is the mother load of bad ideas" -Sam Harris

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  5. #55
    Quote Originally Posted by JustAlex View Post
    You know what really, honestly doesn't make sense to me?

    If the majority of christians.....Protestant christians.....really believe that the old laws do not apply anymore, why don't they make that clear?

    Why don't they say, hey listen, all that stuff in Leviticus and the OT is outdated and we don't believe it, we should take it out because SOME christians will be confused and believe that those laws still apply.

    As for the NT, there are some things we agree with and some we don't.

    Love your neighbor even your enemy, treat others as you would want to be treated.....this does NOT mean you accuse others of being sinners just because they live differently than you, that is NOT your job as a christian.

    Your job is to love, understand, and sure go ahead and pray for those that don't have Jesus in their hearts.

    But in the mean time, live your life as Jesus would have wanted, love your family, help the poor, needy, sick, desperate, do not look down on others.

    Wow....it would be very hard to say anything bad about that type of religion.

    A religion whose only goal is to promote love and help others, not to judge, not to point fingers, not to impose it's beliefs on the masses.

    But that's not what we see.

    The #1 reason why gays are still not allowed to marry in the U.S is because of Christianity, that is a stone cold fact.

    The #1 reason why science is under attack in schools is because of Christian beliefs that contradict the core of Biology and Cosmology.

    ^These things matter, a whole group of people are treated differently, and our understanding of our world in the only way we can understand it (naturally) is under attack.

    No way in hell can I stay quiet while I see that
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  6. #56


    Wickabee's Avatar

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    Hey, I'm not saying I agree with what he said. I just don't agree with you either.
    You're using one man's comments about his beliefs and placing it on all Christians...again.
    It was stupid to say out loud, but only because of his profession. If that's what he believes then why should he claim otherwise? Sqying that he's going to hell could have been one of two things:
    1 - a damnation
    2 - a prediction
    Honestly, it was probably a little of both, which does leave him in the wrong, but since you only go by constitution, law and reason, and he broke no law, nor made any unreasonable act, you shouldn't care. Yet you judge him.
    You're as bad as he is on this. He did nothing illegal, he infringed on no one's rights and he didn't physically hurt a soul. So why are you ragging on him. He simply spoke his mind, nothing more. I thought you thought that was a good thing to do.

    I guess that's only if you agree with what's said.
    Patiently waiting for someone to bring back sax solos and keytars non ironically.

  7. #57
    Quote Originally Posted by indexed View Post
    Nope Im just saying I think its tied together and that is by "design". Just look up who funded the womens lib movement. Combine that with birth right limitations in China. Millions of men in China feel forced to turn to other men for companionship. Combine that with the fact that EVERY woman in westernized civilization is encouraged to play the victimization card constantly forcing divorce rates up. Don't tell me this doesn't lead men into homosexuality because Im pretty sure it does. Now just put 2+2 together and throw in a disease that is fatal such as HIV/AIDS that predominately attacks gay men and what do you have?

    Dont get me wrong I am not attacking J Collins, in fact I commend him for coming out. I believe in this day and age people should NOT stay in the closet because it to dangerous because of bi sexuality and the increased risk this can cause by causing STDs to spread to other social demographics.
    ok. now I'm really confused. Are you saying that because women are more equal to men that forces men to become homosexual? I'm of the belief that one doesn't choose to be sexually attractive to what they are attracted to so your theory of chinese birth limits, divorce rate increases, or women being more empowered increasing the numbers of gays doesn't fly with me. I know lots of people who have been divorced or had a long term relationship break up and weren't turned gay. I'm sure there are many chinese couples that have sex and are using protection. Even if someone's reproduction was limited in some fashion I fail to think that they'd stop having sex with their spouse.

    As for AIDs, I don't know the exact numbers but plenty of straight people have HIV/AIDS. I'd bet that lack of protection when AIDS first started effecting people was more of a factor than one's sexuality.
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  8. #58
    Quote Originally Posted by Star_Cards View Post
    ok. now I'm really confused. Are you saying that because women are more equal to men that forces men to become homosexual? I'm of the belief that one doesn't choose to be sexually attractive to what they are attracted to so your theory of chinese birth limits, divorce rate increases, or women being more empowered increasing the numbers of gays doesn't fly with me. I know lots of people who have been divorced or had a long term relationship break up and weren't turned gay. I'm sure there are many chinese couples that have sex and are using protection. Even if someone's reproduction was limited in some fashion I fail to think that they'd stop having sex with their spouse.

    As for AIDs, I don't know the exact numbers but plenty of straight people have HIV/AIDS. I'd bet that lack of protection when AIDS first started effecting people was more of a factor than one's sexuality.
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  9. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by Wickabee View Post
    Hey, I'm not saying I agree with what he said. I just don't agree with you either.
    You're using one man's comments about his beliefs and placing it on all Christians...again.
    His comments are a representation of MANY christians, do you deny that?

    Remember we have already discussed if there are any reasonable arguments against having gays marry in the U.S outside of religion, there are none.

    So that means that the ONLY reason why gays are not allowed to marry in the U.S is due to christianity, there is no way around that fact.
    "Islam is the mother load of bad ideas" -Sam Harris

    "Christianity is a close second" -Me

  10. #60
    Quote Originally Posted by JustAlex View Post
    You know what really, honestly doesn't make sense to me?

    If the majority of christians.....Protestant christians.....really believe that the old laws do not apply anymore, why don't they make that clear?

    Why don't they say, hey listen, all that stuff in Leviticus and the OT is outdated and we don't believe it, we should take it out because SOME christians will be confused and believe that those laws still apply.

    As for the NT, there are some things we agree with and some we don't.

    Love your neighbor even your enemy, treat others as you would want to be treated.....this does NOT mean you accuse others of being sinners just because they live differently than you, that is NOT your job as a christian.

    Your job is to love, understand, and sure go ahead and pray for those that don't have Jesus in their hearts.

    But in the mean time, live your life as Jesus would have wanted, love your family, help the poor, needy, sick, desperate, do not look down on others.

    Wow....it would be very hard to say anything bad about that type of religion.

    A religion whose only goal is to promote love and help others, not to judge, not to point fingers, not to impose it's beliefs on the masses.

    But that's not what we see.

    The #1 reason why gays are still not allowed to marry in the U.S is because of Christianity, that is a stone cold fact.

    The #1 reason why science is under attack in schools is because of Christian beliefs that contradict the core of Biology and Cosmology.

    ^These things matter, a whole group of people are treated differently, and our understanding of our world in the only way we can understand it (naturally) is under attack.

    No way in hell can I stay quiet while I see that.
    That's all you see. Because you see a loud minority. The majority of Christians I converse with and talk to are not close to what you spew about. You come across as one of the most hateful, vile, condescending people on earth. You preach treating others as you would want to be treated and loving your neighbor but I'm pretty sure if a Christian was lit on fire you would link the hose to make sure no water made it to the victim. I have a couple homosexual friends. I don't agree with it and they know I am not real comfortable in that environment but I don't hate them for it. They are free to do what they want and I am free not to feel like sugar and candy canes about the situation. You say you cannot sit around and watch a group of people treated differently. What have you done besides post on a message board to fix it. I am sure you have written congressmen and protested at rallies. Maybe marched in parades or spent personal money or the cause?
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