The Official Fake Patch Thread

[Craig2]

With the one on the first page that has a different serial # really makes me wonder how you are seeing this. The cup will put out different versions of the rookie cards but most different variations are either signed with no GU, signed and GU, or just plain. Are you saying their cutting exact slots in these cards to put in a GU piece? I also find it a little hard to think that someone would take out a patch and flip it upside down, ti would give it no more value as a 5 color piece would bring the same regardless of the direction it was turned. Like I said, not trying to argue and I know their are fakes but I think your going a little overboard with it but I am curious too so I would like to know what you do

What do you mean about different serial numbers? They both seem to be 19/25, and the guy even removed the auction after seeing a picture of the original.

[LGB Cards]

No they are not saying they are cutting exact slots... Go home and grab a crappy jersey card of a nobody and try and remove the jersey piece. It is not hard to do (I have tried this as an experiment I do not replace patches on cards for those of you who might think I do). Now take another jersey card of a nobody (this is for the experiment someone else would buy a replica jersey and cut out a patch from the jersey) now once both jerseys are out which is very easy switch them. Stick the first one in the second card and the second one in the first card. You have just now switched your first jersey cards. There was no cutting holes in cards or anything. You can see how easy this would be for someone else to do it with putting a fake patch in.

Oh man, so now YOU admit that you can do it, but just did it for an experiment. The point is like on the Backstrom that Beckett didn't even notice that the patch was replaced, counted off for other things but didn't notice that someone replaced the patch when in reality they are the ones with the proper tools and the experience to tell any fake.

[LGB Cards]

What do you mean about different serial numbers? They both seem to be 19/25, and the guy even removed the auction after seeing a picture of the original.

Well, for one, if you sell on Ebay you know for a fact that Ebay will bring a world of hell your way regardless of if its legit or not and he might have simply took it down to keep from that hell coming his way.

I'll share an experience with you. I bought 22 NHL jerseys off of Ebay wanting to keep some for me and sell some to get my money back. I bought them off of Ebay, then got contacted by Adidas's lawyers threatening to sue me for up to $1,000,000 for damages from selling the jerseys. I did my research first and can't tell any different in what I was selling and what I seen at my local NHL team's arena. Funny enough though Facebook has links to buy these same jersey's but Adidas can't catch them despite the fact that every time I refresh my page the add is there. For this I was sanctioned by Ebay and it took a year to get my good name back. I feel that I am right and actually have lawsuits pending against a few people for this but don't sell jerseys anymore simply due to the headache.

Now, onto the numbers. the Doughty on the first page is different, one is 65 and one is 55. The McGinn is clearly 149 and 10 something, I can't tell exactly but can tell the second number is a 0 and not a 4. The Goligski is 14 and 04, VERY clearly. The Stamkos is 58 and 59 and there are several people that see this, you can clearly see that there is a space with no shine in the second one, which means there is a gap of no stamping.

Now, I will admit there are some the same, the Backstrom and the Thornton are the same but the logic behind the Thornton is off. He is pictured in a Sharks jersey, which mean he played for them OR at least did a photoshoot for the card in a Sharks jersey, there is NO reason this would have to be a Bruins patch and in reality I would question the black one before the "real" seeing as how it is flat black.


If you go back and look you can see all of this, I have blown some of them up and fixed the resolution to see what the numbers are and they are different.


But, has no one even considered that the card companies make errors? I was buying Topps Rising Rookies Football and not a single one of the Retail patch cards were right, NOT A SINGLE ONE. We have all seen blank backs, card with the wrong back or wrong front, hologram cards of one player with a hologram of a different player. It is possible that the card numbers have been duplicated.

[LGB Cards]

I'm going to put this out there too and challenge anyone to answer this. The guy who is pointing all of this out, Gomaz, is a rookie here, not on staff, and has provided no credentials on who he is. BUT from what I understand Upper Deck let him come into the factory and take pics of ALL of the Cup Patch Autos BEFORE they packed them. I would really like to know his credentials or the how or why of how he ended up getting into Upper Deck in order to take pics of ALL of the Cup Patch Auto's.

If he did take pics of all of these where is the link to the database so all of us can also see this, a database of all of this would be helpful to the rest of us in order to identify fakes BUT this guy who is new on here has a database of these and Beckett doesn't.

Exact post on 2/6/10 by Gomaz:
Its an all black patch. I photographed 45 cards per shot. Its right.

