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GroundSupport
08-21-2014, 05:53 PM
http://theconcourse.deadspin.com/a-bunch-of-terrible-people-have-raised-over-130-000-fo-1625106827/+Tom_Ley

Steven Rose loves Jesus and pepperoni pizza.

But when the Searcy, Arkansas restaurateur decided to mix church and cheese it gave a group of out-of-town atheists a bad case of indigestion.

The Freedom From Religion Foundation (FFRF) is threatening to sue Steven after he offered a discount to customers who bring in a church bulletin. They said Bailey’s Pizza is violating the Civil Rights Act of 1964.

Steven is still contemplating what to do next. He fears a legal battle would be costly – and he’s quick to point out -- he’s no Papa John’s.“The law requires places of public accommodation to offer their services to customers without regard to race, color, religion or national origin,” FFRF spokesperson Elizabeth Cavell told television station KTHV.

Steven, who opened the pizza parlor in July, told me there’s nothing nefarious about the church bulletin discount.

“It was a straight-up marketing tool to give a discount to people I love and care about – and have them come in and have lunch with me,” he said. “I thought it was a sweet idea. I didn’t say you had to go to church to get it. Go get a bulletin from your neighbor and come in and have a pizza.”

CLICK HERE TO JOIN TODD ON FACEBOOK FOR CONSERVATIVE CONVERSATION! (https://www.facebook.com/ToddStarnesFNC)

The trouble started a few weeks ago when someone posted a Facebook photo of the sign promoting the discount.

“It was from a guy whose Facebook name is Bong Hits for Jesus,” Steven told me. “It said, ‘good luck with the discrimination lawsuit.’”
Steven said he didn’t consider the post to be a credible threat -- seeing how the Facebook user’s name is “Bong Hits for Jesus.”

Two weeks later, he received the letter from the Wisconsin-based atheist group. They said that if he did not stop offering a church discount, they would “take appropriate steps.”

“I’m just selling pizzas,” Steven told me. “I love my Lord and you see it expressed all over my building – but I’m just selling pizzas.”
And he’s not kidding. The local television station reports that customers are allowed to write Bible verses on the walls. And in the center is a message from the owners “God is the center of our lives, so our scripture wall is the center of Bailey’s Pizza.”

“To me, if making a pepperoni pizza furthers the Kingdom – well I’m excited about that,” he said.

But just because Steven is a Christian business owner doesn’t mean he has a problem with non-believers.

“They’re coming at us and saying we’re discriminating,” he said. “I don’t hate anybody.”

The FFRF has a history of targeting and bullying Christian business owners. Earlier this month, a North Carolina diner dropped a discount for customers who prayed before their meal.

“We are no longer issuing the 15% praying in public discount,” read a sign posted at the Mary’s Gourmet Diner. “It is illegal and we are being threatened by lawsuit. We apologize to our community for any offense this discount has incurred.”
Why must atheist groups like FFRF be so ill-tempered?

So is it really unconstitutional for restaurants to provide religious-themed discounts? Not at all, says Hiram Sasser, director of litigation for Liberty Institute.

“In fact, if what FFRF is saying were true, restaurants and other businesses would be precluded from giving veterans and military members discounts because that would technically be discriminating based on veteran status,” Sasser tells me. “Is that what FFRF wants? Give me a break!”

The folks at Bailey’s Pizza are still not sure why the Wisconsin atheists are targeting their restaurant.

“They may have something against my pizza,” he said.

Or maybe they’re upset because Bailey’s Pizza won’t deliver to Wisconsin. Who knows?

Whatever the reason, Steven is still contemplating what to do next. He fears a legal battle would be costly – and he’s quick to point out -- he’s no Papa John’s.

“It’s just me and my wife running this place,” he said. “I’ve got window units at my house. We’re not rich. We’re just trying to be our own bosses and be an American success story.”

Steven tells me it’s really sad that the FFRF is spending their money attack his restaurant.

“The 75 cents that somebody saves when they bring in a church bulletin – is that really what they need to be spending their money on?” he asked. “How about spending that money helping the homeless?”

