The bible - fact or fiction???

[mrveggieman]

To the person that asked about the murderer awhile back. If that murderer confessed his sins and accepted Jesus before he was killed, he would be in heaven regardless of his horrible life. Only God would know his heart and if he was truly sincere, but if he was he would be saved.
Reminds me of the Dahmer story. Not sure if true, or what his heart's intent was. But supposedly he accepted Christ in prison. If true, he will be standing with God in heaven with all the rest of us saved christians despite his life of wickedness......

I was the one who asked about the murderer. For the purpose of my story the killer wanted salvation and was told where he could go for salvation. The story never said what the salvation was and the killer did not know exactly what he was going for. He never accepted anything because he died before he knew. So knowing those facts would he still get into heaven?

[mrveggieman]

Can't that be said of any organization? Humans have flaws, and people keep secrets. The church is no different, but its imperfection is certainly no reason to reject it.

I'm not rejecting anything. I'm just calling for transpencery and accountability.

[sanfran22]

I was the one who asked about the murderer. For the purpose of my story the killer wanted salvation and was told where he could go for salvation. The story never said what the salvation was and the killer did not know exactly what he was going for. He never accepted anything because he died before he knew. So knowing those facts would he still get into heaven?

In your scenario, no.....

[Wudeverbro]

I was the one who asked about the murderer. For the purpose of my story the killer wanted salvation and was told where he could go for salvation. The story never said what the salvation was and the killer did not know exactly what he was going for. He never accepted anything because he died before he knew. So knowing those facts would he still get into heaven?

If he didn't accept him by the time he died, then I would say no, but it's really not up to us to really say whether he's going or not. Maybe there is a time in bt when we die and when we get judged you get to make a final plea for faith. There's nothing in the Bible that suggests that but no one truly knows. I am a steadfast believer in Christ but there's no guarantee that I get into heaven either. I know I believe in Him and will get there, but only God can judge that, and I fully entrust that to Him.

I think the hardest part of believing in God is faith. There's a lot of stuff in the Word that doesn't make sense or even seem humanly possible but it all boils down to whether you can just give your life to God. I don't think you can really force feed anyone into Christ, but can only be lead to Him by your own experiences. Christianity is not for everyone.

[mrveggieman]

If he didn't accept him by the time he died, then I would say no, but it's really not up to us to really say whether he's going or not. Maybe there is a time in bt when we die and when we get judged you get to make a final plea for faith. There's nothing in the Bible that suggests that but no one truly knows. I am a steadfast believer in Christ but there's no guarantee that I get into heaven either. I know I believe in Him and will get there, but only God can judge that, and I fully entrust that to Him.

I think the hardest part of believing in God is faith. There's a lot of stuff in the Word that doesn't make sense or even seem humanly possible but it all boils down to whether you can just give your life to God. I don't think you can really force feed anyone into Christ, but can only be lead to Him by your own experiences. Christianity is not for everyone.

Of all the responses I read from both sides of the spectrum on this topic this is in my opinion one of the best spoken.

[Star_Cards]

To the person that asked about the murderer awhile back. If that murderer confessed his sins and accepted Jesus before he was killed, he would be in heaven regardless of his horrible life. Only God would know his heart and if he was truly sincere, but if he was he would be saved.
Reminds me of the Dahmer story. Not sure if true, or what his heart's intent was. But supposedly he accepted Christ in prison. If true, he will be standing with God in heaven with all the rest of us saved christians despite his life of wickedness......

to me that makes zero sense. why would a person that does horrible things to others but then finds jesus/god/christianity deserve heaven more than a person that doesn't do those things but just doesn't believe. If I were ever going to be part of a religion that believed in a heaven/hell existence I would hope that it would be one that would accept people of other beliefs as long as they are good people. To me I'd think an individual's life actions are far more meaningful than weather or not he believes. I know a lot of people that believe in a god but are complete immoral people. I guess as long as you believe and are truly sorry after every immoral act you're good to get into heaven. Doesn't really fly with me. Most people go by actions of an individual not what he says when deciding if they want them in their life.

[Wudeverbro]

Of all the responses I read from both sides of the spectrum on this topic this is in my opinion one of the best spoken.

The thing that irks me about a lot of my Christian brothers and sisters is that many are condemning and judging people. There's a lack of humility and love on what they preach. You can speak the truth without condemning people. Is it hard to do that? Heck yea! But the qualms I have with people who stand out on the corner with a sign that says you're all going to hell are not loving Christians, and they leave a bad rap for a lot of Christians by doing that.

[sanfran22]

to me that makes zero sense. why would a person that does horrible things to others but then finds jesus/god/christianity deserve heaven more than a person that doesn't do those things but just doesn't believe. If I were ever going to be part of a religion that believed in a heaven/hell existence I would hope that it would be one that would accept people of other beliefs as long as they are good people. To me I'd think an individual's life actions are far more meaningful than weather or not he believes. I know a lot of people that believe in a god but are complete immoral people. I guess as long as you believe and are truly sorry after every immoral act you're good to get into heaven. Doesn't really fly with me. Most people go by actions of an individual not what he says when deciding if they want them in their life.

Short and sweet, First I would suggest reading the Bible. You will see what I am referring to. Secondly There is only one way to heaven and is is a free gift. Believing in God and accepting Him are two different things. It is never too late to get into heaven (until the end) but it is always too late to wait(because you don't know how much time you have). That's my quickie version, sorry it's kinda busy here.

[sanfran22]

The thing that irks me about a lot of my Christian brothers and sisters is that many are condemning and judging people. There's a lack of humility and love on what they preach. You can speak the truth without condemning people. Is it hard to do that? Heck yea! But the qualms I have with people who stand out on the corner with a sign that says you're all going to hell are not loving Christians, and they leave a bad rap for a lot of Christians by doing that.

Yes, condeming and judging is wrong. But we also have been instructed to share and alot of times it can be perceived as that....

[Wudeverbro]

to me that makes zero sense. why would a person that does horrible things to others but then finds jesus/god/christianity deserve heaven more than a person that doesn't do those things but just doesn't believe. If I were ever going to be part of a religion that believed in a heaven/hell existence I would hope that it would be one that would accept people of other beliefs as long as they are good people. To me I'd think an individual's life actions are far more meaningful than weather or not he believes. I know a lot of people that believe in a god but are complete immoral people. I guess as long as you believe and are truly sorry after every immoral act you're good to get into heaven. Doesn't really fly with me. Most people go by actions of an individual not what he says when deciding if they want them in their life.

It's probably one of the hardest things to overcome in terms of believing, justifying why a wicked, immoral person who places in faith in Jesus moments before he dies compared to a loving and just person who never professes his faith. I will say this is false though

"I guess as long as you believe and are truly sorry after every immoral act you're good to get into heaven."

Placing your faith in Christ does not allow you to blot out every sinful act you have done. Your heart must change once you profess your faith and if your faith is real, you will seek to have a life that is like Jesus. if you continue to sin and just say, "well I'll confess and I am good to go," that is unacceptable and would not be worthy of a life of Christ. God is not fine with that and is the only one who can judge the heart of each person who confesses their life to Him.