Need help with Joe Frazier and Muhammad Ali Autographed 1971 Sports Illustrated...

[thedarkbrown]

Picked this up today in a collection...

It was in a frame and the back said "certification within", but once I took the back off there was no COA.

With the little research I did, they look legit, but just not sure. Any thoughts or opinions? Looks like it will cost ~$130 to get PSA/DNA authentication.



Thank you for looking.

[NY Sports Teams]

Just my .02. I don't like either one. I'll post a link for a site on Mr. Ali. This guy is the guru of Ali graphs and it's the best site I know of when it comes to Ali comparisons. Mr. Frazier's is a tougher call but I don't like the "F". With Mr. Ali's you know he supposedly signed it in 1971. He used to put the year he signed on many auto's. He did on my in-person glove but did not on my two 16x20's. Mine would be no help in comparison because mine were signed in 1996 and Mr. Ali's graph changed many times throughout the years. You may not know if Mr. Frazier signed in 1971 or 2001. My Frazier's were signed in 2011 three months before he passed so they would be no help as well but his auto did not change a great deal from year to year.

http://www.aliautos.net/examples.html

...Rick

[NY Sports Teams]

I just wanted to find an "F" that Mr. Frazier signed like that and I could not. I did find this on the PSA site which is not too much help with your questions as it does not go in depth as much as the other site for Mr. Ali and there is only one example of Mr. Frazier's but I'll still pass it along.

http://www.psaautographfacts.com/

...Rick

[thedarkbrown]

Rick, thank you so much for the info. I looked at that Ali site before posting. I still had questions because it doesn't have a 1971 example. This auto looks like a 90's or 2000's one, but says 1971. Either it's fake and they added 1971 to make it match the SI cover, it's a real 1971 auto of his, or when he signed it more recently he was requested to put 1971? The M looks shaky although I did see some other examples of a squiggly M, and the small A looks like a 90's-2000's sig.

I'm obviously no expert and don't know much about these which is why I asked. I'd hate to spend $130 to find out they are fake. They do look decent, so I just don't know.

Thanks again for your help!!

[NY Sports Teams]

Rick, thank you so much for the info. I looked at that Ali site before posting. I still had questions because it doesn't have a 1971 example. This auto looks like a 90's or 2000's one, but says 1971. Either it's fake and they added 1971 to make it match the SI cover, it's a real 1971 auto of his, or when he signed it more recently he was requested to put 1971? The M looks shaky although I did see some other examples of a squiggly M, and the small A looks like a 90's-2000's sig.

I'm obviously no expert and don't know much about these which is why I asked. I'd hate to spend $130 to find out they are fake. They do look decent, so I just don't know.

Thanks again for your help!!

You are very welcome. I've seen many of Mr. Ali's graphs but I'm not an expert as well. I was thinking the same thing. The graph looks more like a 90's version like you said. This is the graph on my glove from 96.



I don't like the "M" or the "h" at all. Normally the second "M" was more pointed on top. I'd say over 90% of the graphs I've seen that was the case and that's also true with the examples. The "h"'s that I've seen are never as good as the one on the SI. Couple those two things and that's why I came to my conclusion.

I have never sold anything on eBay but I think you can get a quick opinion by PSA/DNA for around $10.

...Rick

[thedarkbrown]

You are very welcome. I've seen many of Mr. Ali's graphs but I'm not an expert as well. I was thinking the same thing. The graph looks more like a 90's version like you said. This is the graph on my glove from 96.



I don't like the "M" or the "h" at all. Normally the second "M" was more pointed on top. I'd say over 90% of the graphs I've seen that was the case and that's also true with the examples. The "h"'s that I've seen are never as good as the one on the SI. Couple those two things and that's why I came to my conclusion.

I have never sold anything on eBay but I think you can get a quick opinion by PSA/DNA for around $10.

...Rick

I agree, the M and the H look funny. The H, however does seem pretty close to some of the mid 70's to mid 80's examples. The PSA quick opinion is exactly what I was looking for! It seems they require an auction #, so I emailed them about having it done without it being in an auction. I would never list this on eBay without being certain that it's real. If the quick opinion comes back ok then I'd spend the $130 to get the COA.

Thank you for your help!

[NY Sports Teams]

I agree, the M and the H look funny. The H, however does seem pretty close to some of the mid 70's to mid 80's examples. The PSA quick opinion is exactly what I was looking for! It seems they require an auction #, so I emailed them about having it done without it being in an auction. I would never list this on eBay without being certain that it's real. If the quick opinion comes back ok then I'd spend the $130 to get the COA.

Thank you for your help!

I've seen people list items for a crazy BIN amount of $1,000,000 just to get the quick opinion. Once they get the quick opinion they take the item down. That may be an option, it works for them. I have not heard too much about people getting a quick opinion and then sending an item in so I can't help you there.

...Rick

[thedarkbrown]

Good idea! I listed it for $50k, and paid for the quick opinion on PSA. It's only $7.49 if it's an ebay auction, vs. the normal $10. Crossing my fingers!

Thanks!
Jesse

[NY Sports Teams]

Good idea! I listed it for $50k, and paid for the quick opinion on PSA. It's only $7.49 if it's an ebay auction, vs. the normal $10. Crossing my fingers!

Thanks!
Jesse

I'd be crossing my fingers that someone wants to pay $50,000 for it. LOL Good luck.

...Rick

[thedarkbrown]

Got the PSA/DNA quick opinion back... That was quick!

Response: "Likely Not Genuine"

Bummer. Oh well.

Next up, a 1942 score card "signed" by Johnny Mize and Mel Ott. I hope those are real because if they aren't it probably ruined the score card which is in great condition. EDIT:, the score card is a reprint noticed that when I took it out of the frame. Big collection, didn't want to spend all day scrutinizing stuff. At least the autos are in pen, but iffy looking.