Rd 1 - Official Series Discussion Thread: Pittsburgh Penguins vs. Philadelphia Flyers

[abls10]

"Engaged" may not be in the rule book. But it has been used when referring to plays like this. I believe Shanahan has used this word in his detailed explanations of similar plays. With new focus on player safety hitting someone while "engaged" with another player is dangerous and warrants a penalty which is what Schenn got penalized for.

[09232003]

ok so first off the rile book your using is from 07-08, so here is the rule from the book 2011-12

Rule 42 - Charging
42.1 Charging - A minor or major penalty shall be imposed on a player who skates or jumps into, or charges an opponent in any manner.
Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner. A “charge” may be the result of a check into the boards, into the goal frame or in open ice.

so schenn was given penalty for charging.

"Yes the announcers said it was a clean hit. but they were wrong. If Martin was alone along the boards yes it would of been a clean hit. But he was engaged with another player which then makes it an illegal hit and that is what he was penalized for. As far Hartnell getting his hair pulled, It was Adams not Crosby. I am not happy with crosby's display yesterday, but don't put something on him that he didn't do. Also we all are sitting here making assumptions about what was happening on the ice. We always don't see everything on the ice watching at home. Alot goes on off camera and we definately don't hear what is being said."

Yes I agree with this statemnt also

anyways the pens are losing and are not playing the way they did in regular season to be the #4 seed, so they must get better or its over,
painful for me to say that but its true

[GrimUSMC]

Yes the announcers said it was a clean hit. but they were wrong. If Martin was alone along the boards yes it would of been a clean hit. But he was engaged with another player which then makes it an illegal hit and that is what he was penalized for. As far Hartnell getting his hair pulled, It was Adams not Crosby. I am not happy with crosby's display yesterday, but don't put something on him that he didn't do. Also we all are sitting here making assumptions about what was happening on the ice. We always don't see everything on the ice watching at home. Alot goes on off camera and we definately don't hear what is being said. With that being said, the flyers not only beat the pens on the score board they are in their heads. And unless the pens start playing hockey and stop focusing on retaliating they might as well set tee times instead of showing up on Wed. Because the series will be over for sure.

Thats right, everyone was wrong. You clearly are right that Schenn committed a penalty thats not even in the rule book. the announcers who have watched much more hockey then either of us, say its was a clean hit, but they are wrong. People in the arena, who watched the play and clearly saw no call was made until after Asham got his goon on are all wrong. You are the example of why people do not think very highly of Penguins fans.

And rewind to before the part where Adams jumps Hartnell. Hartnell was skating away and Crosby grabs Hartnell from behind. Thats what caused all of that. But of course, Crosby wanted no parts of Hartnell and Adams jumped him from behind. Typical of the entire Penguins team.

I am the one that posted that Schenn refused to square up with Crosby. Near the end of the third period, NBC had the camera on both of them and Crosby was challenging him and Schenn refused. I read his lips- it was plain as day. As for Neal and Asham, believe me, they are not innocent- I just think what they did needed to be done. This stuff goes back a few years to now, and it's equally done on both sides. Richards intentionally running Fleury, Hartnell biting Letang, Schenn cross-checking Crosby in the BACK, after the whistle when Crosby was gliding, the hit on Martin. The Pens figured this is as good of time as any to try and even the score, but now the Flyers and their fans are crying. Believe me, they will try to get their revenge too. By the way, Schenn didn't play like this in juniors. This is the Flyers mantra- they have Broad Street Bullied him up and it's showing.

You are out of your mind. Schenn would love to beat Crosby's face in. Its convenient that Crosby runs his mouth and takes swings when the linesman is there but is quiet when the linesman is not.

And by your logic, if we send Rinaldo out to clip Crosby in the head, thats whats called for right? Be careful what you wish for because someone is going to get your "captain" if the team keeps taking runs at other peoples players.

[ChuckNorrisFearsS]

As a diehard Pens fan I've thought about the series and yesterday's game and formed some thoughts.

1) The way the Pens players acted yesterday was ridiculous. Lets understand Philly in no way is angelic but the way the Pens players acted was just disappointing to see as a really diehard fan. You're getting crushed and having your arses handed to you...PLAY! Don't resort to taking stupid cheap shots like Neal did. I give Letang credit. He'd had enough, went with a guy willing, and whooped up on him. He's about the only one I can side with. Just really disappointing to see our team act that way.

2) Worst end to a season in team history. After battling through a RIDICULOUS number of injuries to go down...rather LAY down is just inexcusable. You watch a team all year and then they just roll over like this. Its not a fun watch for a fan.

3) Malkin...you make 8.7 a year. I don't care how tough they are on defense against you, you gotta produce.

4) Sid...act like you have in the past as the captain and LEAD. Period. I've always defended him against the "he's a whiner and a baby" but he did little to help me argue against this after yesterday aside from scrapping with Giroux a bit.