For now – the church discount will remain at Bailey’s Pizza.

“As for me and my house, we’ll serve the Lord,” he told me.

And he will also keep serving their 32 varieties of pies – from Frito chili to baked potato pizza. "We pride ourselves in crazy pies,” he said. “But I’m old school. I eat the pepperoni – that’s all I need.”
You really can’t go wrong with a large pepperoni. Just be sure to hold the anchovies – and the atheists.

Todd Starnes is host of Fox News & Commentary, heard on hundreds of radio stations. Sign up for his American Dispatch newsletter (http://www.foxnews.com/newsletter-signup/todds-american-dispatch), be sure to join his Facebook (https://www.facebook.com/ToddStarnesFNC) page, and follow him on Twitter (https://twitter.com/toddstarnes). His latest book is "God Less America (http://www.amazon.com/God-Less-America-Stories-Traditional/dp/1621365913/ref=tmm_hrd_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=1402669102&sr=8-1&tag=f0c0b-20)."

gsj68
08-21-2014, 06:17 PM
#eatapieforjesus

can someone tweet this to the guy in the hope it goes over their head

seriously i could care less,im a free market guy,if you want to put whites only above your door have at it,let see how long the business last

GroundSupport
08-21-2014, 07:25 PM
#eatapieforjesus

can someone tweet this to the guy in the hope it goes over their head

seriously i could care less,im a free market guy,if you want to put whites only above your door have at it,let see how long the business last

Sounds like he is doing pretty good to me.

Wickabee
08-21-2014, 09:01 PM
Ever notice the ones who discriminate are generally Christian?

Brother love for all my left foot.

shrewsbury
08-21-2014, 10:05 PM
how did he discriminate? anyone can get a church bulletin for free, in fact I get a few in the mail from churches I don't even attend.
did he say you had to be religious? what about the church of the FSM? or church of satan?

next we should sue insurance companies for giving a good student discount and business' for providing expecting mother parking spaces.

Wickabee
08-21-2014, 10:12 PM
how did he discriminate? anyone can get a church bulletin for free, in fact I get a few in the mail from churches I don't even attend.
did he say you had to be religious? what about the church of the FSM? or church of satan?

next we should sue insurance companies for giving a good student discount and business' for providing expecting mother parking spaces.
Any church? Like Muslim or Flying Spaghetti Monster? How about synagogue publications?

I thought it was just religious bigotry, but now it sounds like a shady way to get more readers. Do they sell advertising in there?

shrewsbury
08-21-2014, 11:25 PM
I said FSM and sure I bet they would even take a Buddhist ones or anything else. No one has tried and complain about something they don't even know if it is true or not.
The only bigotry is people saying he is a bigot because he is Christian.

Wickabee
08-22-2014, 12:10 AM
You realize it's also a surcharge for not bringing one in, right? <br />
<br />
So anyone who wants nothing to do with religion (say, me) pays extra, but it's not discrimination? <br />
<br />
Again, is there advertising...

gsj68
08-22-2014, 01:05 AM
what about promotional things?
show up with this teams jersey $1.00 off
show a ticket stub $1.00 off
mention this $1.00 off

Wickabee
08-22-2014, 01:46 AM
what about promotional things?
show up with this teams jersey $1.00 off
show a ticket stub $1.00 off
mention this $1.00 off

Those businesses generally sponsor the team or event in question. Is the church sponsoring this pizzaria?

JustAlex
08-22-2014, 02:07 AM
what about promotional things?
show up with this teams jersey $1.00 off
show a ticket stub $1.00 off
mention this $1.00 off
Do you really need to be explained why those things are drastically different than a Church bulletin?

There's no need for I as an atheist to comment further in this story, since it's pretty self explanatory what is wrong here.

TheKingRoyal
08-22-2014, 06:00 AM
Do you really need to be explained why those things are drastically different than a Church bulletin?

There's no need for I as an atheist to comment further in this story, since it's pretty self explanatory what is wrong here.

As an atheist and a law student I do know who is right here, the Atheist's aren't it.

