Results 41 to 50 of 65
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02-20-2005, 12:55 PM #41
Yanksfan - I now wish I had saved the pics of the 2 cards in question to my computer, so I could repost them up here. If you compared the back of the Wagner in the first auction link with the back image of the nicer of the 2 cards posted by the OP, the stains and wear were exactly the same. The front looked like it was a slightly different color, but that could have just been lighting in the pics. Or the fact that in the auction pic, the card is in a screw down, and the one posted here was not in the screw down. There were far too many similarities, and no differences that were obvious. The second one has exactly all the same creases, the same severity of creases, and in the same places. If you notice the pics are gone today. The OP realized that they had been busted. You'll notice, there was no defense to what I said, but that the pics were removed.
I assure you, I would not have posted the links here to those auctions, if I was not 100% certain these were the same cards. I spent a couple hours researching, and making sure that I was correct before posting. I do not like accusing people of things, but when the facts speak for themselves.
I dislike very much forgeries, fakes, reprints made to look real, and frauds. They ruin the hobby for everyone else. There are a million of them on ebay, and I hope they keep them off the trading forums. These frauds make hundreds and thousands of dollars a month on unsuspecting buyers, who think they are just getting a great deal on a Mantle RC, Wagner T206, Mays RC, Jordan RC, Orr RC, as well as many others. Anybody in their right mind would have an authentic graded. A raw Mantle RC in NM cond. will sell on eBay for a few hundred dollars, whether it's authentic or not. A graded one, even a PSA 1 will bring well over $1,000, because being graded, by a good grading comapny, people know it's authentic. People would rather have a poor condition known authentic card, than a NM that is a questionable or outright fake. So why even bother selling a known authentic card without getting it graded? It don't make any sense at all, when knowing that if it is graded it is going to bring five or ten times the amount of money. The only purpose I can see for selling an ungraded beat up old card, of one of these great cards, is to deceive someone that they are getting the real deal. By the time they realize it is fake, it's probably too late. All of these sellers offer no guarantee's, card is original but has to be sold as a reprint because it is not graded, private bidder id's, private feedback, all sales final. The list of red flags goes on and on.
What I think happened, and this is just my assumption. I think the OP purchased these cards on eBay, thinking they were the real deal. Paid $511, and $711 for each of these 2 cards. Then when the cards arrived, it was realized they had been sold fakes. Angry because they had been scammed on eBay, probably could not get their money back, decided to try and pass it off on a trading board to someone who is unsuspecting.
Or, maybe they know enough that these were not real cards, instead they were reprints, or outright counterfeit. They thought they could make a profit on them anyway.
What they did not expect, was some of the people on this trading forum to be wise to these cards. Unforunately for the OP, most of the people on this thread knew from the get go there was something not right here. Fortunately for the ones who don't know, there are enough people here that won't tolerate fakes and forgeries.
All the OP could use as a defense was, "you best to think rationally before jumping to unmerrited conclusions", and "well to the number of people calling me a lier and saying only one exists well check out the attached pics and you will see i really do have the card as well i have 2 so so much for the only one exists i got these from an estate of someoen who is well up in there ages so to you who say seeing is believing well there you go"
Then, I had thought rationally, and come to the conclusion that the OP never thought anyone would take the time to check that far into it. If they came from an estate of an older person, how come they have both sold on eBay in the last month from two different sellers? One of the sellers has sold 5 different Wagners, 2 different Mantle RC's, and 1 Mays Bowman RC that they had to pull the auction on because of authenticity I am sure. None of them graded, and all of them being sold as is, no guarantee. If there are only 50 to 60 known copies to exist, how is it that this one seller has 5 different, none graded, and no one has heard about it? Yopu would think that if one person possessed 5 examples of the real card, it would be all over the news, and in Beckett. Infact two of the auctions stated, card came back ungradeable. Why is it then, that after I posted the links to the auctions, the pics from the OP disappeared? Is it because they realized that they had been called out on this with hard facts? I bet it is, but now no one can see because the OP pulled the pics. I guess I forgot to do one more bit of homework myself, I should have saved those pics.
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02-20-2005, 01:06 PM #42
Impressive... did you happen to catch the date the items were listed on ebay?
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02-20-2005, 01:16 PM #43
Yanksfan - The first auction ended on feb. 5th. that was for the nicer of the two cards. The second, the creased card, ended on Feb. 12th. I thought that since the OP was in Canada, maybe it was to recent for them to actually have the card. However, I noticed that the second one was sold by a seller in Canada. Plenty of time for a card to get to the OP if they paid right away.
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02-20-2005, 01:18 PM #44
SCF's own inspector gadget right there...
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02-20-2005, 01:21 PM #45
i happened to save one of the pics.
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02-20-2005, 01:21 PM #46
LOL tutall. I just don't like fake cards, or the people who try to pass them off to unsuspecting buyers or traders. Nothing will ruin the hobby faster for someone new, than to be taken by a scammer. I want new people in the hobby. It's hard enough to get someone to begin in the hobby, and even harder for them to keep their interest. All it takes is one expensive rip off, and that could very well wreck their hobby interests. I look at it this way, today's beginner's are tomorrow's buyer's.
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02-20-2005, 01:22 PM #47
Awesome. Thanks Fordman. Saving it right now myself. Anybody get the other pics by chance?
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02-20-2005, 01:24 PM #48
I think he hit this one on the nose... the background does look too reddish-orange.
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02-20-2005, 01:26 PM #49
Originally Posted by Fordman7795
That is the pic that has the American Beauty back which right there tells you that the card is a fake. I posted the link to the T206 museum website that says what backs the Wagner came with and the American Beauty wasn't one of them.
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02-20-2005, 01:26 PM #50
Dang, my computer will not allow me to save this one for some reason.
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