5) Fleury...well...enough said. He's been mentally broken in this series and it shows.

Oy....such a crappy feeling to see a season end like this.

[Wickabee]

"Engaged" may not be in the rule book. But it has been used when referring to plays like this. I believe Shanahan has used this word in his detailed explanations of similar plays. With new focus on player safety hitting someone while "engaged" with another player is dangerous and warrants a penalty which is what Schenn got penalized for.

If that was how it is, the Brown would be facing suspension for hitting Sedin. He was engaged in the play with someone else and Brown blindsided him.

As it stands, it was a good hit.

[pghin08]

As a diehard Pens fan I've thought about the series and yesterday's game and formed some thoughts.

1) The way the Pens players acted yesterday was ridiculous. Lets understand Philly in no way is angelic but the way the Pens players acted was just disappointing to see as a really diehard fan. You're getting crushed and having your arses handed to you...PLAY! Don't resort to taking stupid cheap shots like Neal did. I give Letang credit. He'd had enough, went with a guy willing, and whooped up on him. He's about the only one I can side with. Just really disappointing to see our team act that way.

2) Worst end to a season in team history. After battling through a RIDICULOUS number of injuries to go down...rather LAY down is just inexcusable. You watch a team all year and then they just roll over like this. Its not a fun watch for a fan.

3) Malkin...you make 8.7 a year. I don't care how tough they are on defense against you, you gotta produce.

4) Sid...act like you have in the past as the captain and LEAD. Period. I've always defended him against the "he's a whiner and a baby" but he did little to help me argue against this after yesterday aside from scrapping with Giroux a bit.

5) Fleury...well...enough said. He's been mentally broken in this series and it shows.

Oy....such a crappy feeling to see a season end like this.

I agree with everything except your point on Letang. He needs to know better than to drop the gloves in that situation. He chose to be tossed out. He's WAY to valuable to needlessly take himself out of the game in the first period.

[GrimUSMC]

I agree with everything except your point on Letang. He needs to know better than to drop the gloves in that situation. He chose to be tossed out. He's WAY to valuable to needlessly take himself out of the game in the first period.

Why exactly were they tossed? It looked like every other after the whistle scrum/fight I have ever seen. A friend told me it was by rule, so what exactly was the rule?

And yes, Letang beat Timonen down. He won that one.

[ChuckNorrisFearsS]

Why exactly were they tossed? It looked like every other after the whistle scrum/fight I have ever seen. A friend told me it was by rule, so what exactly was the rule?

And yes, Letang beat Timonen down. He won that one.

That's one I've been wondering. I didn't think either would get the game but they did. I thought it was a legit scrap but...

Another thing I will say, and it pains me, but I'll give Philly's upper management credit as for the changes they made in terms of trades they sure as heck made it work.

[FlyerGuy22]

As a diehard Pens fan I've thought about the series and yesterday's game and formed some thoughts.

1) The way the Pens players acted yesterday was ridiculous. Lets understand Philly in no way is angelic but the way the Pens players acted was just disappointing to see as a really diehard fan. You're getting crushed and having your arses handed to you...PLAY! Don't resort to taking stupid cheap shots like Neal did. I give Letang credit. He'd had enough, went with a guy willing, and whooped up on him. He's about the only one I can side with. Just really disappointing to see our team act that way.

2) Worst end to a season in team history. After battling through a RIDICULOUS number of injuries to go down...rather LAY down is just inexcusable. You watch a team all year and then they just roll over like this. Its not a fun watch for a fan.

3) Malkin...you make 8.7 a year. I don't care how tough they are on defense against you, you gotta produce.

4) Sid...act like you have in the past as the captain and LEAD. Period. I've always defended him against the "he's a whiner and a baby" but he did little to help me argue against this after yesterday aside from scrapping with Giroux a bit.

5) Fleury...well...enough said. He's been mentally broken in this series and it shows.

Oy....such a crappy feeling to see a season end like this.

And he didn't go with a guy who was willing. Kimmo got in Sid's face for knocking Voracek's glove away and Letang grabbed him from behind.
1000+ regular season games plus playoffs and that was the first 'fight' in Timmo's career and it only happened cuz Letang jumped him (had to swing him around a pull his jersey over his head before he landed a punch too, but I guess we'll call that fighting). I wonder if he called Talbot after the game to give credit for the finger to the mouth or ask him why it didn't work.

[abls10]

I conceed. All I was saying was the flyers were the better team. Even through all that went on they kept their composure enough to play hockey and win the game. We can sit here for days and debate who did what first, we all know there is bad blood between these two teams and there are no angels on either side. I can admit to my teams faults and their lack of composure. The flyers are the better team, but their are not the saintly team that you guys are defending. They just were able to keep it from affecting the outcome of the game.