Simply put, the way he is presenting the "any church flyer" discount, it would qualify as a coupon or a discount program which you are free to engage in or not. It runs along the same lines as having a Grocery Store reward card, the business owner is absolutely protected in this situation. Also the group would have no justifiable legal complaint since they are not a local group which is being effected by this business and their practices. The final issue the plaintiffs have to overcome is the decor of the restaurant, they have to prove that they would normally eat here. As an atheist I avoid places which is extravagantly decorated in religious symbols, scripture, or other religious idols which it sounds like this place does have on display.

It sounds like this group, which is involved, are trying to use bullying tactics to further their own agenda. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth with how they are going about their business. I will say this, I support what the business owner is doing with his business, the religious scripture on the walls the coupon program,because it is his restaurant but I would not eat there as I would feel uncomfortable and don't like the theme of his restaurant. The real way this group should voice their displeasure is by simply avoiding the business. They are letting their feelings guide them as opposed to the law.

TheKingRoyal
08-22-2014, 06:02 AM
As a last thought, all they did was make this business more popular and gave it some advertising...typical irony for these types of situations.

JustAlex
08-22-2014, 06:32 AM
Simply put, the way he is presenting the "any church flyer" discount, it would qualify as a coupon or a discount program which you are free to engage in or not.
No where did I read ANY Church flyer.....more than likely a specific CHRISTIAN church and that's it.

But EVEN if they did say ANY church flyer.....atheists and non-religious people don't go to church and thus the problem is still evident.

FFRF is a very respected organization and they don't challenge just anything, if they feel they have a good chance to win, they will challenge.


It sounds like this group, which is involved, are trying to use bullying tactics to further their own agenda. It leaves a bad taste in my mouth with how they are going about their business. I will say this, I support what the business owner is doing with his business, the religious scripture on the walls the coupon program,because it is his restaurant but I would not eat there as I would feel uncomfortable and don't like the theme of his restaurant. The real way this group should voice their displeasure is by simply avoiding the business. They are letting their feelings guide them as opposed to the law.
The FFRF may not always do things I like, but I agree with their actions about 95% of the time or so...

I agree with them on this too.

You can't give preferrential treatment to one group of people (Christians) while ignoring other groups (non-Christians).

A coupon is supposed to be valid for anyone.


Although....to be perfectly fair, this is small peanuts....the FFRF has done a lot more on the national level making sure that the Separation of Church and State is being followed by the people who are supposed to follow it.

And for that I am a huge supporter of the FFRF.

TheKingRoyal
08-22-2014, 08:31 AM
“The 75 cents that somebody saves when they bring in a church bulletin – is that really what they need to be spending their money on?” he asked. “How about spending that money helping the homeless?”

I am only talking about what was in the story. In the above quote from the OP story it says "bring In a church bulletin" and in an article I read else where they said any church flyer, and didn't specify if it was from a particular church, or sect, or other denomination. None of the article about this story have showed evidence that they only accepted a single churchs flyer. Even if they did anyone can obtain a church flyer by simply walking in and retrieving one. I am sure you wouldn't even need to see a clergyman to obtain one. All churchs have I stepped foot in has flyers and bulletins just sitting in the entry for anyone to grab. With the facts presented I merely was letting people know how the law would be reflected on this case.

Since they are not refusing service, nor up charging, or doing anything else other than what equates to a coupon they are perfectly within their legal rights to run a coupon campaign how they see fit. This coupon is valid to everyone, it just isn't the typical mailer type of coupon. The businesses patrons know how to obtain said coupon, and future patrons also know how to obtain the coupon. It is not as if a Muslim walking into this restaurant or an Atheist is being turned away for their beliefs, or that even belief is needed to redeem said coupon.

As an atheist and future lawyer this is an insult what the FFRF is doing. It makes us (atheists) appear to be hyper-sensitive, petty, and ignorant.

I believe heavily in the separation of church and state. I believe that we are a Democratic Theocracy, with people using the Bible as a shield and a sword to get what they want or to push for an ideology that doesn't reflect what a lot of people believe as opposed to an actual religious leader being the "president".

