Canada's "Free" healthcare

[mikesilvia]

Hey, I live in Canada, I just spent 5 weeks in the hospital, had two surgeries, 6 CT Scans, 2 x-rays, a fluoroscope and was intravenous food for 3 weeks, and 3 anti-biotics for 5 weeks...

Total bill: $0.00

I don't even see a bill... it's all covered, 100%.

What is your tax rate? That is your bill!

[mtbkanata]

My tax rate is about 15% or so every year when it averages out... but I spend zero on health insurance.. so really, it's not that much at all.

I'll never spend in my lifetime on tax what that one hospital stay and all the stuff would have cost.

And like I said, if you're unemployed paying no taxes at all, you would get the same free services.

[haybierman]

if you're unemployed paying no taxes at all, you would get the same free services.

So then what is the incentive for people to seek gainful employment if they can get all the same benefits without contributing a damn cent?

[mikesilvia]

My tax rate is about 15% or so every year when it averages out... but I spend zero on health insurance.. so really, it's not that much at all.

I'll never spend in my lifetime on tax what that one hospital stay and all the stuff would have cost.

And like I said, if you're unemployed paying no taxes at all, you would get the same free services.

Here is how I see it. Canadian pay much more tax than Americans do. Even a low estimate, let's say you pay 20% more tax than an American.

Let's say an American and a Canadian both make $60,000 a year and the Canadian pays 20% more tax than the American. That is $12,000 more each year. So, after 10 years he pays $120,000 more than the American in Taxes. Now an American can get health insurance for for less than $6,000 a year or half of what the Canadian pays in tax. The American will likely get better health care and a shorter waiting period.

From what I gather Europeans and Canadian pay much more than a 20% difference in taxes than the average American. Get the reason why I'm for the American capitalistic health care?

[sealedpwr]

Mike i made $46,000 last year and paid $12,000 of that into taxes. I to have had several Surgeries on my back and many months in the Hospital. But still think it is worth it. I have heard that just having a baby in the states costs almost $20,000 (Correct me if i am wrong , just something i heard) Well with my Family that would be $60,000 just to have Children. My wife has also had Steel Rods placed in her back because she had scoliosis when she was younger. I can just imagine what something like that would Cost in the United States.

cliff

[mikesilvia]

Cliff,

I would say there are pluses and negatives to both sides. I'm just against forcing people to pay a tax when they don't want to. For instance, if a guy stayed healthy for 40 years in Canada and never used the system he would be out almost a half million dollars in taxes. Also, since it is 100% free based on tax, then there is an obvious cap. So, what happens when certain services run out half way through the year? The Canadian government obviously must budget all services since they are not generating revenue based on services. If the government budgets for 10,000 CT scans for 2008 and you are the 10,001 person needing a scan you are out of luck until next year.

Health care in American is by far the best or near the best in the world and it is affordable. There are a lot of Americans that say they can't afford $500 a month for health care insurance, but spend $700 a month eating out, $500 on their car payment and $100 on their cell phone. If you prioritize what is important most Americans can afford health care. Obviously, some people live in poverty and can't afford it and that is why we have Medicade/Medicare and other services.

[mtbkanata]

So then what is the incentive for people to seek gainful employment if they can get all the same benefits without contributing a damn cent?

Not sure I follow the logic on this one. You get health care, but you don't get a paycheque... Health care doesn't pay for groceries.

[sealedpwr]

Not sure I follow the logic on this one. You get health care, but you don't get a paycheque... Health care doesn't pay for groceries.

that's why there are so many people on Welfare, i for one am sick and tired of paying for this With my Taxes. the way i look at it is if you can walk , Talk There is some kind of Work you can do. I am all for making Welfare Recipients , having to do some kind of work to earn there free check. hell there are alot of Hospitals, Old Folks Homes that need There sidewalks shovelled in the winter and when fall hits there are alot of leaves to be raked.

Just my 2 cents .

cliff

[mikesilvia]

I did some quick research. You can see the Canadian tax rate and the American tax rate.

From what I see Canadian pay a federal tax and a provincial/territorial tax while Americans pay a federal and state tax as their major taxes. The American and Canadian federal systems are very close with Americans actually pay more tax if you earn over $160,850.

Canadians cap their federal tax at 29% if you make over $123,184 and American can pay as much as 35% if you make over $349,701.

Canadians then charge as high as 17.95 percent for provincial tax. Most American states charge about 6% state tax with a lot of states NOT having a income tax (with a sales tax instead).

Do Canadians also pay another tax for health care? I'm curious to see what the average Canadian pays in tax when he gets a pay check.

If you take a $60,000 worker in Canada he would pay roughly 26% federal tax and 16% in provincial tax totaling 42%. An American would pay about 25% federal and 0-6% state for 25% to 30% or 12-17% less tax. Again, I'm not sure what other taxes Canada has or exactly where the government gets their money to pay the health care.

Would Americans be willing to pay a 12-17% tax for free health care? For a person making $60,000 that is $7,200 to $10,200 a year. That equates to almost $1,000 a month on the high end.

[mtbkanata]

Here is what I pay exactly:

My Gross pay for 2 weeks is $2650.66

From that I pay:

Income Tax (This is Federal and Provincial Tax): 501.89
CPP (Canadian Pension): 109.33
EI (Unemployment Insurance): 42.31

That's all. There is no extra tax for health care, it all comes from what is taken off the top.

The only other taxes we pay, are the provincial sales tax (if that province has one), and the GST, which is the goods and services tax. So if you live in Alberta, you pay 5% on everything you buy, if you live in Ontario, you pay 13%.