Pew Poll about Christmas and religion....

[duane1969]

Oh goodness....I'm not even sure how to respond.

Although, I gotta love how only conservatives got very defensive with these charts, that didn't surprise me one bit.

Duane, I never implied what you are saying....and you miss the whole point of my message:

That is correct. You didn't imply it, you outright said it. I quote "almost 70% don't actually look forward to it for it's religious connotations" That is a direct quote from your original post.

Christmas is at best a commercial secularized holiday where people like to get together and give gifts and hang out with friends and family....nothing in that is religious at all.

Again, another unfounded and incorrect generalization. Just because Christmas is secularized and commercialized does not mean that it is nothing but that.

Mostly because Jesus and December 25 have nothing to do with each other....he wasn't born on that day if in fact he ever lived.

Yet another pointless statement. Virtually every Christian that I know does not lay claim to Dec. 25th being the exact day that Jesus was born. In contrast, I have heard Christian preachers say on many occasion that Dec. 25th is the day we celebrate the birth of Christ.

Christmas has DEEP roots in Pagan traditions....the Christians simply made a version of their own and centered it around Jesus....good for them, but what we in the U.S celebrate is nothing of the sort.....at least not everyone, and I would even go so far as to say the MAJORITY of them don't.

Now you have reached the point of not even knowing what you speak of. Christmas is not a pagan holiday. The evergreen tree was a pagan symbol of eternal life, thus the Christian religion was influenced by that idea and adopted the evergreen tree as the Christmas tree, but Christmas is not a pagan holiday. The obvious connection between a tree that symbolizes long or eternal life and a religion that promises eternal life is easy to grasp and makes it easy to see why they would have adopted the tree as a symbol in that era.

[AUTaxMan]

Duane, the whole thread is pointless. The only possible purpose of it is to flame Christians. Otherwise, it serves no point.

[JustAlex]

Alex, what is the ultimate point of your original post?

Seems like I already told you what the point is on the very first post.

#1 Not everyone in America celebrates X-mas as a religious holiday, in fact the polls show that more and more people, especially the young demographic is moving away from religious celebrations into cultural celebrations.

#2 Give you reputable stats that prove my assertion.

#3 Grant everyone on here a very Happy Holidays, Winter Solstice, or whatever else they might celebrate.

[JustAlex]

You're picking and chosing what to consider a fact.

"Christmas actually is NOT a religious holiday at all"

That is simply not true.

Actually it is.

You're correct when you bring up the fact that the Christmas Holiday (if we go back hundreds of years) is really the blending of Pagan traditions with celebrating the birth of Christ. So what? If Jesus was born on December 25th, July 17th, March 2nd, or May the 4th.... what difference does that make?

It makes all the difference in the world.

My birthday is in April....why would I then celebrate it in December, does that make sense?

Anyway - my point is this: Anyone who believes that Jesus was actually born on December 25th, they've got blinders on. They're ignoring history..... but that doesn't change that fact that the church (whatever Christian demonination you're talking about) celebrates the birth of Jesus on December 25th.

Ok, this I agree with 100%

But it doesn't change what I said.

Christmas....in the sense of the U.S government and the holiday itself, is not inherently religious.

It was never meant to be about Jesus, and while christians do celebrate it as a commemoration of his birthday, that doesn't change the fact that it is not inherently a religious holiday.

The U.S government doesn't treat it as a religious holiday, and neither do millions of Americans who don't believe in Jesus.

To us, it's a time to get together and have fun with friends and family and enjoy SECULAR things such as Santa Clause, Presents, Drinking, eating, and just having a good time......none of that is religious, not one bit.


The only thing that links X-mas to religion is the fact that the church commemorates it as the birth of Jesus....which the overwhelming majority of biblical scholars agree that December 25 is NOT his birth date.

Where exactly is the religion then?

Giving presents, Santa Clause, Eating, drinking, having fun.....those are AWESOME SECULAR Activities.....not religious in any way.

To claim it's not a relgious holiday at all, is a gross misrepresentation of the truth. Weather you care to admit it or not - there are two major holidays in the USA (and Canada) that have everything to do with Christian celebrations: Christmas, and Good Friday (okay, wrong by me.... I did just look it up, apparently Good Friday isn't a federal holiday in the USA, only in some states). It doesn't take much to point out that Santa Claus & the Easter Bunny have nothing to do with the birth or death of Jesus - to claim that either of these holidays are "not religious" in nature is simply false. The comericialization of both of them has nothing to do with the religious celebrations.... but that doesn't remove 100s of years of religion either.

Good Friday is not a federal recognized holiday at all....and furthermore, there's absolutely nothing "Good" about Good Friday.

And I just gave my reasoning as to why I believe X-mas is not a religious holiday.

People treat it as such....that's perfectly fine....but it's not.

Some people also treat Halloween as a religious thing....the Satanists for example.

But guess what?

Halloween is also NOT a religious holiday.

[JustAlex]

Now you have reached the point of not even knowing what you speak of. Christmas is not a pagan holiday. The evergreen tree was a pagan symbol of eternal life, thus the Christian religion was influenced by that idea and adopted the evergreen tree as the Christmas tree, but Christmas is not a pagan holiday. The obvious connection between a tree that symbolizes long or eternal life and a religion that promises eternal life is easy to grasp and makes it easy to see why they would have adopted the tree as a symbol in that era.

I didn't say that X-mas was a pagan holiday...

I said it's ROOTS are deep in Pagan tradition, and almost every historian knows this...

http://www.livescience.com/25779-chr...-paganism.html

^Here is a REPUTABLE website talking about the Pagan roots that X-mas has.

This isn't some big secret.

SO YES....X-Mas HAS Pagan roots, it was centered around the Winter Solstice, it had NOTHING to do with Jesus, and the way many Americans celebrate it today has nothing to do with religions.

Furthermore, the polls show that Young Americans are moving away from celebrating X-mas as a religious holiday and are moving towards a cultural holiday celebrations.

BTW Duane, do you know that the MAJORITY of the world celebrates X-mas in one way or another?

Did you know for example it is WIDELY celebrated in Japan for example?

DO you know how many christians there are in Japan?!? Virtually NONE!

So how can they celebrate X-mas?

They do so because they don't treat it as a religious holiday, to them it is a time to come together with friends and family and have fun....this is the REAL reason for the Season.

Source about X-mas and Japan: http://www.santas.net/japanesechristmas.htm

[shrewsbury]

alex, that link stinks.

It was never meant to be about Jesus, and while christians do celebrate it as a commemoration of his birthday, that doesn't change the fact that it is not inherently a religious holiday.

are you serious? Christmas, the mass of Christ was not about Jesus?

yes, it was. is the date we use now the date it was always celebrated? no. after rome made it legal to be christian and united the pagans and christians by blending holidays, the church officially made the date december 25.

you are just excited because you think this poll and others shows a trend that moves away from irrational logic to rational logic, but what you are missing is that irrational and rational are defined by the beholder and are not always what you think.

[AUTaxMan]

Seems like I already told you what the point is on the very first post.

#1 Not everyone in America celebrates X-mas as a religious holiday, in fact the polls show that more and more people, especially the young demographic is moving away from religious celebrations into cultural celebrations.

#2 Give you reputable stats that prove my assertion.

#3 Grant everyone on here a very Happy Holidays, Winter Solstice, or whatever else they might celebrate.

I didn't ask you what you posted. I asked why you posted it. Did you think it would spark some sort of enlightened discussion?

[Wickabee]

Paganism is a religion.
Christmas is based on a pagan holiday.
Christmas is a religious holiday.
NEXT!