The problem here is that the way the law sees it, the FFRF is out of line here. It doesn't matter how we feel about it, which I have said I would avoid this business, but what the law says and it is firmly behind the business owner. There are more pressing matters at hand these days and how a business runs it's coupon shouldn't be near the top of the FFRF things to do list.

shrewsbury
08-22-2014, 09:26 AM
Did anyone ever ask for the discount without bringing in the flier? did anyone go to him and say, hey I am not religious but would like the whopping 75 cents off? I bet not and I would even go further to say, if they did, I bet he would give it. do we have any reports of people who actually live and work in the area being discriminated against?
should we get rid of neighbor watches since it obviously discriminates against the other neighborhoods they are not watching?
the only bigots and discrimination going on is by the people saying this is discrimination.

thekingroyal, why would you not eat at someplace because of the decor? If you don't believe why would it bother you? that is your choice, but for me, it is strange. You seem intelligent, so why would stuff like that bother you? do you think they would try to convert you?

TheKingRoyal
08-22-2014, 10:04 AM
No, not worried about trying to be converted, it is just a comfort thing. I don't go to Dodgers games because I am not comfortable there, so I don't eat or go to other places that aggravate or make me feel uncomfortable. It is truly that simple for me.

If you want to know why it makes me feel uncomfortable that is a different question entirely. I just don't like things being "thrown" in my face which I don't agree with. I am a live and let live individual and prefer the company of the blue collar beer crowd. A place with Bible Scripture on the walls doesn't entice me but if people like that, then they should by all means have their place.

The best way to equate it, if you are a Boston Redsox fan, why go to a New York Yankee Pub and make yourself upset intentionally. So since I am a "Redsox fan", I won't eat at this "Yankees Pub".

GroundSupport
08-22-2014, 10:11 AM
Did this man offer this discount for A. To hook up fellow people who share the belief in God? or B. To throw it Atheists Faces and start termoil?

Pretty easy to see what he the man was trying to do. Just some people will cry foul over the smallest of infractions.

shrewsbury
08-22-2014, 10:26 AM
Thekingroyal, fair answer and to each their own. I would have no problem eating at a yankees pub if I were I redsox fan, I enjoy anyone who enjoys what they are doing and it is not hurting others.

Star_Cards
08-22-2014, 11:43 AM
I don't really see this any differently than bringing in a game ticket stub or any other sort of coupon. In my opinion the owner might just be trying to get the pub and support from religious people somewhat like Chick Fillet gets with their public stance of certain religious aspects or by just making their religious beliefs public. Personally, if it were my business I wouldn't want the divisiveness surrounding my business to make known my personal religious or political beliefs. I don't see it as a good business model to turn people off to my product by bringing up politics or religion. I'd just go out of my way to separate my opinions from my business for the most part.

Question: what exactly is a church bulletin? is that a reading or pamphlet they give out at mass?

Wickabee
08-22-2014, 12:08 PM
So the church sponsors the pizzaria then?

gsj68
08-22-2014, 02:33 PM
Thekingroyal, fair answer and to each their own. I would have no problem eating at a yankees pub if I were I redsox fan, I enjoy anyone who enjoys what they are doing and it is not hurting others.
but if the guy with the yankee hat got $1.00 off and you didnt wouldnt that be pretty much the same favoritism

and what of kosher deli's,restaurants and foods,kosher is a religious term

Wickabee
08-22-2014, 02:49 PM
but if the guy with the yankee hat got $1.00 off and you didnt wouldnt that be pretty much the same favoritism

and what of kosher deli's,restaurants and foods,kosher is a religious term

It is, but it's also a food term, so it's not the same. For example, I prefer kosher pickles to all others, and I don't exclusively, or even normally, eat kosher food. It's not just religious, it's a manner of preparation too, so it's not really the same.

shrewsbury
08-22-2014, 03:11 PM
no more than a circumcision is. <br />
<br />
<br />
<br />
if that was the rule then so be it, yankee fans get a $1 off, cool. even if I didn't have any cap or jersey on, I would not care that someone else got a $1 off....

