A question for democrats.....

[mrveggieman]

Even your retorts are nonsensical. For example, Santorum was personally against the use of contraception (part of his Catholicism) but he did not want to ban contraception for anyone. He didn't want the government to require employers to carry insurance that covers contraception because that would be against the employers' free exercise of religion.

Another. Now republicans have to support all bills that affect women, regardless of their merit, so they won't be deemed sexist?

Another. Anti-immigrant? No. How about anti-ILLEGAL immigrant. Huge difference.

For the last time business are not people. Only a person can practice a religion.

[mrveggieman]

If I could respond to the OP question as far as my vote in 2016 it's wide open. Assuming for the sake of argument that President Obama completely screws things up and a moderate republican comes along who actually has a mind of his own and is not a tea party puppet and if the dems canidate is a piece of garbage like all the recent republican canidates the republican would get serious consideration from me. However we are speaking only in variables which have an unlikely chance of occuring.

[AUTaxMan]

For the last time business are not people. Only a person can practice a religion.

I doubt it's the last time, but businesses are people. They are independent legal entities, but that is a legal fiction. Businesses are the people who own them and run them.

Say you are a sole proprietor who employs a number of people in your business. Should the government be able to tell you that you have to pay for insurance for your employees that would cover elective abortions, if that is against your religious belief? Remember, you're just a guy who makes widgets and has hired a few people to help you. Your business is not a legal entity. It is you.

[Wickabee]

I doubt it's the last time, but businesses are people. They are independent legal entities, but that is a legal fiction. Businesses are the people who own them and run them.

Say you are a sole proprietor who employs a number of people in your business. Should the government be able to tell you that you have to pay for insurance for your employees that would cover elective abortions, if that is against your religious belief? Remember, you're just a guy who makes widgets and has hired a few people to help you. Your business is not a legal entity. It is you.

So what you're saying is business owners are actually two people...

[mrveggieman]

I doubt it's the last time, but businesses are people. They are independent legal entities, but that is a legal fiction. Businesses are also the people who own them and run them.

Say you are a sole proprietor who employs a number of people in your business. Should the government be able to tell you that you have to pay for insurance for your employees that would cover elective abortions, if that is against your religious belief? Remember, you're just a guy who makes widgets and has hired a few people to help you. Your business is not a legal entity. It is you.

Homosexuality is also against my religious views but consenting adults do have a right be gay if that is what turns them on. As far as abortion goes as long as conservatives are against sex education and contraception there will continue to be a demand for abortion. I may not believe in abortion but I cannot tell another adult what to legally do when they see their own doctor. That would be akin to me telling someone not to use the money that they made working for me to pay for an abortion. What conservatives cannot grasp is the concept that if you are against abortion you should be for what actions that would prevent uneccessary and unwanted pregnancies.

[shrewsbury]

veggie, i am with you except the part about it being against my religion

[AUTaxMan]

Homosexuality is also against my religious views but consenting adults do have a right be gay if that is what turns them on. As far as abortion goes as long as conservatives are against sex education and contraception there will continue to be a demand for abortion. I may not believe in abortion but I cannot tell another adult what to legally do when they see their own doctor. That would be akin to me telling someone not to use the money that they made working for me to pay for an abortion. What conservatives cannot grasp is the concept that if you are against abortion you should be for what actions that would prevent uneccessary and unwanted pregnancies.

You are completely missing the point of this discussion. It isn't about preventing someone from making their own healthcare choices. It is about holding a gun to a person's head and telling them that if they employ someone, they have to provide them with the means to have an abortion, regardless of what your religious stance on it is.

Also, your analogy is off. It would be akin to an employee's having an abortion, sending the bill to the employer, and making them pay it.

Not sure where homosexuality, sex education, or being against contraception became part of the discussion.

[mrveggieman]

You are completely missing the point of this discussion. It isn't about preventing someone from making their own healthcare choices. It is about holding a gun to a person's head and telling them that if they employ someone, they have to provide them with the means to have an abortion, regardless of what your religious stance on it is.

Also, your analogy is off. It would be akin to an employee's having an abortion, sending the bill to the employer, and making them pay it.

Not sure where homosexuality, sex education, or being against contraception became part of the discussion.

So what about a business owner who dosen't believe in birth control either. Using birth control prevents unwanted pregnancies that often times lead to abortions but the guy still dosen't believe in that. Are you suggesting that shop owner should be able to balk about providing insurance coverage that would cover BC?

[MadMan1978]

I doubt it's the last time, but businesses are people. They are independent legal entities, but that is a legal fiction. Businesses are the people who own them and run them.

Say you are a sole proprietor who employs a number of people in your business. Should the government be able to tell you that you have to pay for insurance for your employees that would cover elective abortions, if that is against your religious belief? Remember, you're just a guy who makes widgets and has hired a few people to help you. Your business is not a legal entity. It is you.

ABSOLUTELY!

Almost every state has workman's comp laws- You are required by law to cover your employees (I say almost because I do not know that laws of every state). Is there any difference? It is the law! this is where the Republicans do not get Separation of church and state.


and Businesses are not people! They are economic entities nothing more.

[MadMan1978]

You are completely missing the point of this discussion. It isn't about preventing someone from making their own healthcare choices. It is about holding a gun to a person's head and telling them that if they employ someone, they have to provide them with the means to have an abortion, regardless of what your religious stance on it is.

Also, your analogy is off. It would be akin to an employee's having an abortion, sending the bill to the employer, and making them pay it.

Not sure where homosexuality, sex education, or being against contraception became part of the discussion.

That is so extreme.
The same insurance will also cover vasectomies...a form of birth control...which is against some forms of religion...