Results 31 to 40 of 51
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04-04-2012, 12:25 PM #31
OHHH MANNN, ain't THAT the truth hahahahaaa!!!!
Personally I don't care what happens, my collection is full, other than McDonalds jerseys and autos. And to be fair, I'd like to thank Panini for the autos of the Slap Shot players and for bringing Trevor Linden back into the fold. And to ITG for their neat sets and the occasional amazing Habs card I can't live without. This has always been a hobby for me, I've always bought high (as long as I could afford it) and sold low and never given it a second thought. I'm going to die with my collection and whatever happens to it after that is up to my kids I guess.
I'm here because like I said, I saw a problem with how things are. I loves hockey cards too :)
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04-04-2012, 12:58 PM #32
I'm going to respectfully disagree... (and get on the soap box for a moment)
An 'open discussion about improvements' to the hobby has to be just that - positive in nature and looking for where to go. I'm all for it. If/when the discussion sours, the folks who can/will make the improvements tune out. It's simple human psychology. A man wiser than me once said, 'if you're not part of the solution, you are part of the problem.' If you want to point out a problem, fine. Help solve it. I can see the OPs thesis - 'There are too many plain jersey cards available.' Offer the companies an out - how do you fix 'too many jersey cards'?
'Hobby slamming' is what this thread is plain and simple. I just read through 3 pages up to this point and most posts are just venting and complaining or tongue-in-cheek responses. Not a big deal and I'm not pointing it out to criticize, but it's a waste of time and we all know that because we've read (and posted) the 1300 previous threads about the same (or slight variation) topics and still we complain when we pull white-swatch jersey cards of 4th liners and 3rd line AHLers who got a 2-game call up last season in our box breaks...
As the saying goes... 'the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.' Manufacturers use autos, inserts, parallels, jerseys and memorabilia cards to enhance the perceived value of a product. There are those that buy, don't buy and purchase singles, and those that don't buy at all... All correctly! If you disagree with something, quit supporting it and move on. It's quite frustrating to hear the same old when-I-hit-my-thumb-with-the-hammer-it-hurts stories... The OP bought a pile of cards... and then complains that they have no value?!?!? Then why did you buy them? Think about it for a minute... if you bought them and it was a 'steal', then they are more valuable than what you paid... if you bought them and they are worthless, then you wasted money... Are you upset that others don't value cards the way you do or are you mad that you just wasted $17? I just don't get it anymore...
Collecting is a choice that each one of us makes. If you don't like or enjoy something about it, quit doing it or at the very least try to figure out how to make it enjoyable to you and PLEASE focus on those aspects. You may not enjoy jersey/patch/memorabilia cards and that's ok, but that doesn't mean there is nobody collecting them. You know who loves jersey cards? Kids and newer collectors who don't have 1-5-10 two-color Crosby patches...
Before the local shop closed, I had the same argument with another patron at every pack wars... Quit talking about value, at least with the kids and new guys. He would whine/complain/whatever every time he opened a pack without a hit and he was the first to tell you that your insert/auto/jersey was selling for 99 cents on eBay. It's unfun... for everyone... but moreso for the new guys and kids who are just collecting for fun. His opinion soured more than one kid from collecting 'because cards aren't worth my money.'
In my opinion, we place too much emphasis on 'value' and not enough on enjoyment. I started collecting for the enjoyment of it, not because it was going to pay for my kids to go to college one day - wasn't thinking that far ahead as a 6-yr old. I've cycled a few times ;), I've made some money, I've lost more money, and I'm back in it for the enjoyment of the sport and the hobby. I hope one day everyone in this thread finds a way to enjoy this hobby for themselves because I don't think it's going to die. I also don't think 4th liner jersey cards are going to go away... and there will be more and more 1/1 NHL Shield patches every year.
Sorry for my please-quit-ranting-about-the-hobby rant. I'll head back under my rock...
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04-04-2012, 01:27 PM #33
Sage words, however the most collected Issued Pack is not 5 cents and a free stick of gum, it's bordering on $700.00.
I also love how they now call something with 5 cards a Box. Lol. That is still a pack, sorry.
A Hockey box has 16 or more packs inside, not one.
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04-04-2012, 01:47 PM #34
Ok, for the record............ I thought the cards were a steal. The Brodeur card is beautiful and goes in my PC, the Lemieux insert is PC, the Flames is for a buddy and the Hull is also beautiful and PC.
The problem is that they were a steal, because of over-production. So you want something constructive? Here..................
Each licensed company gets one low-end, two or three mid and one insane-o product per year. ITG can do what they want, they seem to have found that thin line. That means there's enough choice and enough demand to actually sustain the hobby.
Will this happen? Heck no!! The companies are in business to squeeze every penny out of us they can. So, as a hockey-card collector and not the CEO of Upper Deck or Panini, all I can do is whine and moan. The "hobby" as it exists today only exists because of the perceived value of the product. If we want to keep collecting in the future, enough of us have to whine and moan so that someone listens. At least that's where I'm coming from............
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04-04-2012, 02:23 PM #35
I think the disparity here is coming from perception.
I think I'm looking at this the same way sluggo was - yeah, these cards are a steal, heck even in the current market that's a good find - but these are elite players. These are the guys who you're hoping you find when you crack a box if you don't find PC players.