Photographed, but then it says the cards were scanned by another person helping Gomaz. Photos and scans are COMPLETELY different, so which is it?

Example: First post by TysonX504:
Thanks to Gomaz for the help, we will keep track of all the fake patchs found with the scans of the originals as proof.

Then there is this that I call TOTAL BS on:
No, the 4CL says 58/99. Believe me, I contacted the buyer of this card yesterday hoping that it was 59/99 as well. But no, he confirmed he has the repatched 4CL Stamkos 58/99.

The buyer confirmed that he repatched a $2500 card? BS


This one is VERY fishy too: On 6/21/10 by HammerHawks:
The company doesn't, but gomaz on here went and took pics of all of the The Cup patches before they were packed, that's how we know, for example, the Goligoski is a fake.

He clearly states that Gomaz went to Upper Deck and got pics of ALL of the Cup Patch Auto's before packing. Now there are several issues with this. 1. You are talking different years on here so he would have had to do this more once to KNOW these are fakes, I can see different years of Cup card in the pics you are identifying. 2. All of these were not made in Canada which is where Gomaz is from. 3. Upper Deck nor Beckett has a list of fakes or pics of fakes but this guy goes into the factory and takes pics when these companies don't. 4. I have now noticed that most people who back this as being legit HAVE SOME SORT OF SANCTION ON HERE, THE USER WHO POSTED THIS THREAD IS NOW SUSPENDED DUE TO RULES VIOLATION AND ANOTHER GUY WHO IS "WORKING" WITH GOMAZ IS NOT ALLOWED TO BUY/TRADE/OR SELL ON HERE DUE TO RULES VIOLATIONS. SO IT JUST SO HAPPENS THAT MOST PEOPLE BACKING THIS GUY HAVE VIOLATED SCF POLICIES AND HAVE BEEN SANCTIONED. That's fishier than the cards you are posting.

Here, on the Stamkos again:
Come on guys. It doesn't get much more obvious than this. Anyway, the buyer of the repatched card has returned the card to the seller who admitted to repatching the card himself and the buyer has been issued a refund for his money order. It only took 2 months to go through the entire process, but it's nice to know you will get your money back when something like this happens.

Well, for 1, YOU CAN'T ACCEPT A MONEY ORDER FOR PURCHASES ON EBAY, I KNOW THIS FOR A FACT, I USED TO TAKE MO'S, CREDIT CARDS, CHECKS, PAYPAL, AND EVEN WESTERN UNION TRANSFERS. SO THERE IS ANOTHER FISHY ISSUE OF SOMEONE BREAKING ANOTHER POLICY. 2. If you went to all the trouble of repatching a card and then sold it would YOU REALLY admit to it? If they repatched it they are dishonest obviously and would NEVER admit to this due to all the laws they have broken by doing this on top of being out the $900 for the card and ruining a $2500 Stamkos card. It also just so happens that this user has one of the nicest Stamkos GOLD Cup Patch/Auto's that I have ever seen but KNOWS that his are real. It so sick of a patch that I can't even describe it, it has about half of the bolt in it from a shoulder patch.



Someone on here asked if Gomaz would be at UD this year to photograph The Cup card and how he gets access to this. People are quick to respond that cards are fake BUT NO ONE HAS EVER RESPONDED TO THIS.

Has anyone else noticed that the "fake" pics are much better quality than the "original" cards? The claim of gluing the patches in is crap, the patches are inset and if it was glued over itwould be flush to the surface of even stick off the card.


Now, for you that have read all of this. I entered this thread to get information and read postings but now call TOTAL BS on the whole thing. It also funny how most people on here that defend him have sanctions on here. To me it seems that a group of people are trying to pull a great scam, saying that cards are fake but THEY have the original pics and can prove it is fake. This could easily be a good cross-scam where they are saying "All of these are fake, but I have the real one if you want to buy it"


Once again I challenge anyone of you, especially Gomaz, to prove something to me, let me see the database of all of these pics, explain the fishy things I have mentioned, that others have also mentioned. I am open to admit that I am wrong so prove to me that I am. If not I will be presenting all of these facts to others to have this thread removed and place sanctions on those who are telling these lies. As usual though I expect attitudes, cursing, and cross-questioning as you normally receive from people who you have dead to rights as being liars, fakes, or cheats

[andrewconnors9]

dude, he does have them setup for everyone to see, just ask. Fakes are made easily and sold everyday on ebay, bottom line. You dont need a very high IQ to pull this off and if you think its not possible well you have some learning to do.

