Idea - to deter or stop patch forging!

[dahabsfan]

that would again require them to print an additonal card for the card....donruss offers an authentication program where they scan the front and back of higher end patch cards and you can view the cards on their website by using the authentication number ...probably one of the most cost effictive ways to do something like youre asking

The Donruss program doesn't work that easy. They simply have a traceless marking system. You cannot verify anything yourself, card has to be sent to them (along with payment for their "service") and if deemed bogus they then mark the card as "Not Original Production" and return it to you. Sounds good but now you've got the potential of losing any ebay/paypal refund because you can no longer return the item in the same state it was purchased. Ebay/paypal do not give one care about fake/altered cards even if you can prove it in 99% of cases.


If it's legit they then encapsulate and log the card which can then be verified as authentic via the authentication number. You cannot verify anything before hand unless it's been previously sent in by someone (I've yet to see anybody actually use this system thats been available since 2007).

It's a system but it's a very poor one at that, requiring payment by user and really does nothing to protect the singles buyer.


As for the idea of covering the swatches with plastic or other material - it's pointless. The big boys in the faking game are not pulling the swatches out and replacing - the cards are being seperated, swapped out, then reassembled.

[xirxious]

Its not that hard at all. I worked for a food manufacturer and to test product tracability, they put a serial lot # on each jar (it was just a time stamp/date) and it went through a digital camera and was activated by a micro switch. 5500 cases a shift as 12 jars a case went through with no problems and each one was tracable. This was over 14 years ago when digicams were not real cheap yet.
THeir whole assy line is automated. At one point just the patches would need to pass under them. They could even have a certification program, charge us $2 per patch and recoup the expense. I feel they already make enough $$, but if I'm pitching them the idea.....
The best way is to talk them into a class action lawsuit.

Scanning every patch that matches the Serial Number, and keeping a record of each patch on file would not be that costly to a card company. There is no price too high to maintain your professional integrity. I don't think UD cares.

If they cared, they would hand deliver Redemption Autos to the player, and then have the player sign all of them over the course of an hour before they left. Why they send cards out, only to risk having them damaged or the player not signing or taking 2 years to do so, boggles my mind.

Bad R & D prior to marketing.

[TheBoxBreaker]

Maybe they could do this:

When a set of cards has been produced, they could take each patch card and take a picture of it, clearly showing the print number and patch. Then, they could publish the pictures on their webpage and collectors could check cards.

This would be an easy way for the company to ensure that the collector doesn't end up buying or trading for a fake card. It's also cheap, and doesn't require too much work.

LMK what you think.

[The Germinator]

Maybe they could do this:

When a set of cards has been produced, they could take each patch card and take a picture of it, clearly showing the print number and patch. Then, they could publish the pictures on their webpage and collectors could check cards.

This would be an easy way for the company to ensure that the collector doesn't end up buying or trading for a fake card. It's also cheap, and doesn't require too much work.

LMK what you think.

Good idea but will never happen.
Way too much work for some company to do this.

[RGM81]

Maybe they could do this:

When a set of cards has been produced, they could take each patch card and take a picture of it, clearly showing the print number and patch. Then, they could publish the pictures on their webpage and collectors could check cards.

This would be an easy way for the company to ensure that the collector doesn't end up buying or trading for a fake card. It's also cheap, and doesn't require too much work.

LMK what you think.

Think about a set like Artifacts, which has an incredible number of patch variations. Brian Gionta has 11 different patch cards in the set, with print runs ranging from 5 to 50. If I got all the numbers right that's 310 images to scan/photograph and then upload to a server. That's one player. The player checklists in these sets run anywhere from 49 to 60 cards.

There is a ton of work that would be involved in such a thing, from having people do the layouts of the cards for photographing/scanning purposes, verifying that the photos are usable, uploading the images to a server, creating the database, running the scripts to make sure everything works, and so on. All of this requires many people to be paid. To do something so labour-intensive that would be utilized by such a small percentage of collectors is simply not cost-effective.

[TheBoxBreaker]

Good idea but will never happen.
Way too much work for some company to do this.

Thanks, I guess you're right.

[TheBoxBreaker]

Think about a set like Artifacts, which has an incredible number of patch variations. Brian Gionta has 11 different patch cards in the set, with print runs ranging from 5 to 50. If I got all the numbers right that's 310 images to scan/photograph and then upload to a server. That's one player. The player checklists in these sets run anywhere from 49 to 60 cards.

There is a ton of work that would be involved in such a thing, from having people do the layouts of the cards for photographing/scanning purposes, verifying that the photos are usable, uploading the images to a server, creating the database, running the scripts to make sure everything works, and so on. All of this requires many people to be paid. To do something so labour-intensive that would be utilized by such a small percentage of collectors is simply not cost-effective.

Yeah, I see what you mean. They could also just take pics of the best patches, but that would still end up taking some time and work, so that wouldn't work either.

Do you think that they'll come up with a solution to patch card faking in the future? Maybe...

[The Germinator]

Yeah, I see what you mean. They could also just take pics of the best patches, but that would still end up taking some time and work, so that wouldn't work either.

Do you think that they'll come up with a solution to patch card faking in the future? Maybe...

ITG has done it with ITG Ultimate already.

That's about it...

[RGM81]

I do think that there is a solution out there. Whether it's encapsulating the GU material under a thin layer of acetate, "framing" the piece under another layer of cardboard (similar to what Panini's doing with the rookie jerseys/patches in Crown Royale), or other means to see to it that any attempt to remove the original piece would irreparably damage the card - all that remains to be seen.

Panini's got their authentication service with the Prime stuff through Kodak. That is a start point, but really only allows people to get a definitive answer one way or the other. If the card has already been doctored, they're stuck with it unless they can take steps with eBay or elsewhere. To actually make it impossible to forge patches would be the ultimate endgame but something that would probably be cost-prohibitive to do unless we want to pay more for our hockey cards.

[PattyLafontaine]

The solution would be some sort of chemical added to the patch that shows a serial number on the patch when the card is in the dark. The serial number could be stored in UD's database for verification