Results 11 to 19 of 19
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08-02-2013, 02:24 PM #11
This Public Health issue has NOTHING to do with religion, and everything to do with common sense. The majority of christians that I know, are not blessed with a huge amount of common sense, but they are wise enough to immunize.
You should be looking at this with regard to public health, outbreak, and systematic viral attack.
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08-02-2013, 02:34 PM #12
I 100% agree with you. A lady at my church gives all of these "reasons" why her family doesn't vaccinate their children, and it makes ZERO sense to me. That's what i'm talking about, why Christians who don't immunize are wrong. They need to look at it with those regards, like you said. So often i want to go to this lady and tell her how wrong she is! She expects everyone else to immunize so her children won't get sick, when she should have immunized to begin with!
All of that to say you're absolutely right. It's a common sense issue. I wish people had more of it (Christians and non-Christians alike), myself included.
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08-03-2013, 08:37 AM #13
All of that to say you're absolutely right. It's a common sense issue. I wish people had more of it (Christians and non-Christians alike), myself included.
great post!
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08-03-2013, 08:09 PM #14
http://www.nvic.org/vaccines-and-dis...ediabetes.aspx
In the fall of 1997, the Centers for Disease Control confirmed that the number of Americans living with diabetes has skyrocketed in the past 40 years with a record sixfold increase in this chronic disease since 1958. It is estimated that nearly 16 million Americans are suffering with diabetes and 5 million more may have it but not know it.
Over the past four decades, intensive national mass vaccination campaigns have dramatically increased vaccination rates among American children who now are getting 34 doses of 10 different viral and bacterial vaccines before they enter kindergarten. Recent published data in the medical literature suggest increasing numbers of childhood vaccines may be playing a role in the big jump in the number of cases of juvenile diabetes.
http://gaia-health.com/gaia-blog/201...tes-bmj-study/In a mind-boggling bit of double-speak, the British Medical Journal (BMJ) published a study concluding no link between the HiB vaccine and diabetes, but with results clearly showing that such a link exists. It leaves little doubt that the HiB vaccine causes type 1 diabetes.
How did they manage this bit of prestidigitation? With statistics, of course.
The study examined three distinct groups of Finnish children:
- Cohort 1: 128,936 children born between 1 October 1983 and 1 September 1985, 24 months before the Haemophilus influenzae type B (HiB) vaccine was given.
- Cohort 2: 59, 238 children born between 1 October 1985 and 1 Septempter 1987 on odd-numbered days, given HiB vaccine at 3, 4, 6, and 14-18 months of age.
- Cohort 3: 57,114 children born between 1 October 1985 and 1 Septempter 1987 on even-numbered days, given HiB vaccine only once at age 24 months.
To simplify: Cohort 1 did not receive the HiB vaccine. Cohort 2 received 4 doses of HiB by 18 months of age. Cohort 3 received a single dose at 24 months of age.
Translating these figures into percentages:
- Cohort 1 (no HiB vaccine): 0.34% got type 1 diabetes
- Cohort 2 (4 HiB vaccines): 0.40% got type 1 diabetes
- Cohort 3 (1 HiB vaccine): 0.37% got type 1 diabetes
Because the rates of type 1 diabetes are relatively low, the authors were able to state that there is no statistically significant difference in rates of type 1 diabetes among the three groups. In some situations, this is a valid approach. However, in this one, it most assuredly is not. What matters is the relationship between the groups, not the overall figures.
Therefore, it is reasonable to state:
- The children who received a single dose of HiB vaccine were 8.8% more likely to develop type 1 diabetes than those who had no HiB vaccine.
- The children who received 4 HiB vaccine doses were nearly 17.6% more likely to develop type 1 diabetes than those who had no HiB vaccine.
That is a significant finding, which adds up to thousands of children in Finland alone who now suffer from type 1 diabetes as a direct result of the vaccine program.
These authors have completely ignored a well-known fact: Adverse effects often don’t show up in small groups because they aren’t very common. Therefore, you must look at large numbers to see the reality. In this case, the reality is that the HiB vaccine is causing a huge number of children to develop type 1 diabetes.
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08-03-2013, 10:30 PM #15
tpeichel did you look at the full stats on the article. I just did and found a response from a medical epidemiologist from the CDC.
http://pediatrics.aappublications.or...8/6/e112/reply
We are not aware that his analysis has ever been published in a peer-reviewed publication. The data are from a follow-up study of a cohort of children who participated in a national Hib clinical trial in Finland. The definitive analysis of the follow-up study was published by Karvonen (1) and no statistically significant increased risk of type 1 diabetes was found to be associated with Hib vaccination or with age at vaccination.
