Why I'm disgusted with The Cup

[RGM81]

At the right time you can always go to walmart or london drugs to find boxes. As long as you don't mind retail over hobby

Not too many tins of The Cup on the shelf at Wal-Mart these days.

[RGM81]

I don’t agree. The card market isn’t what it used to be. The reason why we can’t find supply online is because of the retailers keeping almost everything for group breaks. Easy way to sell at a higher price then what an actual box or case would cost. Unless you have good contacts, you can’t buy anything right now at a decent price online. Presale's are always sold out.

Bingo - I hear a regular refrain from shop owners about the product being allocated and them all receiving a fraction of their actual submitted order. It's essentially become a "pay to play" system and that impacts everything all the way to the end buyer. Basically if you're not loading up on Allure, Synergy, Black Diamond, etc. throughout the year, you're not going to get anywhere near as much Cup as the others stores, who buy all that stuff, do. Down the chain, if you're a guy who just wants to do a tin....because your shop has been allocated, guess who gets first dibs? It's the guy that's been buying cases of everything throughout the year.

[cjb]

I wasn't talking about the cup, i was talking about regular upper deck. Sorry, messaging got a little mixed up there.

[Savard18]

What I find ridiculous about "The Cup" is that they have the audacity to actually issue sticker autos in their product.. Yea, I know most cards are on-card auto's but I have seen several that were sticker autos and for what, $900.00 for a pack of 6 cards??? that is just insulting... I mean I saw a 9 auto fold out booklet that was just, well insulting. If I remember correctly the 9 goalies on the card were Elliot, Price, Rask, Niemi, Crawford, Luongo, Bishop, Holtby and Lundqvist... Anyway it was serial numbered to x/9 but they were all sticker auto's, and I'll admit - when I saw the card it really rubbed me the wrong way. First off they were sticker auto's, second - the card had absolutely no theme whatsoever, and third the goalie selection was pretty brutal, I mean it's almost like they picked goalie names out of a hat and those were the goalies they were going to put on a card. You would figure if "The Cup" were to do a 9 goalie card they would have a theme going on with the card and would have chosen some of the ATG's AND would have had them sign the damn card - not some sticker..

The card went for something ridiculous like $300 bucks too... And I thought to myself and was like you could buy all 9 autos on individual single cards for less than $70 combined minus shipping, probably less than that, perhaps less than $50. I mean the only goalie on that card who's auto is worth much at all is Carey Price, and I'm pretty confident I could find a Carey Price auto for $10 to 20 bucks tops, heck I bet if I looked long enough and deep enough I could find a Price auto for $7 bucks, and the rest of them you can find sticker auto's all day for $5 bucks a pop...

So yea that really rubbed me the wrong way because if someone is going to pay $900 for a pack they better damn well get on card autos at that price.... And look, I get it - it would be difficult to get all goalies to sign the card in a reasonable period of time... So say that was the case, well honestly I don't care because if that was the case the card should have never been produced.... I mean you don't issue sticker autos in $900 packs of cards - it's wrong and insulting..... Look, if I pulled that card I probably would have sent it back to Upper Deck telling them that I didn't pay for an un-themed with sticker autos - send me something else because this is unacceptable....

Man, my dislike for Upper Deck just keeps growing by the day.... But hey, they're a monopoly - it's not like I have any choice if I want to collect hockey cards.... Wait, I do - Leaf In The Game Used makes fabulous cards which in my opinion are superior to Upper Deck, from the players they choose to the design of the cards and even their low serial numbers, not to mention game used material and autos are ALL superior to Upper Deck, and the sad part is they don't even have a license.... And I'm sure some will disagree with me but that's fine, but as a vintage collector and a collector that's into hockey history the cards they produce are just fantastic. Look if you want a GU Patch card that features both Grant Fuhr and Billy Smith, two of only 4 goalies to win a Cup in the 80's ( The other 2 were Roy and Vernon) well ITG is the only company to produce one. I mean I have a ton of ITG cards that will never leave my PC, well unless I get what I demand for them that is... And look, ITG doesn't do that nonsense where they tell a player to put a jersey on, he wears it for a few shifts or even a period, takes it off and does it again, no the jerseys they cut up have some mileage on them - same with their GU equipment cards.. I have a Denis Potvin GU glove and that swatch was clearly used over the course of a season if not several seasons - I mean the leather is all beat up and there are folds in it, it's really a piece of hockey history - at least to me.... But Upper Deck doesn't do any of that, and why??? right because they don't have to because they're competing with no one... UD's motto, er the motto for every card manufacturer these days should be "you can buy what we give you" - never mind room for improvement - no you can have what they provide...

