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  1. #1
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    Chris Osgood and the Hockey Hall of Fame conundrum

    Unfortunately for Chris Osgood, his first year of Hall of Fame eligibility comes in the same season as Dominik Hasek’s.

    It’s pretty much the starkest comparison that can be drawn between two winning goalies from the same era: One was a steady success with little individual glory in the regular season, with spectacular postseason credentials in three Stanley Cup wins; and the other was a human highlight reel who captured Vezinas and Harts and, eventually in his latter years, Stanley Cups.


    https://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/puck-...160534054.html

  2. #2
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    I have been a Red Wing fan as long as I could breathe.

    Chris Osgood does not belong in the Hall of Fame. Sorry, he was a player that played his position fundamentally sound, to assist his team in winning a couple of Stanley Cups. Nothing more really.

    If Mike Vernon does not get in with a Conn Smythe, (and he should not get in), then how is Osgood going anywhere near Front and Water Streets without a ticket like the rest of us.
    Last edited by centrehice; 06-24-2014 at 02:54 PM.

  3. #3




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    I have been a Red Wing fan as long as I could breathe.

    Chris Osgood does not belong in the Hall of Fame. Sorry, he was a player that played his position fundamentally sound, to assist his team in winning a couple of Stanley Cups. Nothing more really.

    If Mike Vernon does not get in with a Conn Smythe, (and he should not get in), then how is Osgood going anywhere near Front and Water Streets without a ticket like the rest of us.


    I'd agree with you if Gerry Cheevers, Grant Fuhr, Bernie Parent, & Gump Worsley weren't all HOFers... There are lots of examples of non-flashy guys in the Hall. Osgood would be no different. He managed 400 wins and went to the playoffs with every team he played for - Detroit, NY Islanders, & St. Louis. His regular season numbers aren't that far off Patrick Roy's, 2.54-2.49 and 0.910-0.905 (Roy-Osgood), and his playoff numbers aren't either, 2.30-2.09 and 0.918-0.916.

    There are a lot of guys who a case can be made either way, but if Rob Blake is a HOF defenseman, Osgood should eventually be a HOF goalie.

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    I put no stead in Patrick Roy. He is 16th in shutouts. If he was so bloody good, then he would have performed in the regular season like Marty, Glenn Hall, Bernier, etc. .

    Bad comparison. Roy was a terrible regular season goaltender, just played so long that stats were finally in his favour, but you cannot put Osgood in the Hall unless you also put in Felix Potvin, Ron Tugnutt, Tom Barrasso, Olaf Kolzig, Mike Vernon and Arturs Irbe, none of whom belong.

    Fuhr gets into the Hall because of Gretzky, Messier, Kurri and others. The Oilers were prepared to win games 6-5, sad but true. I don't recall the Oilers winning 1-0 very often, not with Pylons like Kevin Slowe and Charlie Huddy who were unable to handle pucks, or skate backwards.
    Last edited by centrehice; 06-24-2014 at 06:58 PM.

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    I personally don't think that anyone can ever discount Osgoods career or take anything away from how truly good he was - but did he change the game, was he ever dominant, did he ever put a team on his back and lead them? I would say no, he was a member of some great teams and did his job well and that is admirable - tip of the cap to him for sure but this is not the Hall of Very Good.

    Pretty hard for me to give support to a Hall of Fame goaltender candidate who has never one a major award outside of the Jennings (which he shared with two other great goalies).

    A very good, steady goalie for a very long time - but not a Hall of Famer. I'm not a Red Wings fan but to you Winged-Wheel supporters out there - would you be happy if his number were retired or he was put in your Ring of Honor (or whatever the equivalent is)?
    I don't know the answer to that one but it would seem to me that there would be a long list of guys I would put in the rafters before him.

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    I personally don't think that anyone can ever discount Osgoods career or take anything away from how truly good he was - but did he change the game, was he ever dominant, did he ever put a team on his back and lead them? I would say no, he was a member of some great teams and did his job well and that is admirable - tip of the cap to him for sure but this is not the Hall of Very Good.

    Pretty hard for me to give support to a Hall of Fame goaltender candidate who has never one a major award outside of the Jennings (which he shared with two other great goalies).

    A very good, steady goalie for a very long time - but not a Hall of Famer. I'm not a Red Wings fan but to you Winged-Wheel supporters out there - would you be happy if his number were retired or he was put in your Ring of Honor (or whatever the equivalent is)?
    I don't know the answer to that one but it would seem to me that there would be a long list of guys I would put in the rafters before him.

    blurb - sorry my apologies as I read this wrong.

    Only Bobby Orr has ever changed the way the game was played, not a single player before, or after.

    His number should not be retired, but he is owed a better send-off than Keith Primeau got with the Canes, all paid for by the Red Wings with their extravagant gifts.