." The contention that the relative risks of 1.14 (unadjusted) and 1.23 (adjusted) from our case-control study (3) are similar to the 1.17 relative risk noted by Classen, completely ignores the wide 95% confidence intervals that extend down to 0.5 on the lower end for both estimates.
Since the publication or our study, we have become aware of another large multicenter European case-control study of vaccines and type 1 diabetes (4).
The study included 900 cases of type 1 diabetes and 2302 controls. The relative risk for Haemophilus influenzae vaccine adjusted for potentially confounding risk factors was 0.75 (95% confidence interval, 0.30-1.92), providing additional evidence of a lack of an increased risk of type 1 diabetes associated with Hib vaccine.
Next, Classen claims that the incidence of IDDM in Finland increased by about 60% following the introduction of MMR vaccine in 1982 and Hib vaccine in 1986. He failed to mention, however, that the incidence of type 1 diabetes in Finland has been increasing virtually linearly since the 1960's (1). Classen goes on to speculate that the combined effects of Hib and MMR vaccine may increase the risk of diabetes by 60%. He arrived at this figure by multiplying the two non-statistically significant odds ratios from our study of 1.14 for Hib and 1.36 for MMR. There is no support for a possible increase in risk associated with either vaccine from any other study.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confidence_interval
More specifically, the meaning of the term "confidence level" is that, if confidence intervals are constructed across many separate data analyses of repeated (and possibly different) experiments, the proportion of such intervals that contain the true value of the parameter will match the confidence level; this is guaranteed by the reasoning underlying the construction of confidence intervals.[1][2][3]
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08-04-2013, 12:24 AM #16
Can you point me to the raw data for the referenced studies?
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08-04-2013, 12:28 AM #17
Childhood diabetes has not gone up in a linear fashion since 1960, rather it has increased dramatically the past 20 years. Are you aware of any double-blind randomized studies of the current U.S. Vaccination Schedule?
This is statistically insignificant? Even though the study groups were much larger than anything else you referenced?
- Cohort 1 (no HiB vaccine): 0.34% got type 1 diabetes
- Cohort 2 (4 HiB vaccines): 0.40% got type 1 diabetes
- Cohort 3 (1 HiB vaccine): 0.37% got type 1 diabetes
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08-04-2013, 12:50 AM #18
Wide confidence intervals that cross 1.0 mean there is no association. For an effect to be consider clinically significant the p-value needs to less than 0.05 and the confidence interval can not cross 1.0. The smaller the confidence interval ( under 1.0)the more likely the effect you are looking for is to happen.
If an effect of treatment does not have a low P-value and a good confidence interval, the treatment does not have an effect.
Based on the confidence interval alone, there is no association between the Hib vaccine and Type 1 diabetes in children.
Anytime an author of an article does not include P-values and confidence intervals, the author could be hiding data. Odds Ratio can be maniuplated to show an effect when there is none. This is why p-values and confidence intervals are very important.
The author who published data on vaccines causing autism has been discredited and stripped of his license. He was falsfying data. BMJ has retracted the article.
An investigation published by the British medical journal BMJ concludes the study's author, Dr. Andrew Wakefield, misrepresented or altered the medical histories of all 12 of the patients whose cases formed the basis of the 1998 study -- and that there was "no doubt" Wakefield was responsible.
"It's one thing to have a bad study, a study full of error, and for the authors then to admit that they made errors," Fiona Godlee, BMJ's editor-in-chief, told CNN. "But in this case, we have a very different picture of what seems to be a deliberate attempt to create an impression that there was a link by falsifying the data."
http://www.cnn.com/2011/HEALTH/01/05...nes/index.html
Last edited by drtom2005; 08-04-2013 at 01:51 AM.
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08-04-2013, 02:00 AM #19
If people have a religous/personal reason for not getting a vaccine, it is their choice. People should not use false and misrepresented data to make a decision, though.
There are side effects of vaccines such as Guillen-Bare Syndrome(happens extremely rarely) with the influenza vaccine. The risk of dying and other complications(such as missing work) of flu outweigh the risk of getting the vaccine. I always get my vaccines.
http://www.who.int/mediacentre/facts...2003/fs211/en/
" In the United States of America, for example, recent estimates put the cost of influenza epidemics to the economy at US$ 71-167 billion per year...Hospitalization and deaths mainly occur in high-risk groups (elderly, chronically ill). Although difficult to assess, these annual epidemics are thought to result in between three and five million cases of severe illness and between 250 000 and 500 000 deaths every year around the world. Most deaths currently associated with influenza in industrialized countries occur among the elderly over 65 years of age."
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Originally Posted by Darth Braun 