And look, I'm not saying UD is terrible, they just lack creativity and innovation because they don't have to innovate and they don't have to be overly creative... I do enjoy many of their sets but again - there is always room for improvement.... A good example of UD just not getting it are their Portrait cards, I mean does anyone actually collect UD Portraits? because they are seriously some of the ugliest boring cards ever produced.. The Canvas cards are excellent, the Shining/Shooting Stars are OK, the Game Jerseys are "meh" ... I just want to see some innovation, I mean for Gods sake - UD SP and UD SPA are essentially identical sets, is it really that hard to come up with a unique design for both?? I mean even the FWA use the same pictures as the Rookie Authentics .... Oh and the best part is that Rookie Authentics Auto's are serial numbered to xx/25 meanwhile FWA's are obviously serial numbered to xxx/999, yet the FWA's are worth 20x what the Rookie Authentics Auto's are... Yea, go figure that!... Of course that nonsense is it's own topic..

So yea, IMO Upper Deck is "questionable" at best.... Look, it's just not a good look er image to charge a hockey collector $900 bucks for a pack of 6 cards and then put sticker autos in the packs. Obviously I can only speak for myself but I would feel totally ripped off if I paid $900 and got a sticker auto even if it was a 9 card booklet... Well maybe not if I got a booklet with say; Gretzky, Crosby, McDavid, Matthewes, Orr, Bobby Hull, Brett Hull, Mario Lemieux and Dominik Hasek -- that I would be perfectly fine with, lol - I would be more than satisfied, obviously I would prefer on-card autos but stickers - no problem, but c'mon with sticker autos of; Elliot, Price, Rask, Niemi, Crawford, Luongo, MA Fleury, Holtby and Lundqvist... So there are 3 maybe 4 Hall of Famers on that card?? Luongo, Price, Fleury and perhaps Lundqvist??.. I mean the only lock is Luongo, so 1 lock and 3 maybes...

Sorry for my long posts but I like to be through with my take er opinion on a particular subject if I have the time.

[Savard18]

I don’t agree. The card market isn’t what it used to be. The reason why we can’t find supply online is because of the retailers keeping almost everything for group breaks. Easy way to sell at a higher price then what an actual box or case would cost. Unless you have good contacts, you can’t buy anything right now at a decent price online. Presale's are always sold out.

If you can get a Tax ID/# you can buy directly from Upper Deck but it's a little complicated, pretty intrusive and there are contracts involved and just a bunch of other nonsense... Essentially UD wants a commitment in writing that you will buy X amount of product per month or quarterly and there is a bunch of other crap that reads like a "terms of service agreement"... Of course they check your credit score and they want business financials just to buy cards, it's pretty ridiculous..

IDK, In my opinion Dave & Adam's Card World always has the best prices, and the best sales on unopened material, obviously you're all familiar with D & A's, and I have had nothing but good experiences with their product and prices... I mean maybe a year ago (it was a while back but not too long ago) they had a sale on 16-17 UD S1 Blasters - it was incredible - 7 Blaster boxes for $75 with free shipping as usual... I bought 28 boxes and pulled 3 Matthews YG's, not to mention all of the other YG's and inserts I pulled.... Look, I just did the math and I was like, I'm going to pull at least 1 Matthews YG out of 28 blasters, not to mention all of the other YG's I'm going to pull, so it was well worth it ... I mean for $10.50 a box that's a seal and I should have bought more, lol...

So yea I buy from them a lot because they just have the best prices or are very competitive... I do bid on box lots on eBay so you can get unopened material on the cheap that way because sometimes these lots just "fall though the cracks" - don't know how, why and I don't care if I get a lot of recent unopened product at a really good price at auction... But if you keep your eye open on eBay you can always find a deal on unopened product...I mean a while back I won a hobby box of 15-16 UD S2 for $40.00, and that's a steal obviously.. I mean a hobby box of anything regular UD for less than $100.00 that was released over the last 5 or so years is a steal.... Of course I pulled the Eichel Rookie - Yea the UD Portrait, lol... Well I did pull the McDavid OPC Rainbow Update too I believe (one of the OPC updates, it may have been the retro) ... But for $40 bucks, you just cant pass that up - not when there is a McDavid Canvas a McDavid POE and 10 other McDavid's along with an Eichel YG, well worth it for $40 even tho I didn't get the best box.

