Why Tim Tebow is great

[AUTaxMan]

Yeah I don't have a problem with the bible teaching that and christians believing that but if you look at it from a neutral prespective without religious bias the koran says similiar things. Yes there may be references to God's/Allah's anger and rath in the koran but it can also be found in the bible.

Maybe in the old testament. Not in the new testament.

[habsheaven]

Maybe in the old testament. Not in the new testament.

I'm going to wait for the "next" testament. God may have mellowed out a bit by then and got rid of that "banishment to hell" thingy.

[mrveggieman]

Maybe in the old testament. Not in the new testament.

That dosent matter. Per Revelation 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that hears the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book: Also check out Deuteronomy 12:32 See that you do all I command you; do not add to it or take away from it. So you cannot be a christian and say mabey in the old testament but I go by the new testament. If you claim to be a christian you have to go by both the old and new testament equally without bias for or against one or the other.

[AUTaxMan]

That dosent matter. Per Revelation 22:18-19 For I testify unto every man that hears the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, God shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book: Also check out Deuteronomy 12:32 See that you do all I command you; do not add to it or take away from it. So you cannot be a christian and say mabey in the old testament but I go by the new testament. If you claim to be a christian you have to go by both the old and new testament equally without bias for or against one or the other.

I am not saying to ignore the old testament. You have to read it in context of the Bible as a whole, however, instead of cherry-picking verses to fit your argument. The new testament brought with it a paradigm shift from the Jewish faith to the Christian faith and a new message that faith in God is what brought salvation, not merely strict adherence to mosaic law. Regardless of what the old testament says, the message of Christ is one of God's grace and forgiveness, not of wrath and damnation.

[mrveggieman]

I am not saying to ignore the old testament. You have to read it in context of the Bible as a whole, however, instead of cherry-picking verses to fit your argument. The new testament brought with it a paradigm shift from the Jewish faith to the Christian faith and a new message that faith in God is what brought salvation, not merely strict adherence to mosaic law. Regardless of what the old testament says, the message of Christ is one of God's grace and forgiveness, not of wrath and damnation.

And I am cool with reading and accepting any holy book in its correct context and not cherry picking verses to fit your argument. However just like what I learned in algerba class in middle school what you do to one side you have to do to another. If you want the bible to be taught in its proper form and you dislike cherry picking of verses you would have to give the koran the same respect. No more highlighting verses of god/allah's anger and wrath from the koran if you don't agree with it being done with the bible.

[gatorboymike]

Where do you keep getting this concept that I "want" you to go to hell? I find it very difficult to reconcile with my prior comment that "we want you to go to heaven."

I came to that conclusion via the chain of logic stated above, which you did not dispute. And I simply don't believe you when you say you want me to go to heaven.

Also, where did I say you're "rotten"? Like boba said, we're not in the business of judging men's hearts. That's God's. The Bible says that the wages of all sin is death (i.e., going to hell). It is not about being a good person or a bad person. We have all sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. This applies to all people, even Christians. However, there is hope for us all in that Christ paid the price for all of our sins through his crucifixion and resurrection. This means that we do not have to pay that price if we accept Jesus as our personal savior.

You didn't say that, the Bible does, and you believe the Bible, don't you? And yes, I've heard the sales pitch a million times. I'm not buying. Not to mention the fact that it contradicts itself. We've all sinned, so we deserve to go to hell, but it's not about being good or bad? Does not compute.

Your Cthulhu analogy is off the mark, unless you are offended by my wanting you to go to heaven. Would I be terribly offended if you were looking forward to my going to Cthulhu's version of heaven? No.

Yes, I would be offended by you wanting me to go to heaven, if I thought that was really what you wanted. So I could hang out with a bunch of Republicans in the sky forever? That's even more insulting than telling me I deserve to go to hell. And I'm not a big Lovecraft expert, but I don't think Cthulhu has a heaven.

Yes, and when read as a whole, the message of Christ is one of God's grace and forgiveness.