I would rather there be more.... competition? for the product. I would rather there be better balance between money spent vs investment, not necessarily resale. The overproduction of product means that it's not just hard to make any money back, but even to find people to trade with. I've got a bunch of /10s and /20s sitting in my collection that I don't care about - and I can't do anything with them because the only way I can get "value" for them is to swap them 1:1 for PC items with similar print runs. The market will pay me the value of a pack for my box/case hit, and if I trade for traders, there's no guarantee I won't just be sitting on those instead anymore.
I picked up a Crosby SPGU triple jersey at one point. Don't even remember what I traded for it. Figured that getting a good PC item or decent sale value was a sure thing... it's still sitting in the cabinet.
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04-04-2012, 03:46 PM #36
I agree that you found a steal, especially if it's something to put in your PC. I disagree that it's necessarily due to over-production. I'll come back to this in a minute...
I don't blame ITG/Panini/UD for the amount of or number of product they produce. It's a numbers game. Say collectors spend, cumulatively, $X million. If there were only half the number of products, collectors would only spend $X/2 million. Bottom line - that shrinks the hobby. Has nothing to do with 'value' or anything else. The manufacturers try to produce enough, different products that we continue to spend $X million this year and then increase to $X+Y million next year which grows the hobby (either through new sales or purchases of past product).
We whine and moan because that doesn't do anything for us as individual collectors in the short term. They aren't making our collections more valuable today. I say, it's not their job - that's ours. We can make our collections more valuable.
This is exactly right! Perception clouds our views. We perceive our experience as that of everyone, but I think we have to learn to get past that. We all point to 'over-production', but products have to be over-produced (to a point). How will collectors in 10 years get the cards we all have holed up in our collections? By necessity, more than are needed today have to be produced to keep the hobby alive for years to come.
But you are right, there should be more competition for individual cards. I'll loop back to the OPs comments above and I won't blame over-production. I think the lack of local market for some cards is the problem!
I think this is the real opportunity for shops and sharp business folks. Buy NJ Devils in Vancouver and sell them in New Jersey. Buy Red Wings in Southern California and sell them in Michigan. You know, grow the hobby by re-distributing the cards to where they can be popular and create hobby excitement. Those 4th liner jersey cards come in handy for local shops (in those markets) to generate interest in the hobby and once they are hooked, they're more willing to buy a HOFer game-used card out of a high-end product! [I know it's not that easy or simple, but the premise is no less true.]
And that's how we make our collections more valuable - generate more interest in the hobby (preferably positive). Tell people where you found great buys, not to complain about over-production, but to send more buyers to the good shops! It won't happen in a day, week, or even in a year and there are definitely products (and cards) that it will likely never happen for (I'm looking at you 1990-91 products), but I choose to believe that if we grow the hobby, we can eventually get someone excited for the No-Namer Coyotes 4th Liner/Scratch white patch /15 card that I always seem to pull in 'high-end' product. If not, at least I'm going to enjoy my time trying...
But that's just my opinion...
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04-04-2012, 04:15 PM #37
Interesting thread. I am a life long basketball card and autograph collector that just bought his very first box of hockey cards last weekend (2 boxes of Luxury Suite). My 5-year-old son and I have become avid Caps fans so he really wanted to collect hockey stuff and give basketball a break (with the lockout that wasn't too hard.) First we got the Panini sticker album, some mini-Fat Heads for his room and then a few packs of cheap cards. After constant nagging, I finally broke down at a card show and busted a couple of boxes and had an absolute blast. We ripped into every pack with big smiles and were excited about whatever jersey we got. When we got stick/jersey cards, you would think from my son's reaction that he hit the lottery. It was so much fun I wanted to buy a third box before my wife stepped in and shut us down. I didn't think about value one time while we were ripping packs (only 8). We took them home and have been talking about trades ever since. Since these were technically my cards, he wanted to trade for my 1/10 Kyle Okposo stick/jersey card and wouldn't stop asking. After he offered me a Backstrom stick/jersey card, Semin jersey/patch, and Mike Green double jersey I said ok. Now that's a steal! Maybe its becuase it was our first hockey boxes or maybe its becuase he had the widest smile on his face possible, but I won't soon forget the experience. I collect cards because the disappointments only make the thrill of getting a good card that much better. If you aren't enjoy the hobby, I would be more than willing to rent you my son, but he will demand some good cards as payment.
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04-04-2012, 04:21 PM #38
+1 to what I bolded. That one is my absolute favorite. There was a guy like that at a shop I used to go to and it was terrible. I liked to compare him to that guy you see at the gas station spending $50 on scratch off tickets to find the $10 winner and then getting upset at the lottery commission.
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04-04-2012, 04:38 PM #39
Frank !!
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04-04-2012, 04:43 PM #40
This would be a great idea except for two things:
- This only works when the economy is in a place where people can afford it.
- The existence of the internet kills the ability to "sell high" locally.
I live in an area where I have access to a half a dozen LCS, plus 4 different Dave & Adam's locations. I'm in them relatively frequently, and I can tell you with certainty that the only time the Sabres singles move is when they are low print run or very unique swatches. The ability to buy cards from anywhere in the world at the click of a mouse pretty much makes everywhere "local."
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Originally Posted by Estovia 