D & A's is the best on the internet IMO, of course the LCS is a total ripoff, I'm sure it's the same way everywhere.. I mean the best place to buy retail around me is Walmart and Target but they have almost no hockey at all, they have plenty of football, baseball and basketball but there hockey selection is down right pathetic. Upper Deck blasters, tins and fat packs and if you're lucky they may have MVP or Parkhurst too, and the price isn't too bad really except for the tins, blasters are only like $14.99 or $15.99, Fat Packs are like $5 bucks, but the cool thing is on occasion they will get some old UD product, 18-19 or 19-20 and its usually on clearance which is usually like $10.99.. They carried 16-17 UD for the longest time, they still were stocking that until like 2018, so I bought a bunch of it over the years, lol... I don't know how much 16-17 I broke but it had to be at least 100+ blasters and 100+ fat packs and a few hobby and retail boxes and several tins. I think I have like 7 tins sitting in the other room and I know I sent cards out in a few others... I mean I pulled over a dozen Matthews YG's so I did break a ton of 16-17, but hey it was the only product I really had immediate access to so I suppose beggars cant be choosers, lol.

Anyway I hear Toys R Us sells sports cards too, unfortunately the Toys R Us is like a half hour drive from me, I've never been there to checkout their selection but I would presume and I would expect that it's pretty much the same as Walmart or Target, almost no hockey and plenty of baseball, basketball and football.. If my presumption is wrong (and I hope it is) please point that out... I suppose I could call them and be one of those annoying customers that asks too many damn questions....

Then of course you have the asshats that go into Walmart, Target and Toys R Us and pretty much any place that sells cards at retail and they just buy everything, jack the prices up and hawk them on eBay, which sucks because these stores don't have cards in the back, these stores use vendors, so when they're out of cards they will be out until the next time the vendor comes.... And I've seen it happen and I confronted this guy, he was grabbing everything and tossing it into his cart and I told him off and picked though his cart, I wasn't going to let him take the hockey, not only that but I bought some baseball cards too just out of spite, I suppose I got a little bit immature as well because I was taking the boxes out of his cart and putting them back on the shelf .... I mean the dude pissed me off ... I was like "hey do you think you can leave some cards for the kids" of course his smart ™™™ said "uh yea, the pokymon cards are right there haha"... Obviously there was nothing I could do to stop him besides tell him off and take boxes out of his cart that I planned to purchase, look if you see "card hogs" like that and you're not afraid of confrontations then you should confront these clowns because they know what they're doing is selfish and wrong and it's nice to see them humiliated for being ™™™ hats...

[subban7677]

Please show me where you can get a Carey Price auto for $7,and a Lundqvist for $5. Methinks your estimates are a tad off.

[30ranfordfan]

Please show me where you can get a Carey Price auto for $7,and a Lundqvist for $5. Methinks your estimates are a tad off.

I was going to say the same thing. I'll buy all of your $10 Price autos right now, and the $5 Lundqvists.

[Savard18]

Please show me where you can get a Carey Price auto for $7,and a Lundqvist for $5. Methinks your estimates are a tad off.

Maybe a little bit but not that far off. I mean if I take time and look I could absolutely find those autos in that price range... I only spend a few minutes on eBay and found the below auto's, of course I found some IP autos for super cheap (like $5 bucks) as well but I didn't want to use them as an example because they're not "certified"..

Here is a Price auto for $15.00: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2019-20-Ult...UAAOSwIUBf7V-h

Here is a Lundqvist auto for $20.00: https://www.ebay.com/itm/2013-14-ITG...p2047675.l2557

But none of this really matters considering my point was that The Cup shouldn't be putting sticker auto's on their mega premium products... My point was that I could get all of those goalies on the card I mentioned auto's on individual cards for less than $70 bucks, or whatever I said in the post.

Look, realistically I could get Price and Lundqvist auto's all day for between $20-30 bucks with spending little time looking, but if I hold out and wait I'm pretty confident I could find either for $15.00 or less.

[Savard18]

I was going to say the same thing. I'll buy all of your $10 Price autos right now, and the $5 Lundqvists.

Yeah, I'm sure you would, lol...

Unfortunately I don't have any in that price range tho that doesn't mean they don't exist... I mean sure I may have "exaggerated" a bit er "de-exaggerated" on the price BUT like in the above post I found a Lundqvist and Price auto's for less than $20 bucks and I spent only a couple of minutes looking - and like I explained in the above post if I'm patient enough I could find both auto's for really cheap, cheaper than the above auctions...

But like I said - the point I was trying to make was that UD shouldn't be putting sticker auto's on their premium products.. Look, if you buy "The Cup" you would have every right to expect on-card auto's not that sticker nonsense... Don't get me wrong I don't have anything against sticker auto's if you pull them out of a "low" or "mid-end" product, but if you drop $900 USD on a pack of 6 cards I find it insulting that UD would even consider putting sticker autos on that product... When collectors drop that kind of money they deserve better than a sticker because they didn't pay for a sticker auto...

I mean if you disagree that's fine, but I'm just sharing my expectations on premium product.

[Nickwire]

I watched a break last night where blue jackets goalie merzlickins had a 1 of 1 and the 4 plate booklet in the same tin. So really, 5 one of ones of the same guy in a tin.