The Better D-Man

[chakhae1]

the chara fans make me laugh. chara is a freak of nature and a lot of things revolve around his size and you can't make him seem like the best defencman in the league anymore b/c he just simply isn't. i'll give you this much that he is perhaps one of the most intimidating d men in the league and coaches still have to coach around him, but skill wise, i don't think he ever had much.

take a look of when the b's put him in front of the net on the pp. is it b/c he's loaded with skill? no it's b/c he's huge and no one can move him. is he known to have anything revolved around skill? fastest skater? no. hardest shot? yes, but again b/c he's so damn big. his biggest asset is his size and that's that.

[Blmdear]

This year I think Weber is doing better. But 2 years ago (and for 1/2 the year last year before he was hurt) I would take Karlsson over any of the others. I also think he is on his way back and will be in old form by next year (lets cut your foot off and see how long it takes to come back lol)

I still find him to be one of the most exiting players in the league.

As for the comments about him making more mistakes and costing the team way more than he makes good plays. Watch him for an entire season. I have jumped off my seat with a fist pump probable 90% more than I have said some choice words while watching him.

All I know is I watch hockey to be entertained and that kid does that all the time. After all he is the best skater since Bobby Orr (Don't attack me. It was Phil Esposito that said it lol)

Im not going to bash you on your opinion or the comparison between Karlsson and Orr. Karlsson is a GREAT skater! Im not going to take his skating, offensive ability away from him. When Ottawa is on offense, he is a very exciting player!!.....but, he has never been a true D man even before the injury. He does come away with some nice defensive plays because of his risk taking but he also gets left out to dry many, many times. I was actually looking for takaway/giveaway stats on Karlsson and ran into this arcticle. Sums his whole career up.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j...RHsv_muIxFAZMw

[Blmdear]

"The guy has great positioning, and routinely pokes the puck off another player's stick or just outright steals it away from him. In fact, he's 3rd among defensemen in takeaways. The closest to him out of any of the guys you've mentioned is Duncan Keith, who is 10 behind Karlsson."

Giveaway leader board. G GAW

1	Erik Karlsson	OTT	59	81	1.37	3.02
2	Niklas Hjalmarsson	CHI	60	75	1.25	3.52
3	Taylor Hall	EDM	53	75	1.42	4.29
4	Joe Thornton	SJ	59	69	1.17	3.66
5	Phil Kessel	TOR	60	69	1.15	3.40
6	P.K. Subban	MON	59	65	1.10	2.64
7	Dustin Byfuglien	WPG	60	64	1.07	2.64
8	Jeff Petry	EDM	58	63	1.09	3.02
9	Drew Doughty	LA	59	63	1.07	2.47
10	Ryan Getzlaf	ANH	56	59	1.05	3.01

[hossa18sens]

I agree he make several errors a game but he has the speed and skill to recover from them (most of the time lol)

I just think back to when he came into the league and he made a pile of errors. The Norris winning year he cut the errors down by about 80%. I think he gets in trouble when he feels like the team isn't doing well and the feels like he has to do the "extra" stuff. Then he starts pushing and that is where most of his errors come from.

Any way we can pick up Weber and get them together? lol

[hossa18sens]

"The guy has great positioning, and routinely pokes the puck off another player's stick or just outright steals it away from him. In fact, he's 3rd among defensemen in takeaways. The closest to him out of any of the guys you've mentioned is Duncan Keith, who is 10 behind Karlsson."

Giveaway leader board. G GAW

1	Erik Karlsson	OTT	59	81	1.37	3.02
2	Niklas Hjalmarsson	CHI	60	75	1.25	3.52
3	Taylor Hall	EDM	53	75	1.42	4.29
4	Joe Thornton	SJ	59	69	1.17	3.66
5	Phil Kessel	TOR	60	69	1.15	3.40
6	P.K. Subban	MON	59	65	1.10	2.64
7	Dustin Byfuglien	WPG	60	64	1.07	2.64
8	Jeff Petry	EDM	58	63	1.09	3.02
9	Drew Doughty	LA	59	63	1.07	2.47
10	Ryan Getzlaf	ANH	56	59	1.05	3.01

I agree I wish he would give it up much less. I wish there was a stat to show how they recover after the giveaway. (Weber has some awesome giveaway numbers in almost as much ice time.)