gsj68
08-22-2014, 03:13 PM
even the slightest hint of anything religion being involved with anything governed,im totally against
history has proved many time bad thing are to happen
but these atheist nit picking of almost exclusively christians is getting me po'd
i mean grow a pair and go get in to i.s.i.s.'s sss's face
pick on some dude for .75 off a pizza,lame

Wickabee
08-22-2014, 06:00 PM
Re: bolded <br />
That is equating sports fandom to religious belief. Despite the overwhelming opposition in opinion, the two are not the same. Would a die hard Red Sox fan wearing a Yankees cap for $1 off...

TheKingRoyal
08-22-2014, 10:56 PM
That isn't what is going on, you are twisting this to suit your own want. Outrageous and quite frankly reckless claims and statements like this is what turns discussions into fervered arguments, and...

Wickabee
08-22-2014, 11:24 PM
That isn't what is going on, you are twisting this to suit your own want. Outrageous and quite frankly reckless claims and statements like this is what turns discussions into fervered arguments, and derail threads. After this statement I now realize I can discount pretty much anything else you may have to say on this matter.

Actually, it's the exact opposite of what is going on. As I said, look at the exact opposite and if you're against it, you're either against this, or a hypocrite.

See how context helps? Jesus.

JustAlex
08-23-2014, 12:25 AM
As an atheist and future lawyer this is an insult what the FFRF is doing. It makes us (atheists) appear to be hyper-sensitive, petty, and ignorant.
I said this is small peanuts and it is....

However FFRF thinks they can challenge and win, most of the time they challenge something they DO successfully get the person/business/organization/whatever to change their stance.

And if you're talking about being an atheist and lawyer, then you SHOULD know that the FFRF has some pretty good lawyers in their disposal and thus why they are so influential.


The problem here is that the way the law sees it, the FFRF is out of line here. It doesn't matter how we feel about it, which I have said I would avoid this business, but what the law says and it is firmly behind the business owner. There are more pressing matters at hand these days and how a business runs it's coupon shouldn't be near the top of the FFRF things to do list.
And yet they are NOT out of line.

You just don't like their approach because you see this as a "not a big deal" thing....and to be honest it isn't a big deal, but I'm sure glad that there IS a group out there that can challenge and successfully influence policy across the country to make sure that atheists are not being treated differently and that church and state really do stay separate.

BTW, you should know that, YEAH the FFRF does have MANY other things on the top of their to do list....all they did here was sent a letter, nothing else.


....................................

Let me ask you something, how do you feel about churches having pastors talking about politics and trying to persuade their congregation to vote for X candidate who supposedly shares their faith?

If you're a law guy, surely you know how egregious this is, right?

Now, which organization do you think has been at the forefront trying to pressure the IRS to take a FIRM stance against these churches and TAX them when they do this things?

That would be the FFRF.

And trust me, unlike this thread....THIS is actually something VERY big.

And as an atheist, it makes me pretty ticked off knowing that churches can get ZERO Taxes levied on them and they still violate their tax-exempt status and then those very churches then claim they are being persecuted in a country which is overflowing with people who share the very same ideals.

duane1969
08-25-2014, 11:23 AM
If that is discrimination then I have some lawsuits to file. <br />
<br />
- The local bar offers half-price drinks on ladies night for women. It is discriminatory to refuse to give me a discount on drinks...

Wickabee
08-25-2014, 11:28 AM
And we've moved backwards here.

duane1969
08-25-2014, 11:44 AM
And we've moved backwards here.

Because of me? I will admit I didn't read every post from #1 to here, mostly because a lot of what goes on here becomes mind-numbing, but simple reality is the guy isn't refusing to do business with anyone, he is simply offering a discount which is within his right.

Wickabee
08-25-2014, 11:56 AM
You brought up points that have already been covered, like ladies night, which I do find discriminatory but don't expect anyone to change soon, for example. <br />
<br />
The exact opposite is a $1 surcharge...