another ebay rant

[Fred Bear]

i cant believe the response i got from a buyer on ebay today.

sold him a card and charged 3.75 for shipping. now we all know that rates have gone up this year, bur he ragged on me because i found a new envelope
at a dollar store that meets both wide and size dimensions at the post office so the stamp instaed of costing me $ 2.43 (tax in) only cost $1.20. he was concerned over the 2 dollars and wrote rather arrogantly about other Canadian sellers only charging 2 dollars shipping to the states. And how he is a top seller and all that garbage about his shipping rates. seemed to me like he was angling for a reduced rate or i'd get bad ffedback.

Honestly, $2+ off is where I start to get a little upset about shipping costs. I understand what goes into shipping (and what eBay 'allows' you to charge for shipping & handling) since I also sell. But if you're netting yourself $2 or close to $2 above actual shipping costs, that's not cool. I am definitely one to complain to sellers about this, regardless of what an auction listing says or how 'aware' I might be. Sellers have lots of options to make it more palatable for a buyer, i.e. multiple lots can be shipped priority or bonuses can be included.

I recently won an auction from a Canadian seller who required $3.50 shipping. That's what I charge to ship to Canada, so I had no problem. And then I received a PWE with $1.05 in postage on it. Needless to say, I was upset. Nothing in the auction noted he'd be shipping PWE, it was for multiple cards, and his shipping fee was in line with other sellers. I contacted him and asked if he was willing to address the fact he ripped me on shipping 'costs'... [As I said, I charge $3.50 - $0.50 new bubble mailer (I never reuse for eBay sales), $0.10 top-loader/cardboard/tape/team-bag/labelling, ~$2.70 postage, and I include 2 'vintage' packs (right now 1990-91 Score) to make up for the $0.20 I 'make'. He charged $3.50 - $0.10 PWE, $0.10 top-loader/tape, $1.05 postage, and he included several older inserts (not even in soft sleeves) between the tape and top-loaders which he claimed as 'extras' in his response to my feedback.]

I'm not accusing you of anything, please don't take it that way. Sometimes, though, perspective goes a long way and if you found a way to save a couple bucks on shipping, why not share some of the savings with the buyer?

The listing says "shipping" not "postage". People who jump on others for shipping costs tend to overlook the fact that there are other costs, besides postage, that have to be taken into condiseration. Sure you hgave to pay postage, but you also pay for the envelope, the top loader, the penny sleeve, the address label (if you use them) and the tape to seal the envelope. All of that adds up. Then there is the gas you used going to the store to buy these things. And don;t forget that your time has value , too.

In the past, I thought people used to pad postage costs to boost their profit. Now that eBay charges fees on shipping I don't see it happening as much. $3.75 is a reasonable price for shipping. PLUS, the buyer knew what the cost would be when he placed his bid. Shipping costs have to factor into your decision to bid. If I want a card and see that shipping is $5 or more, I won't bid. Plain and simple. This guy needs to chill out.

It's a fine line. When you sell on eBay, you agree to follow their practices and rules whether you like or agree with them. You are allowed to charge for shipping costs, but not your time (this is, in fact, specifically called out as a no-no in eBay's policy). It's also a no-no to try and re-coup fees in your shipping costs. The 'gentleman' I dealt with in the above scenario also threw his 'time' into his shipping costs. He even replied to my neutral feedback (left after his immature replies to my email which degraded the 'experience' in my opinion) saying 'I guess my time isn't worth anything.' According to eBay's policy (regardless of my opinion), it isn't.

There are ways for sellers to make high shipping costs more reasonable if they intend to do it. I factor shipping in to the 'price' I'm willing to pay for any card. I'm currently watching a card from a Canadian seller who requires $10 shipping. He references it a second time in the listing, so I know it's not a mistake. He does not reference registered or tracked shipment, just 'any shipment'. I will either win the card for a price (plus shipping) that I'm happy with or I'll walk away, of course. But eBay's policy gives me the right to ding him badly for high shipping costs, which we would all agree that any 'simple' package from Canada to the US is going to be less than $10. He's obviously using the high shipping costs to try and make a little more when his auction doesn't go as high as he wants.

Dealt with a guy in the states last week. I used a BIN to get a redemption, where it was a low cost I said hey instead of charging me the shipping can you just send me an invoice without the shipping then email me the code? Figured I;d save myself $4. He responds with yes I can do that but you have to pay then leave me positive feedback BEFORE I'll send you the code.

I asked why I should do that, he basically said so I didn't rip him off. Ok this is when my blood started to get hot. My response was this, look I pay you, you send the code, if it works you get positive feedback, if it doesn't work, meaning you ripped me off I'll leave neg. feedback and get my $ back thru paypal.