    Primeau was the reason the Red Wings won 3 Stanley Cups, the Player that …. "Will never be traded" - They got Shanny (20 times as good) and the common Journeyman Primeau sent packing to Hartford, and the rest is history.

    Osgood cannot have his number retired, as "The Daredevil Goaltender" Roger Crozier does not have his retired and Roger won a Conn Smythe in 1966 with the Red Wings in a losing effort, when I put a brick through my Dad's TV in the loss of the Stanley Cup to the Habs.
    Last edited by centrehice; 06-24-2014 at 08:21 PM.

  7. #7




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    I put no stead in Patrick Roy. He is 16th in shutouts. If he was so bloody good, then he would have performed in the regular season like Marty, Glenn Hall, Bernier, etc. .

    Bad comparison. Roy was a terrible regular season goaltender, just played so long that stats were finally in his favour, but you cannot put Osgood in the Hall unless you also put in Felix Potvin, Ron Tugnutt, Tom Barrasso, Olaf Kolzig, Mike Vernon and Arturs Irbe, none of whom belong.

    Fuhr gets into the Hall because of Gretzky, Messier, Kurri and others. The Oilers were prepared to win games 6-5, sad but true. I don't recall the Oilers winning 1-0 very often, not with Pylons like Kevin Slowe and Charlie Huddy who were unable to handle pucks, or skate backwards.

    There's a clear bias against goaltending. You want to discount the comparison to Roy because Roy wasn't great during the regular season?!?!? Osgood's playoff numbers are still close, in fact, Osgood had 15 shutouts in 129 games which is a higher percentage of them than Roy's 23 in 249 games... Osgood also won 57% of his playoff starts which was good enough for 3 Cups and 1 game shy of a 4th. I'd never argue that Osgood was as good as Roy, but he was a heck of a lot better than Fuhr who did get in on the backs of the HOFers on the ice in front of him. That's the other knock against Osgood, 'that he was a function of the Wings system'. Like I said, if you're going to include Fuhr, why not Ozzie? Listing a bunch of other borderline goalies isn't really a reason for me... If these guys were skaters, they'd all be in.


    I personally don't think that anyone can ever discount Osgoods career or take anything away from how truly good he was - but did he change the game, was he ever dominant, did he ever put a team on his back and lead them? I would say no, he was a member of some great teams and did his job well and that is admirable - tip of the cap to him for sure but this is not the Hall of Very Good.

    Pretty hard for me to give support to a Hall of Fame goaltender candidate who has never one a major award outside of the Jennings (which he shared with two other great goalies).

    A very good, steady goalie for a very long time - but not a Hall of Famer. I'm not a Red Wings fan but to you Winged-Wheel supporters out there - would you be happy if his number were retired or he was put in your Ring of Honor (or whatever the equivalent is)?
    I don't know the answer to that one but it would seem to me that there would be a long list of guys I would put in the rafters before him.

    I don't disagree, Osgood didn't 'change the game', but how did Gerry Cheevers? Cheevers had no hardware outside of two Stanley Cups (Osgood at least managed to share a couple Jennings trophies).

    The same argument could be made for Rob Blake who just got in... how did he 'change the game'? Blake had 1 Norris trophy, 1 Stanley Cup, 1-time 1st team All-Star, and a 3-time 2nd team All-Star. Statisitcally, there are several above him offensively who haven't gotten in yet. And, if he was a 'defensive' defenseman, his career -4 (including a couple impressive minus season alongside Gretzky) says otherwise...

    I think the Hall opened it's doors to the 'Very Good' for good when Dino Ciccarelli got inducted on goals scored alone. Yes, he has 600+ career goals (17th all time) and he played during a very offense-first era. He won no hardware, no Cups, never a 1st or 2nd team All-Star, never led the league in anything (did tie for games played once), and finished 12th and 15th in Hart Trophy voting in his 6th and 2nd seasons, respectively, never mentioned for an award in the 12 seasons which followed... He defined very good, but not great and they voted him into the Hall.

    Osgood is certainly a bubble candidate, but I don't think he's as far away as some people seem to claim.

  8. #8




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    There's a clear bias against goaltending. You want to discount the comparison to Roy because Roy wasn't great during the regular season?!?!? Osgood's playoff numbers are still close, in fact, Osgood had 15 shutouts in 129 games which is a higher percentage of them than Roy's 23 in 249 games... Osgood also won 57% of his playoff starts which was good enough for 3 Cups and 1 game shy of a 4th. I'd never argue that Osgood was as good as Roy, but he was a heck of a lot better than Fuhr who did get in on the backs of the HOFers on the ice in front of him. That's the other knock against Osgood, 'that he was a function of the Wings system'. Like I said, if you're going to include Fuhr, why not Ozzie? Listing a bunch of other borderline goalies isn't really a reason for me... If these guys were skaters, they'd all be in.