There has been a couple Crosby The Cup RCs /99 faked from a plain patch. You may say "why do that to a 2500$ card?" and easy, for the theif who is going to scam somebody, its because it will increase their profits by about 10,000$ and in their eyes they kno they can do it and they will.

Sucks, but it happens everyday. Dont defend these people, especially people like the Kenny guy whos doing it from multiple eBay accounts and needs to be stopped. People like you are the ones who are going to let this continute by saying they arent fake when they clearly are.

[Craig2]

Gomaz has a large database of Cup rookies from several years, one that I've consulted before making purchases. I can't speak to what you say about those who support him since I'm not really trying to come down on one side or another, but I will say that I've done multiple deals with him and he's always been a pleasure to deal with.

I'm guessing that there are some cases where people are overzealous in rooting out alleged fakes, but there are also a few guys out there who succeed in the buying/selling of cards through re-patching. I don't think this should turn into name-calling, me vs. you, us vs. them, or whatever. I think your point about possible duplicates in numbering is a good one, but I also believe that there are a number of fake patches always floating around.

I'll see if I can find that link for you, but I can assure you as a non-violator of SCF rules that it does exist. :)

[AndrewJacobson]

Oh man, so now YOU admit that you can do it, but just did it for an experiment. The point is like on the Backstrom that Beckett didn't even notice that the patch was replaced, counted off for other things but didn't notice that someone replaced the patch when in reality they are the ones with the proper tools and the experience to tell any fake.

I work at Upper Deck... I think I have a little more respect for the hobby than that so yes it was an experiment... and I have photos of every taylor hall rookie this year and subban and so does everyone else if they want them!

[dahabsfan]

I'm going to put this out there too and challenge anyone to answer this. The guy who is pointing all of this out, Gomaz, is a rookie here, not on staff, and has provided no credentials on who he is. BUT from what I understand Upper Deck let him come into the factory and take pics of ALL of the Cup Patch Autos BEFORE they packed them. I would really like to know his credentials or the how or why of how he ended up getting into Upper Deck in order to take pics of ALL of the Cup Patch Auto's.

Jeremy is one of the class acts of the hobby and was invited down to do this which he did entirely on his own dime.


If he did take pics of all of these where is the link to the database so all of us can also see this, a database of all of this would be helpful to the rest of us in order to identify fakes BUT this guy who is new on here has a database of these and Beckett doesn't.

The database is not public domain at this point but has been used to verify the validity of many many patches for people in the hobby. You do realize there are other hobby sites out there with a much stronger following of high end hockey collectors right?



Then there is this that I call TOTAL BS on:
No, the 4CL says 58/99. Believe me, I contacted the buyer of this card yesterday hoping that it was 59/99 as well. But no, he confirmed he has the repatched 4CL Stamkos 58/99.

The buyer confirmed that he repatched a $2500 card? BS

Call whatever you want, fact is mwdonald has spent a ton of his own time tracking these as well as myself and several other members to try and help people in this hobby not fall prey to these scumbags.


This one is VERY fishy too: On 6/21/10 by HammerHawks:
The company doesn't, but gomaz on here went and took pics of all of the The Cup patches before they were packed, that's how we know, for example, the Goligoski is a fake.

He clearly states that Gomaz went to Upper Deck and got pics of ALL of the Cup Patch Auto's before packing. Now there are several issues with this. 1. You are talking different years on here so he would have had to do this more once to KNOW these are fakes, I can see different years of Cup card in the pics you are identifying.

Jeremy did photograph one entire years run of all Cup patches as well he previously catalogued most of the high end RC patches which are readily available on photobucket. The other years have been tracked by several users as stated before.


2. All of these were not made in Canada which is where Gomaz is from.

Irrelevant.


3. Upper Deck nor Beckett has a list of fakes or pics of fakes but this guy goes into the factory and takes pics when these companies don't.

And? Lots of the hobby's biggest collectors get afforded inside looks/tour/info that you don't - deal with it.


