The bible - fact or fiction???

[habsheaven]

All right, I caught up on the other replies since I got back on the forum tonight. I see the property verse reference is the OT, which doesn't surprise me; I don't believe there are any in the NT. Christians aren't bound to the myriad of OT laws, and that's been expressed many times. As for the head of the household/ruling stuff, like many things in the Bible, it is symbolic no matter how much both some non-believers and believers want to make it literal. The marriage is compared to the relationship Christ had to the church in the NT - it doesn't mean the man can go around beating up his wife or any such nonsense like that just because he rules the household. If that were so, why are there verses where Paul and Peter talk about wives and non-believing husbands? I mean, c'mon, if the husbands were to rule with an abusive iron fist like some people would want you to believe, then why are wives allowed to have non-believing husbands? In that strict kind of mentality, the husband would be allowed to beat his wife into non-believing submission, right? Well, obviously that's not the case - read 1 Peter 3 and 1 Corinthians 7. Those verses are good for Christians as well because many people take Paul's "unequally yoked" verse out of context too and think that verse means believers should never marry non-believers when the Bible clearly has examples of such marriages.

sanfran22 - Yep, exactly. The Word of God covers a long span of time even when some of the laws way back when became mandatory no longer.

Can I get a one-word answer? Is the Old Testament the "word of God"?

[PDawson21]

Yes, but it is the Old Covenant. We are under the New Coveant.

[WilyWestbrook0]

Yes, and I already answered it such: "The Word of God covers a long span of time even when some of the laws way back when became mandatory no longer." It's not one word, but I don't need to submit to your desires for such because my answer is the same.

[tutall]

A couple posts I would like to address

I honestly don't have issue with anyone thinking they were created by a god. I just don't want to be legislated by rules of a religion.

You have mentioned this a few times but what exactly are you talking about? I mean... Anything you could put into that catergory I am positive there are non-believers who feel the same way... Just so happens it is a part of christianity... I am a believer and I would have a problem declaring an official religion of a state, or declaring believing a certain way legal/illegal, but most things I see related to this would be issues such as abortion and gay rights, both of which there are many people who have nothing to do with religion against both of them....

How about right here?

Exodus 20:17 lists the last of the Ten Commandments: "Thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's house, thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his ™™™, nor any thing that is thy neighbour's."

Sure looks like a piece of property to me.

Give me a break man.... How many times is the womans husband mentioned... it is saying to not covet someone elses spouse in general... but you can believe what you want to about it.

What blows my mind is whenever a believer is talking it is always pushed aside simply because there is no proof yet in the 1600's the earth. according to Science, was flat... It is really not a good argument either way as we are very very far from knowing how the earth was created... Believe it or not I am much in line with what Habs has been saying... I am a very logical thinker and it is tough to wrap my mind around what the bible teaches but I also think to just dismiss it like he does is a little short sighted...

In short... Can you get a one word answer on the OT being the word of god.... Sure.. You can say whatever you want.... fact of the matter is the entire bible is a collection of stories, facts, opinions, letters, first hand accounts, prophecies, psalms, and biographies.... They were all inspired by god, used by god to teach, and used by the prophets to show god....

[habsheaven]

Yes, and I already answered it such: "The Word of God covers a long span of time even when some of the laws way back when became mandatory no longer." It's not one word, but I don't need to submit to your desires for such because my answer is the same.

So at one time God's word condoned men owning women and men owning slaves. How could a GOD ever condone such things?

[habsheaven]

A couple posts I would like to address



You have mentioned this a few times but what exactly are you talking about? I mean... Anything you could put into that catergory I am positive there are non-believers who feel the same way... Just so happens it is a part of christianity... I am a believer and I would have a problem declaring an official religion of a state, or declaring believing a certain way legal/illegal, but most things I see related to this would be issues such as abortion and gay rights, both of which there are many people who have nothing to do with religion against both of them....




Give me a break man.... How many times is the womans husband mentioned... it is saying to not covet someone elses spouse in general... but you can believe what you want to about it.

What blows my mind is whenever a believer is talking it is always pushed aside simply because there is no proof yet in the 1600's the earth. according to Science, was flat... It is really not a good argument either way as we are very very far from knowing how the earth was created... Believe it or not I am much in line with what Habs has been saying... I am a very logical thinker and it is tough to wrap my mind around what the bible teaches but I also think to just dismiss it like he does is a little short sighted...

In short... Can you get a one word answer on the OT being the word of god.... Sure.. You can say whatever you want.... fact of the matter is the entire bible is a collection of stories, facts, opinions, letters, first hand accounts, prophecies, psalms, and biographies.... They were all inspired by god, used by god to teach, and used by the prophets to show god....

Where did you get this FACT from? You might want to look at this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myth_of_the_Flat_Earth

Why do you think I am "just dismissing it"? I am trying to understand it.

[PDawson21]

alot of people used to think the world was flat...hence so space travel or telescopes to see any different

[WilyWestbrook0]

So at one time God's word condoned men owning women and men owning slaves. How could a GOD ever condone such things?

Perhaps because people at that time would not have submitted to anything else. Perhaps Jesus had to come to mellow out a lot of people? There could be many reasons; I don't know for sure. However, I do know that people can be stubborn and demand things are stated in a certain way, like with one word or something when another type of response doesn't suit their needs even though the question was obviously answered (btw, my agnostic fiance has never demanded that I state things in one exact word or else; by a similar token, how could a woman-affirming MAN ever demand such things? I can answer in any way I like, and btw, I haven't demanded you answer in exactly one fashion or another; if you believe a response is best suited for one word or a more detailed answer, that is your choice and I'm not going to insist you "do it my way or the highway")

[habsheaven]

alot of people used to think the world was flat...hence so space travel or telescopes to see any different

Do you really think human kind had to leave the Earth or invent telescopes in order to figure this out? Nevermind. Don't answer, it's to off-topic.

[habsheaven]

Perhaps because people at that time would not have submitted to anything else. Perhaps Jesus had to come to mellow out a lot of people? There could be many reasons; I don't know for sure. However, I do know that people can be stubborn and demand things are stated in a certain way, like with one word or something when another type of response doesn't suit their needs even though the question was obviously answered (btw, my agnostic fiance has never demanded that I state things in one exact word or else; by a similar token, how could a woman-affirming MAN ever demand such things? I can answer in any way I like, and btw, I haven't demanded you answer in exactly one fashion or another; if you believe a response is best suited for one word or a more detailed answer, that is your choice and I'm not going to insist you "do it my way or the highway")

I never demanded anything, and I certainly didn't imply "OR ELSE". I asked you a simple question and your answer was anything but simple. You might want to go back and read it. (suggestion, not a demand)

You are obviously missing my point. Apparently your GOD, changes his mind based on what His imperfect creation's desire. That's a new take on it. But you are free to believe what you want. I would rather believe (if there was a God) that some of the authors of the Old Testament added their own contributions to the writing to suit their needs. Hence making some of it FICTION. Oh look, the point of the thread!!!