Anyone have Grade 6 BGS Samples?

[mr ozzie]

Hey fellas,

So, I get this email from Beckett a couple of days ago stating that the cards that I sent in are now being shipped back. I go look up the final grades on my cards and found some disappointing grades. My Gretzky RC did strike me a bit odd though. I was anticipating a low grade, but I wasn't expecting such a low grade as 6. Before sending it in, the only problem I saw was that the card was off-center and Wayne's face is out-of-focus. The corners & edges were sharp, and there were no surface blemishes. Another odd thing too is that in the Card Lookup, there were no breakdown scores posted, just a final grade score - while the rest of my cards had their breakdown scores.

My question is, is there anyone on here at SCF have a good scan of a graded 6 BGS card that they are willing to post up? Should I be suspicious/worried about the ol' switcharoo trick; especially when I handed my cards over to my LCS so that they took care of Beckett? Thanks-in-advance for the advice.

[reoddai]

Hey there,

Someone upset with a 6 on a Gretzky? Take pity on my 3.5 please.

Anyways, based on the Beckett grading system:
http://www.beckett.com/estore/helpsy...?ArticleId=257
If you have a card with a minor focus imperfection, you could expect a grade between 5 and 7.

As for the OC problem, it really depends on how far off center it is. If its a bit Off center (like 70/30), then that's a 6. If its really off center, like a (80/20), then that's a 4. JIf you can post a scan of your Gretzky pre-submission I can show you how to measure the degree of OC.

Also, if you still have that scan, you can compare it with the Gretzky you get back. I don't know how your LCS runs, but if there was an issue of fraud, they are jeopardizing their rep by doing this. Talk to fellow LCS frequenters to see if they've ever had any issues.

However, judging from what you're saying, it seems like your cards was headed for a 6 anyways.

One last thing. BGS changed their policy a couple of years back. For cards produced before 1981, they will no longer assign subgrades. So even though you submitted the card to BGS, they automatically re-assigned that card to BVG (Beckett Vintage Grading Services).

About 4+ years ago vintage cards were graded by BGS and assigned subgrades. See my gretzky for comparison:
http://i240.photobucket.com/albums/f..._75_5_55_2.jpg
The problem with the subgrades as this. BGS says that the highest grade a card can have is one full point above the lower grade. So, since my Gretzky has a 2.5 surface, regardless of the other grades, the highest it can be is 3.5. However, with vintage cards, most of them have one large flaw. Either the edges are bad, or the corners are bad or the surface is bad, but usually only just one. If you submitted a vintage card to PSA, and the surface was bad, but not too bad, what PSA does is relax the weighing of that characterisitic on the final grade. So, if the surface is a 2.5, but everything else is 6's ot 7's, you might end up with a 5. However, because of BGS's rules, you could only get a 3.5. What was happening was that BGS was losing the market share to PSA because people who wanted to grade vintage cards wanted higher grades and were sending them to PSA. You even complain about the 6 itself right?

The solution, create a new category, BVG which grades like PSA. If there is one characteristic which has a major flaw, the impact of that flaw on the final grade is relaxed and you get a better grade than you would with BGS. The cost is that you no longer get subgrades for pre-81 cards, unless you can find someone who submitted that card a long time ago.

HOpe that this helps,
Cheers,
reoddai

[mr ozzie]

That helps a lot Reoddai. Many thanks. From what you're saying I either scored 5 on the my centering or 5 on the focus issue, and therefore cannot go higher than 6. I might try PSA when I get the chance because I feel I have a 7 on my hands here. Unfortunately, I never took a photo (didn't have a scanner at the time) during pre-sub. When it gets in, I'll scan it right away. Thanks again for the clarification.

[v3rs3]

EX-MT 6: Excellent-Mint.

• A PSA EX-MT 6 card may have visible surface wear or a printing defect which does not detract from its overall appeal. A very light scratch may be detected only upon close inspection. Corners may have slightly graduated fraying. Picture focus may be slightly out-of-register. Card may show some loss of original gloss, may have minor wax stain on reverse, may exhibit very slight notching on edges and may also show some off-whiteness on borders. Centering must be 80/20 or better on the front and 90/10 or better on the reverse.

• Even on PSA's grading a slight focus problem will get a 6. I think you probably will just have to be happy with a 6.

[mr ozzie]

I think you're right. If I had only 1 issue, I might be able to get a higher grade with PSA. However, seeing that I have both a centering problem and a focus problem PSA might be just as tough as BGS is. To be honest, I shouldn't really complain since I never paid for the card in the first place.

• Even on PSA's grading a slight focus problem will get a 6. I think you probably will just have to be happy with a 6.

[reoddai]

That helps a lot Reoddai. Many thanks. From what you're saying I either scored 5 on the my centering or 5 on the focus issue, and therefore cannot go higher than 6. I might try PSA when I get the chance because I feel I have a 7 on my hands here. Unfortunately, I never took a photo (didn't have a scanner at the time) during pre-sub. When it gets in, I'll scan it right away. Thanks again for the clarification.

Glad I could help.

But just to clarify, just because you have ONE problem, that's okay. Vintage cards usually have one big problem. If you have two flaws in the near the 5-6 category, you're probably going to get a 6.

I think you're right. If I had only 1 issue, I might be able to get a higher grade with PSA. However, seeing that I have both a centering problem and a focus problem PSA might be just as tough as BGS is. To be honest, I shouldn't really complain since I never paid for the card in the first place.

Again, PSA and BVG grade about the same for vintage cards. They both ignore one small flaw and will still give you a good grade. But with two small flaws? Can't ignore that. PSA is generally as tough as BVG. BGS is supposed to be tougher than PSA, but lately, they haven't been doing a very good job.

Still, Enjoy the Gretzky though. I know that I enjoy mine.

Cheers,
reoddai

[Dr Kicker]

You can always compare with Terry multiple ones.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v426/terry1hockeyfan/Gretzky%20Rookies/

[mr ozzie]

Awww...that's awesome, mate! Thanks.

You can always compare with Terry multiple ones.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v4...zky%20Rookies/