I guess it comes down to does your offense more than offset your errors. I would say in his case it is a big time yes.


Oh and as a Mod on the site I love that this has been a great discussion thread without it becoming a fight fest. Well done folks

[WeberCollector6]

I agree I wish he would give it up much less. I wish there was a stat to show how they recover after the giveaway. (Weber has some awesome giveaway numbers in almost as much ice time.)

I guess it comes down to does your offense more than offset your errors. I would say in his case it is a big time yes.


Oh and as a Mod on the site I love that this has been a great discussion thread without it becoming a fight fest. Well done folks

I honestly did not think this thread would be 6 pages long!

[cygnusx1]

"The guy has great positioning, and routinely pokes the puck off another player's stick or just outright steals it away from him. In fact, he's 3rd among defensemen in takeaways. The closest to him out of any of the guys you've mentioned is Duncan Keith, who is 10 behind Karlsson."

Giveaway leader board. G GAW

1	Erik Karlsson	OTT	59	81	1.37	3.02
2	Niklas Hjalmarsson	CHI	60	75	1.25	3.52
3	Taylor Hall	EDM	53	75	1.42	4.29
4	Joe Thornton	SJ	59	69	1.17	3.66
5	Phil Kessel	TOR	60	69	1.15	3.40
6	P.K. Subban	MON	59	65	1.10	2.64
7	Dustin Byfuglien	WPG	60	64	1.07	2.64
8	Jeff Petry	EDM	58	63	1.09	3.02
9	Drew Doughty	LA	59	63	1.07	2.47
10	Ryan Getzlaf	ANH	56	59	1.05	3.01

In order to give it away, he must have had the puck in his possession, right? And was therefore probably moving it up the ice when he gave it away? Meaning he was on offence?

[Blmdear]

In order to give it away, he must have had the puck in his possession, right? And was therefore probably moving it up the ice when he gave it away? Meaning he was on offence?

Ummm.......right? That's why Dmen play defense. It works a lot better when your trying to get the puck to your wingers instead of hanging on to it and trying to do everything yourself. We can argue that Ottawa does or doesn't have the talent all day long but trust me, they have quite capable wingers. In my opinion they are full of talent. You will notice that the top 10 are scattered with offensive Dmen.

[cygnusx1]

Ummm.......right? That's why Dmen play defense. It works a lot better when your trying to get the puck to your wingers instead of hanging on to it and trying to do everything yourself. We can argue that Ottawa does or doesn't have the talent all day long but trust me, they have quite capable wingers. In my opinion they are full of talent. You will notice that the top 10 are scattered with offensive Dmen.

Yes, those offensive d-men pass the puck up to their wingers. Seeing as those d-men lead the breakout 90% of the time they are on the ice (because they are normally paired with a guy with not much offensive skill), they are more likely to have turnovers. An intercepted puck in the neutral zone when you still have three guys back is hardly an issue, and that's what the majority of those turnovers are.

[Blmdear]

I see we want to try to discredit the giveaways , and that's fine. You had mentioned he was second only to Keith on the takeaways? Are those just all awesome steals? No.the only reason I posted those is because stats had to be brought into these posts. Stats don't tell the whole story and that's a fact. But if we are using stats, takeaways are takeaways and giveaways are giveaways no matter the situation.

Yes, those offensive d-men pass the puck up to their wingers. Seeing as those d-men lead the breakout 90% of the time they are on the ice (because they are normally paired with a guy with not much offensive skill), they are more likely to have turnovers. An intercepted puck in the neutral zone when you still have three guys back is hardly an issue, and that's what the majority of those turnovers are.