1960s, 70s and 80s Wrappers Wanted...Questions?

[Ukiah10]

I noticed 73Toppsman was looking for old wrappers. I thought that would be a cool thing to have to go along with completed sets. At least one from each year and sport of the sets I have. Let me know if you may have any unripped wrappers available.

QUESTIONS: Is there some kind of guide or prices on these? AND...are there any scams going on with these that people are aware of? Obviously in cards, there is trimming, coloration...I guess flattening and other tricks that I may (or may not be aware of) but wondering about these? Thanks

Pat

[73ToppsMann]

I have spare 1978 Topps and 1971 O-Pee-Chee baseball wrappers available, if you're interested.

I am attempting a run of wrappers myself ... have 1971 - 1987 Topps, as well as unopened packs from 1977 - 1987.

The only scam that I'm aware of (I was burned by it once myself, but I got my money back thanks to PayPal) is where someone takes a wrapper, sticks some commons from that year in, and sells it as unopened, usually on eBay. Or they open an unopened pack, take out any valuable cards, and reseal the pack of commons. I received a pack of 1978 Topps baseball that had only exmt cards in it, with 4 Bobby Grich cards, TWO of which had gum stains on the back ... and they were in the middle of the pack!

Personally, I take my extra wrappers, put that year's cards in them, and reseal them, but the pack is only for my collection and display. I'd never sell them that way. I love unopened packs, and I'm trying to find a way to put the wrappers and unopened packs in a binder with my vintage cards. Haven't found a page yet that I can put them in comforatbly, though.

[nebboy]

I just found a 82 and 83 Donruss wrapper(s) with a bunch of older Hockey wrappers I have. Anyone for these?

[Ukiah10]

How do the scammers reseal the packs? Can you not tell if they have been resealed? What are the clues aside from the idiot move your guy did?

[73ToppsMann]

Sometimes you can tell .... sometimes the pack will only be lightly sealed, and it comes apart way too easily. Also if the pack is loosly wrapped. Topps packs are almost always wrapped tightly (with some exceptions). As for re-sealing the packs, I use a glue stick, and a lot of pressure.

Personally, for the packs that I 're-pack' with cards, I follow these strict rules;
1. The pack is for my personal use only; NO RESALE. I never vary from this. Ever. Besides from being dishonest, I remember too well what my experience with the 1978 cards, and I wouldn't want to do that to anyone else.
2. I put in a stick of gum that I've saved from packs I've opened. If there was an insert that was supposed to be in the pack, I get one from a store or from eBay, and put it in the pack as well. I did this yesteday with a pack of 1971 Topps - I bought some coins, and put one in. Now I need to find one of the booklets that the 1971 O-Pee-Chee pack says was included .... I can't find them anywhere!!!
3. I ALWAYS find out the series of the pack (if it's 1973 or before), and put the best quality cards from that series I can find. This is for my own peace of mind. That way, I know that although it isn't an original pack, it has the best quality that would probably be in the pack if it was original. I just won a 1962 Topps wrapper ... that one will be hard to fill!

The biggest clues I've found are:
1. More than one card has a gum stain (front or back). Only the card next to the gum should have a stain. The only exception to this I've seen is the 1960's christmas rack packs. They were originally wax packs that were purchased by an outside vendor, put into rack packs (usually damaged in the process), and NO gum was put in with them. So it's possible to have 1 or more gum stain(s) on the cards in the rack pack, without there being any gum!
2. A 'fresh' pack having exmt or worse cards - especially ones in the middle of the pack that have dents, scrapes, or scars that could only come from being outside the pack.
3. Multiples of the same card - this can happen in some bona-fide packs, but is relatively rare outside of several years that were notorious for multiples (1987 is one such year). Finding four or more of the same card is very unusual. This will likely mean that someone is dumping commons into a 'unopened' pack.
4. Commons. If you buy, say, 15 packs of 1983 Topps, open them, and find ZERO semi-stars, stars, or super stars, it' pretty likey that some or all of the packs have been stuffed with commons, but not unheard of. I did buy some cards as a kid in 1979 (1979 Topps), about 30 packs, and I didn't find anyone more famous than Bert Blyleven. Not even a Dave Winfield. I felt a bit cheated, but it was just the luck of the draw.
5. Sequential cards. What are the chances of finding multiple cards sequentially? If you open a pack and find numbers 56-65 in a 10-card pack, it's probably been stuffed with commons as well.

If you want to know the name of the vendor who sold me the 'stuffed' the 1978 packs, let me know, and I'll PM it to you.

Also, if anyone else reads this, and knows other clues to look for when it comes to finding out if a pack has been re-sealed, please let me know.

[Ukiah10]

wow...thanks for a great break out

[basportscards]

The way some people open them is by steaming the pack to release the glue, so you may want to see if the back of the pack feels like it's been steamed or burned at all from heating the wax.

[Ukiah10]

jeeezis...what people will do ha?

[john1170]

Older wrappers are fun to collect and some are actually quite valuable. I like collecting sport and non sport wrappers. My favorite that I have is the 1974 Topps Deckle Edge test wrapper. Not too valuable but pretty cool looking.

As far as avoiding the scammers out there, never buy unopened vintage packs off ebay if they are not graded by PSA or in the old GAI slabs. If you want to buy stuff you know is legit, bbcexchange is the best in the business.

If you see people buying wrappers and nr mint to mint commons from the same year in quantity on ebay that is a red flag that they are going to start producing their own packs. these same people will also buy cheap non sport boxes from that same year so they get the right size gum for the resealed sports packs.

[73ToppsMann]

Too true .... Plus, if you buy a pack from, say, 1987, sometimes the gum is the same size as an earlier pack, like 1976. You can buy a box of 1987 on eBay cheap ($10-15 total), and if you have a bunch of 1976, 1978, etc wrappers, then you can take the 1987 cards (borderline worthless) out of the packs, put some 1978 commons into the 1978 pack, and pop it on eBay. They're going for about $7.50 and up each, usually selling for around $15.00.

This is why I gave up on collecting vintage unopened packs .... at least if I buy a genuine wrapper myself, put some high quality cards in it (with gum and the inserts!), I know it's as authentic as can be without actually being unopened. The point for me is not that it's unopened, and I have the 'what's in there?' feeling, but that it reminds me of an unopened pack from my childhood. . . . . and I don't have the temptation to open it and find out! For some people, this is the fun of having an unopened pack. For me, I just want to have the reminder. Right now, I'm trying to live the impossible dream - I have an old 1973 wax pack box, and I'm trying to refill the box! Anyone want to cash in a bond or sell their car to help me buy enough wrappers?? ; ) So far, I have two packs, so it's slow going. I'd love to have a box of '73 sitting on my desk, but at least I can dream ....

One other way to spot a re-sealed pack is that it's virtually impossible to re-seal it like a machine would have sealed it. The pack tends to be a little loose, no matter how hard you try. The machine will seal the cards tight, although there are exceptions - maybe the machine had problems for a day or two, as I remember buying a 1983 Topps pack in 1983, (I watched the store owner open the case) and it looked like the machine operator was drunk that day. Some packs were loose, others were mis-wrapped.