4. I have now noticed that most people who back this as being legit HAVE SOME SORT OF SANCTION ON HERE, THE USER WHO POSTED THIS THREAD IS NOW SUSPENDED DUE TO RULES VIOLATION AND ANOTHER GUY WHO IS "WORKING" WITH GOMAZ IS NOT ALLOWED TO BUY/TRADE/OR SELL ON HERE DUE TO RULES VIOLATIONS. SO IT JUST SO HAPPENS THAT MOST PEOPLE BACKING THIS GUY HAVE VIOLATED SCF POLICIES AND HAVE BEEN SANCTIONED. That's fishier than the cards you are posting.


1 Poster on here is suspended? Point?
Here, on the Stamkos again:
Come on guys. It doesn't get much more obvious than this. Anyway, the buyer of the repatched card has returned the card to the seller who admitted to repatching the card himself and the buyer has been issued a refund for his money order. It only took 2 months to go through the entire process, but it's nice to know you will get your money back when something like this happens.

Well, for 1, YOU CAN'T ACCEPT A MONEY ORDER FOR PURCHASES ON EBAY, I KNOW THIS FOR A FACT, I USED TO TAKE MO'S, CREDIT CARDS, CHECKS, PAYPAL, AND EVEN WESTERN UNION TRANSFERS. SO THERE IS ANOTHER FISHY ISSUE OF SOMEONE BREAKING ANOTHER POLICY.

Actually you can accept money orders with no problems at all on ebay, you simply cannot solicit them as a form of payment. If you read the fine print " For most categories, sellers can't ask buyers to:

• Send cash through the mail
• Send cash or money orders through instant, point-to-point cash transfer services (that are not banks) such as Western Union or MoneyGram"

Key word - ASK. There is nothing that prevents you from accepting them as payment if they buyer sends it on his own.


2. If you went to all the trouble of repatching a card and then sold it would YOU REALLY admit to it? If they repatched it they are dishonest obviously and would NEVER admit to this due to all the laws they have broken by doing this on top of being out the $900 for the card and ruining a $2500 Stamkos card. It also just so happens that this user has one of the nicest Stamkos GOLD Cup Patch/Auto's that I have ever seen but KNOWS that his are real. It so sick of a patch that I can't even describe it, it has about half of the bolt in it from a shoulder patch.

Drivel.

Someone on here asked if Gomaz would be at UD this year to photograph The Cup card and how he gets access to this. People are quick to respond that cards are fake BUT NO ONE HAS EVER RESPONDED TO THIS.

Has anyone else noticed that the "fake" pics are much better quality than the "original" cards? The claim of gluing the patches in is crap, the patches are inset and if it was glued over itwould be flush to the surface of even stick off the card.

Of course they're better quality that's the entire goal of swapping out the swatches. As for the process - nothing is glued over, the old swatch is removed and new one is inserted....period.

Now, for you that have read all of this. I entered this thread to get information and read postings but now call TOTAL BS on the whole thing. It also funny how most people on here that defend him have sanctions on here. To me it seems that a group of people are trying to pull a great scam, saying that cards are fake but THEY have the original pics and can prove it is fake. This could easily be a good cross-scam where they are saying "All of these are fake, but I have the real one if you want to buy it"

It isn't rocket science to search the right databases to retrieve pictures from the original auction.

Example from one of the bogus Crosby's that I posted:
http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedi...dney-113117300

http://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedi...sby-2clr-patch

Subscribe as a full member and you can access everything regardless how old the auction is.

Once again I challenge anyone of you, especially Gomaz, to prove something to me, let me see the database of all of these pics, explain the fishy things I have mentioned, that others have also mentioned. I am open to admit that I am wrong so prove to me that I am. If not I will be presenting all of these facts to others to have this thread removed and place sanctions on those who are telling these lies. As usual though I expect attitudes, cursing, and cross-questioning as you normally receive from people who you have dead to rights as being liars, fakes, or cheats

Your entire post is BS, supposition, and baseless allegations with no merit and stinks entirely of being one of these patch fakers that's trying to discredit some honest and upstanding members in the hobby or of being a really really naive collector in serious denial.

See above.

[HawksFan67]

Geez......

I picked the wrong week to stop drinking..........

[RGM81]

Easy, gents, easy. Try to keep the personal comments/attacks out of the discussion, please.

Regarding gomaz, the number of trades he has here at SCF has no correlation to his standing in the hobby. Those who have been around the hobby boards long enough are well aware of who he is and of the fact that he was at the packout for The Cup to photographs all the patch cards one year.

Now, back on track, please...