No it isn't.

"Sunshine! Rainbows! Lollipops! Puppydogs! (eternal torture in a fiery demon-filled pit if you don't worship me forever) Happiness! Kitty cats! Ice cream!"

[gatorboymike]

Nowhere in any of that does it say that God says non-believers deserve to go to hell. Every verse you quoted speaks to the outcome of rejecting Jesus Christ as your savior.

Nice try at twisting what it says, but you entirely failed to prove your original #1 statement.

Wait wait wait...are you actually trying to make the case that there's a difference between "You WILL go to hell" and "You DESERVE to go to hell"? I'm sorry, let me go outside and laugh for 30 minutes.

...So, anyway. So you're saying God is going to send me to hell even though I don't deserve it? That would make God and Christianity even more evil than I thought they were.

You also didn't bother to include the other parts of those scriptures which expands on them. For example, Romans 6:23 says (your quoted part) "For the wages of sin is death" (and the part you conveniently left out) "but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord." Like I said, nice try, but still a failure to prove that God thinks non-believers deserve to go to hell.

Well those parts don't matter to me because I'm not buying your invisible car, Sunny Jim. You know, I think you're going to be arrested by the FBI for illegally downloading music and movies. You don't deserve it to be arrested by the FBI, but you're going to be arrested by the FBI anyway. And you can't get mad at me for saying that, because I didn't say you deserve it.

[gatorboymike]

and this is where your argument falls apart. if christians are saying to you "i want you to burn in hell" they are 100% wrong and I would be the first to tell them that. If they are simply saying, according to my beliefs, if you don't accept jesus, then you will go to hell, they aren't out of bounds.

if you told me, i hope my god tortures you for eternity, you would be wrong. if you said "according to my beliefs, cthulhu is going to eat you and your loved ones" it would not bother me in the least. why should i care if something i don't believe in is a "threat" to me?

so, for clarification, if someone says "i hope you are tortured for eternity" they are wrong. if they say "according to my beliefs you will be" is not. those are two totally different attitudes and thoughts. christians normally take the latter while you like to imply they take the former. if you "threaten" me with punishment from a god i don't believe in, why the crap should i care?

I'm glad you said that, because maybe now you'll understand why your threats of going to Christian hell don't convince me to believe in Christianity. My problem is not feeling threatened (with the exception of the possibility that some Christian could decide he might as well kill me, because I'm going to hell anyway), but feeling insulted. Everything you do and everything you say is a calculated, conscious, vicious, vitriolic, monstrous insult against me and everyone I love and everything I value.

[ensbergcollector]

I'm glad you said that, because maybe now you'll understand why your threats of going to Christian hell don't convince me to believe in Christianity. My problem is not feeling threatened (with the exception of the possibility that some Christian could decide he might as well kill me, because I'm going to hell anyway), but feeling insulted. Everything you do and everything you say is a calculated, conscious, vicious, vitriolic, monstrous insult against me and everyone I love and everything I value.

anyone on here can read your words and mine and see very clearly that you are the only one who is a calculated, conscious, vicious, vitriolic, monstrous insult against me and everyone I love and everything I value.

you systematically and openly attack christians and act as though you have the all powerful given right to. I have never once threatened you or attacked you with my words. Your only "proof" is when you try to tell christians what they believe. no one here has attacked you or said we wanted you to go to hell. you have often wished ill on christians and think you are justified because of some "evil" that has been done to you by christianity. you are every bad and evil thing that you attempt to attribute to christianity.

and as far as your violence comment, the only one here who has acted in a way that should cause someone else to feel threatened is you. i would be fearful of any christian who you came into personal contact with because according to your own words you are justified in all of your hate filled emotions. the worst violent offenders are the ones who think that they are right and just in their actions.

[gatorboymike]

Do unto others, as you say. I have the right to defend myself from marauders. If someone came attacking you in real life, wouldn't you do the same?