He sends a cancel transaction request, I paid for the item with shipping out of spite at this point, he refunds my money. Calls me a scammer for trying to rip him off. Now my blood is boiling, I might be a lot of things but a thief is not one of them and I don't take being called one lightly.

So I proceeded to poke holes through his entire argument and proved he used feedback extortion in order for me to get my item. Also went thru his feedback and told him exactly why he got neg. feedback, he was doing breaks, shill bidding teams, when they sold to one of his fake accounts he'd contact the other bidders and get them to just send him $ thru paypal instead. Once they paid and he did the break if the teams that sold outside of ebay had hits he kept them as the ppl that actually paid for them actually had no record of the purchase on ebay.

After an hour or so of back and forth I decided to just drop it, this scumbag had already gotten more of my time then he deserved. My last msg to him was something along the lines of thanks for your time you've been an absolute pleasure to deal with good luck with your future endeavours. I suspect ebay will be contacting you soon regarding your use of feedback extortion.

His final response was "F**k you and F**k ebay you can both s**k a d**k fa**ot"

and this "man" owns his own business, very sad in my opinion, it turned into that over a $20 sale

Again, this is a slippery slope. Paypal does not allow for 'digital shipment', so from a seller's side of the aisle - Buyer purchases redemption code, Seller emails code at Buyer's request, Buyer redeems code, Buyer files item not received, Seller loses money and redemption code. A seller has to evaluate it from a risk-reward. I've resorted to requiring registered shipment to Canada (and the rest of the World) on all redemptions (even a $10-15 card) simply because its such an easy chargeback and/or loss, even when you do everything right as a seller. I much prefer to sell redemptions on message boards like these where there is (in a perfect world) a greater level of trust/respect.

At the same time, eBay buyers and sellers really seem to be getting much more immature in their responses to people. I've been lucky to have several very good exchanges with both groups, but lately the immediate responses are either very aggressive or very defensive.

[Wickabee]

When I sell on ebay my shipping charges are 2.99 to Canada, 4.99 to the US. Always, unless it's a huge package or something. I've never once had a complaint. Sometimes it puts me ahead, sometimes it puts me behind, but it's the same for everyone.

[slypig]

I fully understand where you;re coming from and although I have 700+ feedback buying and selling at 100% this guy doesn't know me from a hole in the ground. Fact is no matter what you sell on ebay from a $2 card to a $2000 card if there is no tracking the buyer can always claim they didn't get it, if my intentions were to rip this guy off I would've just waited to get the redemption in the mail and got a friend to redeem it then filed my paypal claim, I;m no stranger to it been ripped off my someone in Florida this way. What got me is he immediately went on the defense assuming my intentions were to rip him off, but seeing his feedback I could see why because he's a crook, the pope himself could knock on my door and tell me he's not but no one gets that many similar neg. feedback so close together without running some kind of stupid scam.

Tragically ebay is the major marketplace for our hobby as well as what sets the bar as far as sales go, it's considerably more influential than Beckett in my opinion. The problem is no matter what the system there will always be people out there ready to twist it to their benefit, honestly this forum is where I feel safest buying/trading etc because of the accountability.

As far as shipping goes I charge $3 in canada and $3.50 to the us with discounts for multiples, besides supplies and that sort of thing my time/gas/mileage to get to the post office is worth at least that and if someone is going to split dimes and nickels over shipping with me then they're not worth the trouble in my opinion, not starting a big stink over it just offering my opinion, if someone has a ridiculous shipping cost I ask them for less, but I've found in a few of my latest $100ish purchases shipping has been $5-6 and has been tracked so there's no complaining there.

Also anytime I buy something I look at what else they;re selling if they combine shipping for cheap enough and I can get some cheap tradebait to me it makes it worth the .25 extra or whatever they charge



Again, this is a slippery slope. Paypal does not allow for 'digital shipment', so from a seller's side of the aisle - Buyer purchases redemption code, Seller emails code at Buyer's request, Buyer redeems code, Buyer files item not received, Seller loses money and redemption code. A seller has to evaluate it from a risk-reward. I've resorted to requiring registered shipment to Canada (and the rest of the World) on all redemptions (even a $10-15 card) simply because its such an easy chargeback and/or loss, even when you do everything right as a seller. I much prefer to sell redemptions on message boards like these where there is (in a perfect world) a greater level of trust/respect.

At the same time, eBay buyers and sellers really seem to be getting much more immature in their responses to people. I've been lucky to have several very good exchanges with both groups, but lately the immediate responses are either very aggressive or very defensive.[/QUOTE]