    I don't disagree, Osgood didn't 'change the game', but how did Gerry Cheevers? Cheevers had no hardware outside of two Stanley Cups (Osgood at least managed to share a couple Jennings trophies).

    The same argument could be made for Rob Blake who just got in... how did he 'change the game'? Blake had 1 Norris trophy, 1 Stanley Cup, 1-time 1st team All-Star, and a 3-time 2nd team All-Star. Statisitcally, there are several above him offensively who haven't gotten in yet. And, if he was a 'defensive' defenseman, his career -4 (including a couple impressive minus season alongside Gretzky) says otherwise...

    I think the Hall opened it's doors to the 'Very Good' for good when Dino Ciccarelli got inducted on goals scored alone. Yes, he has 600+ career goals (17th all time) and he played during a very offense-first era. He won no hardware, no Cups, never a 1st or 2nd team All-Star, never led the league in anything (did tie for games played once), and finished 12th and 15th in Hart Trophy voting in his 6th and 2nd seasons, respectively, never mentioned for an award in the 12 seasons which followed... He defined very good, but not great and they voted him into the Hall.

    Osgood is certainly a bubble candidate, but I don't think he's as far away as some people seem to claim.

    I'll agree with everything you said here. With the exception of bubble candidate, unless you mean it is going to take him potentially a few seasons to get in. Osgood will be in the Hall, it is a matter of time. So will Lindros, and so will others who haven't made it in on their first, second or even third ballots.

    Mark Howe is in the Hall and deserves to be it only took him 11 years after he was eligible to get elected...

  9. #9
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    There's a clear bias against goaltending. You want to discount the comparison to Roy because Roy wasn't great during the regular season?!?!? Osgood's playoff numbers are still close, in fact, Osgood had 15 shutouts in 129 games which is a higher percentage of them than Roy's 23 in 249 games... Osgood also won 57% of his playoff starts which was good enough for 3 Cups and 1 game shy of a 4th. I'd never argue that Osgood was as good as Roy, but he was a heck of a lot better than Fuhr who did get in on the backs of the HOFers on the ice in front of him. That's the other knock against Osgood, 'that he was a function of the Wings system'. Like I said, if you're going to include Fuhr, why not Ozzie? Listing a bunch of other borderline goalies isn't really a reason for me... If these guys were skaters, they'd all be in.




    I don't disagree, Osgood didn't 'change the game', but how did Gerry Cheevers? Cheevers had no hardware outside of two Stanley Cups (Osgood at least managed to share a couple Jennings trophies).

    The same argument could be made for Rob Blake who just got in... how did he 'change the game'? Blake had 1 Norris trophy, 1 Stanley Cup, 1-time 1st team All-Star, and a 3-time 2nd team All-Star. Statisitcally, there are several above him offensively who haven't gotten in yet. And, if he was a 'defensive' defenseman, his career -4 (including a couple impressive minus season alongside Gretzky) says otherwise...

    I think the Hall opened it's doors to the 'Very Good' for good when Dino Ciccarelli got inducted on goals scored alone. Yes, he has 600+ career goals (17th all time) and he played during a very offense-first era. He won no hardware, no Cups, never a 1st or 2nd team All-Star, never led the league in anything (did tie for games played once), and finished 12th and 15th in Hart Trophy voting in his 6th and 2nd seasons, respectively, never mentioned for an award in the 12 seasons which followed... He defined very good, but not great and they voted him into the Hall.

    Osgood is certainly a bubble candidate, but I don't think he's as far away as some people seem to claim.


    Dino toiled and earned every of of his 1,200 Points and his 608 Goals. Lol. I suppose you are a Cam Neely lover, who really didn't do a damn thing.

    Dino - "The Very Good" - That's some 1st class nonsense. Do you live 20 miles from Sarnia and perhaps just hate the place?

    Cam Neely won nothing, he didn't score 400 goals and he didn't get anywhere near 1,000 points. Please try not to confuse the Hall of Fame with the Hall of Bruin Popularity.
    Last edited by centrehice; 06-25-2014 at 06:27 PM.

  10. #10




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    The Hall of Fame is definitely toughest on goalies. One day I was wondering why Mike Richter wasn't in the Hall of Fame. I got 300 wins (which if you are a baseball pitcher is a surefire way to get in to the HOF) and he won the Cup. Then I started looking at the other goalies who were not in and stopped wondering about Richter. If Tom Barasso with 2 Cups, a Calder trophy and 60 more wins is not in Richter should not be in. As for Osgood, one could argue that 400 wins should get him in. In baseball, it seems like longevity and achieving career milestones are enough to get in, but in hockey, this doesn't always seem to be the case, as players like Bure and Forsberg who were often injured can still make it to the Hall of Fame. Osgood is a boring candidate in the sense that at no point in his career was he the best, most exciting goalie, in the league. I think based on stats he should get in, but he probably won't, at least not for a while, because he was not exciting or elite, just consistent for a long time.

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