Panini done?

[bprice]

There is a big difference between a hobby and a business.

Brian Price

[Wickabee]

I understand what you're saying, but back then you had a much smaller selection of products, and even the most expensive, only ran for $100 a box of so. The market, and specifically the target audience, has been completely redefined in the last 10-15 years or so. I used to love going into my local card shop and getting a $6 pack of 1996 SPX with one card in it hoping to pull that crazy rare autograph. No matter what your budget was, back in the day, you had access to pretty much all the products. Now, unless either you make good money, or are crazy into cards and spending beyond your means, it is hard to bust boxes of anything anyone would really want on the secondary market. I know what people mean when they say they dont collect for the money, but its very different when you love to collect, to accept that you have no shot at getting the best cards of the players you collect, unless you spend hundreds of dollars. That 1996 Spx pack I'd get back in the day had at least the hopes of landing one of the most sought after Gretzky auto's ( at the time). Now, good luck finding that sort of product. At best you'll get an over produced sticker auto that still looks like doodoo compared to the Ultimate's, Cup, Dominion, Superlative, etc.

1: What did a tank of gas cost back then? A quart of milk? A loaf of bread? Inflation does play into it, even in the secondary market.
2: There are other factors such as popularity, and a half season for people to ask themselves why they're paying hundreds or thousands of dollars on pictures with maybe a swatch or something is a dangerous thing and it hurt the market big. I noticed a lot of sellers are trying to fool themselves into thinking prices will come up for some reason, and not following the market down after following it up for so, so long. When the cards don't sell, they're getting frustrated and stopping altogether, or completely overreacting like buddy destroying cards on ebay. If the seller allow their prices to come down with the market, the market will come back.

[ChuckNorrisFearsS]

Brian, I don't think anyone here is trying to run a business through breaking boxes/cases and reselling the singles. It's people who just aren't quite OK dropping a sizeable chunk of change at minimal chance of return.

The long and short of it is this; if a product that costs X can result in X/10 the supply far outweighs demand. If the they were more in line there wouldn't be such a surplus of products a year old or older sitting in warehouses and declining steadily in price.

Novel idea, instead of the same products year in and year out with the same players in the same sets in the same numbers what do you guys think about a rotating crop of products? Say 3 year cycles maybe. Using Ice and Artifacts as examples consider if in 13/14 both came out as deeper products with a little more thought into them. The following year SPx and SPA, the following had Trilogy and BD. Any thoughts on this as a way to keep things feeling a little fresher?

[Tanguay]

Personnally, looking at just the cards itself, I like Panini better. I think they do a better job to come with nice designs, are not afraid to try new things etc.. The look is better IMO.

Only thing that is bad with them is the value Beckett gives to them and the secondary market sales. And I don't know why the secondary market is bad for them.

I guess we'll see soon what will happen, but i'd hate it if Panini looses their license ! Since they arrived with a license, I saw a difference with UD, they we're trying harder with their releases. And THAT is good.

Alex

[mikeydcalgary]

The issue here is that they are going to follow the money. Look simply at the Industry Summit changes. It went from a meeting of the sports card industry to a meeting of the 'licensed' sports card industry. Now, I'm not much of one for conspiracy theory, but look at the bottom line - ITG and Leaf are both out (manufacture unlicensed product). ITG does have a license from the CHL (not a sponsor of the Industry Summit). Panini manufacturers unlicensed baseball cards and licensed hockey (as well as others) - MLB is not an Industry Summit sponsor, but the NHL and NHLPA both are. It's not conspiracy, it's math... Businesses follow $$$.

I've said it before, if we hobbyists wait for a business to determine the direction for our hobby, we're screwed. We should really initiate a Collector's Summit and determine how to take back control of our hobby. There was a time when Beckett was a 'report' on pricing and didn't 'dictate' value. There was a time when collector's knew what they wanted and didn't wait to be told... I think we can return to that, if we're willing to make a leap or three.

Umm....really. MLB is actually a sponsor of the Summit and threw the opening night event last year. Just to clear up your facts.

[mikeydcalgary]

I am going to offer up something here. Card companies cannot guarantee ROI. They do not control the secondary market. They may put a minimum 50% ROI based on costs in each box, we will never know. Each player costs a different amount to sign and some cost way more than they are worth. The only way for people to ever stop complaining will be the day that the manufacturers stop making boxes and just post the cards online and the first one with a credit card in hand can have any card from each set.

[Fred Bear]

Umm....really. MLB is actually a sponsor of the Summit and threw the opening night event last year. Just to clear up your facts.

Maybe last year, but here is this year's corporate sponsor list...

http://theindustrysummit.com/corporate-partners.php

MLB is NOT there (as of 2/24), just to clear up your facts...

[pwaldo]

Believe me the Football Exclusive is being neatly contested.

You'd be surprised to hear who is in the lead.

Brian Price

Interesting. Thanks for the info. I know some people who are not going to be happy about that.

[sedinfan]

Starting to wonder if Panini's given up on answering customer service emails in advance of the upcoming licensing changes? Even though they can't seem to come through on their years-old redemptions (despite showing off new hard-signed cards of the Sedins on their blog) they at least used to answer emails promptly... in the past couple months I've sent 5 emails and my last reply over a month ago was they were 'checking into it'. Anyone else have luck getting through to Panini recently, or should I give up hope at this point?

[RGM81]

Just as a heads-up, the announcement is expect to be made tomorrow, according to my grapevine.